 Poster: A snowHead
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Firsly thanks to all for the brilliant response last week  . So are now booked to go but my remaining worry is the car and the tyres etc. We are due new tyres anyway in the next month so should be go for Winter Tyres or the All Season type. Any brand recommendations?
Best wishes
Lisa
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Winter tyres make a huge difference to the amount of traction that you get in poor driving conditions such as snow & ice, but they tend to wear down more quickly in warmer conditions because of the softer rubber compound. If you can afford to get a set of winter tyres for use during the winter and then swap them over to regular tyres when the spring arrives you will have the best of both worlds.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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lisach, I've been looking at winter tyres for this season and assuming I can get hold of a set I'm going for the Michelin Pilot Alpin, not cheap but they are speed rated up to 130 mph unlike some other brands which are limited speed wise which could be a pain on the drive down.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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lisach, this thread has lots of useful info, FWIW I have just fitted Pirelli Scorpions which were highly rated in the online reviews i could find.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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lisach, if you are going to invest in a set of winter tyres don't leave it too close to winter as they are not stocked by many tyre retailers in the UK because of low demand and you could have difficulty in getting hold of tyres you want at a sensible price.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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lisach, I suggest you drive down on your regular tyres and get winter tyres at the nearest big town to you. They're bound to be cheaper, and you won't have the hassle of using them on the motorway. Also - if the weather's good you won't have to bother at all. I've only had winter tyres once in 16 years, all with RWD cars with fat tyres - but then I didn't actually HAVE to drive if the weather was bad!
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lisach, If it is a one or two week thing then I would put a set of new ordinary tyres on and get some chains.
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Frosty the Snowman, hmm, this is where I am getting confused, yes its just a week and we are staying lowish and will drive or ideally bus to resort most days. Would a compromise be All Season tyres and chains?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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lisach, that may be a good compromise, yes.
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lisach, I would bet that 99% of those that drive from the UK do not change tyres for a one off trip. If there is lots of snow in resort then leave the chains on. Put tyres on the car to suit your most usual driving conditions.
Any problems that you come accross will come from numpties who have no chains or cant be bothered to fit them
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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lisach, I think it's a bit like insurance - it depends on your attitude to risk about the level of insurance you buy. I bought winter tyres last year. Like you I was in two minds about whether to get them or not. I eventually took the plunge (although leaving it late meant I could only get an expensive set from my local tyre dealer). They made a big difference in resort compared to other times when I've had regular tyres (didn't need to put on chains once, normally I do), but what really convinced me they were a good purchase was the drive back to the UK in a massive blizzard. The weather was atrocious, with lots of snow accumulating on the autoroute from about Lyon to almost as far as Calais. We just about got through, although the authorities were preparing to close the autoroutes later that day because of the number of cars and lorries crashing off the road. Every single mile of that journey I was deeply thankful that I'd decided to buy winter tyres, and I considered the £500 it cost me a good value-for-money purchase.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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lisach, I'd agree with the other posters above. We have driven to the alps half a dozen times now on 'normal' UK tyres and had to use snow chains just twice. The rest of the time our 'normal' tyres were just fine. However since I needed new tyres anyway, and the Pirellis are classed as 'All weather' (with a M + S Rating), I thought they would be worth a try, giving improved grip in the wet and snow, and maybe avoiding the need for chains in 'borderline' conditions at the cost of a slightly higher wear rate, Our local garage reckoned they would be good for a similar mileage to the Goodyears I was replacing anyway and at £75 each fitted and balanced they weren't ridiculously expensive.
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| Quote: |
they are not stocked by many tyre retailers in the UK because of low demand and you could have difficulty in getting hold of tyres you want at a sensible price.
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this is very true. I shopped around for a day on the phone last year, looking for Michelin Alpin, having found loads of websites of places which claimed to stock them. try blackcircles.co.uk - came up with the goods, and have a range of local tyre places which fit them for you. We were very glad to have them, but we are in the Alps all winter - I wouldn't bother for one week, but definitely practice fitting the chains, and you should be fine. The more you practice fitting the chains, the lower the chance of having to use them - one of those Murphy's law things. I am not 100% convinced by the "buy them locally" advice, because the guy who sells tyres in Sallanches assured us that we would only need 2, on the driving wheels, which is not really the best advice.
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You know it makes sense.
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Real winter tyres are softer and have "sips" which are micro zig zag grooves that trap the snow to increase traction. The softer compound does not last especially in hot condition in summer. True winter tyres are good for normal snow condition but will get into trouble if the snow is deep, to the point that the underside of the car is floating on snow.
The snow chains can get the vehicle much further by the "digging" action from the lonks.
A set of reasonably new all-season tyres plus a set of snow chains are possibly the best combination for UK skiers travelling to the Alps. Many all-season tyres also have sips but not as extensive as the winter tyres.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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www.mytyres.net have a good selection of winter/all season tyres and prices seem reasonable - also check your wheel size and clearance on the inside edge of the tyre to any suspension components then get good deals on chains from ebay. Our a6 on summer tyre size has 12mm max of clearance from a steering arm, we managed to pickup a set of Weissenfells with a special low profile specifically for this problem for less than £35 on ebay brand new. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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easiski, I agree about buying them on an as needed basis except for the space that the other tyres will take up in the car. Not sure what the hassle is of having winter tyres on on the motorway. I can't tell any difference.
lisach, If you can get a set of winter tyres at a reasonable price in the UK, you could of course just keep them on all winter with the advantage of extra grip below 7 degrees (or whatever it is).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Are you going driving in the alps or sking there? There is a fair chance that once you arrive in resort you will not use the car again untill you leave. You will be very unfortunate if you get snow for the whole journey and even if you did just think how good the conditions would bee when you got there!You are considering changing your tyres for a very small mileage when chains would do . P.S alloy rims do not like chains they can damage them!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
I would bet that 99% of those that drive from the UK do not change tyres for a one off trip. If there is lots of snow in resort then leave the chains on. Put tyres on the car to suit your most usual driving conditions.
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Count me in that 99% - I've driven to Alps 8 or 9 times now ranging from Xmas to April and have never had any problems. Use normal UK all season tyres and fit snowchains if appropriate. I've found the snow clearing in resorts to be exceptional, hardly surprising really as they want the punters, and I've only had to use chains twice.
If lived there or spent season there I would go for snow tyres, but for your one week trip, generally normal tyres are fine up to the point you turn of the autoroute.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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if you live in the alps or are going to be here for 6 months get snow tyres but you only need two on the drive wheels, unless you got rear wheel drive then you'll need 4 but you'll also need 4 selts of chains!
if you here for the holidays just get chains
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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snowangel., Interesting point re fitting snow tyres only to the drive wheels. I wondered about that myself but on the 'Snow Tyres thread' When I asked the question....
| AxsMan wrote: |
Our (two year old) Grand Voyager is looking like it will be in need of two new front tyres shortly. It takes 215/65 R16 (at least that's what's on it now). The tyres have all done 20,000 but the rears look like they have plenty of tread depth left.
My question is, if fitting snow tyres do I need to fit four or could I just put two on the front? I'm planning at least two weeks driving in the Alps this year, have driven before (used chains a couple of times) and do have a set of chains, but since I'm going to put new tyres on anyway I'm thinking a couple of snow tyres at the front could make sense? |
The answers were:
| boredsurfin wrote: |
AxsMan, No you MUST fit winter tyres to each wheel!
Details HERE |
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| Agenterre wrote: |
| AxsMan, No .. you'll end up in the ditch or worse ... |
So who's right? FWIW I fitted Pirelli Scorpions all round, and will be carrying snow chains for the drive wheels only.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| snowangel. wrote: |
if you live in the alps or are going to be here for 6 months get snow tyres but you only need two on the drive wheels, unless you got rear wheel drive then you'll need 4 but you'll also need 4 selts of chains!
if you here for the holidays just get chains |
Unless you prefer to spin when braking / going round corners and like getting into heated discussion with insurance companies, 4 winter tyres are what most sane people driving in the Alps during the winter use.
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Every year without fail a car driver from Poland, Czech, Hungary, Holland or maybe even Germany will be slipping and slidding all over an Austrian mountain approach road. His car will be packed to the brim with people and baggage. Mr Summer Tyres will hold up the traffic, there will be a few near misses as the cars coming down the hill who have just dropped people off almost hit cars who have to overtake him head on. He will probably end up having to purchase a very overpriced set of poor quality snow chains and fight to fit them while cars are struggling to avoid each other behind him. He will be totally ignorant to the chaos he has created.
Many people will struggle to drive past and think or utter "t#sser".
On the way home Mr summer tyres will be the first to get out his newly aquired snowchains. He will not be able to maintain the same speed as the cars in front with winter tyres and so will be leading a convoy, a long convoy that summertime caravan towers can only dream of creating. He was going to wait until somebody else put their snowchains on but ends up slipping and sliding on a blind bend. He ends up putting on the snow chains on this very blind bend and the chaos starts again. It still hasn't clicked and he blames the road chaos on the weather.
Further down the road the snow clears a little and the speed picks up. He either hasn't realised that there's a speed limit for his snowchains and speeds up until they self destruct damaging his car (resulting in him paying the higest price per mile for a set of snow chains ever). Or he realises the speed limit but decides he doesn't want to take the chains off because it might get worse. He drives at a much slower speed and again creates a convoy.
Many people will struggle to drive past and think or utter t#sser.
If he eventually gets home without
a) damaging the snow chains
b) ending up in a ditch / field.
c) Rear-ending the car in front
he will probably proudly say to his wife "See I knew I didn't really need winter tyres"
Without winter tyres, this could be you.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ski, And............ practice putting them on at home before you leave
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And...... keep a plastic sheet in the car to kneel on while fitting them. I don't use gloves because I end up having to take them off anyway.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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lisach, pop into you local car dealer for your make to see if they have a set of steel rims sitting on the shelf from someone who upgraded to alloys. I got a pair of Peugeot rims for £30 the pair and put Avon M&S on which stayed on the car from November to April and did the alps run.
That car is now sold and we no longer live in the coutry so less need (and we have got bored of driving after 8 times so fly and hire) but my wife spun the permanent 4wd Subaru on a bend I went round without slipping one black ice morning. She looked a bit sheepish facing the wrong way on the opposite verge as I arrived! 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| AxsMan wrote: |
| And...... keep a plastic sheet in the car to kneel on while fitting them. I don't use gloves because I end up having to take them off anyway. |
Have you tried using a pair of marigolds out of the kitchen? Not fantastic at insulating but they keep the hands clean and take the bite out of the cold.
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DB, Good suggestion, I'll nick a pair of Mrs Axs's and see how I get on
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You know it makes sense.
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boredsurfin, Helen Beaumont, and others mention standard type tyres, but with an M + S (Mud & Snow) rating. How effective are these in day to day alpine conditions and are they 'real' snow ratings?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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BernardC, ours were absolutely fine in deep snow, wet slush, and even black ice. We never used our snowchains, but did use the 4 wheel drive.
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Poster: A snowHead
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BernardC, I'd echo Helen Beaumont's view of great grip in anything from black ice to 6" of snow. There was a 1.9l diesel lump sitting on top of them though which I think is significant. Smaller lighter engines might reduce the grip.
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FAQ
- not waiting until you can't go any further 
, will help. You say you are going to France ? The roads up to most ski areas have 'Aire de Chainage' - laybys for you to park in whilst you fit them, and the police will stop you to fit them if required.
