Hands-free liftpasses: are they transferable between skiers? What's 'the law'?

A snowHead

The London Underground (and buses) now has a system - the Oyster card - which we're well familiar with on ski lifts. It's a credit card-sized card with a transponder and smart chip which opens barriers and (if you recharge it with payment) memorises the journeys you've taken, deducting payments. So it's actually more sophisticated than a liftpass.

Many people seem to swap Oyster cards, especially during a given day, since this potentially means two people can take advantage of the maximum charge to the card for a day's travel. I suspect that this is a breach of the terms of using the card, but I don't know.

Likewise, anyone using an electronic liftpass who stops at lunchtime could give the pass to someone else for a free afternoon's skiing - technically, but perhaps not legally.

Resorts like Val d'Isere have traditionally been very keen to spot people using other people's photo liftpasses, confiscating them (usually not returning them until the end of the day).

So, are lift companies now less concerned about that loss of revenue ... in exchange for the financial attraction of having an automated barrier system with fewer personnel?

Are electonic liftpasses transferable between skiers, or is it prohibited? Presumably checks are never made ... or are they?

A snowHead

It would be down to the terms and conditions attached to the pass but unlikely they'd be transferrable.
I have seen mention on here before about a picture being attached to the pass number on the computer the first time you go through a check, that then allows the lifties to see if the right person is using it later on.

Automated barriers don't have to lead to less staff, you still nead someone to run the thing and chucker-oners and seat tippers seem common enough in the handsfree pass equipped Skiwelt. Likewise someone handing you the T-bar, it's not essential but it was a common sight.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

David, certainly in Serre Chevalier, at certain key lifts, there is a computer in the lifties little hut which displays the users photo that was registered at the time of purchase. The photos are scanned onto the computer at the lift pass office, stored there, and printed onto the card. I suppose for short use lift passes, 3 days or less you would get away with it, as they don't require you to have a photo. We have Snowpass watches, and we can add our liftpass to these online, so I suppose anyone could then use the pass, as there is no photos added. However, when we used these at the liftpass office, we still had to produce a photo, and it was stuck onto a card, that we were meant to produce if asked. There was also a serial no on there that corresponded to our lift pass no.

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I would guess that photo passes are not transferable, but nobody could tell with a non photo pass

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David Goldsmith, you mean you havent checked the terms and conditions with your solicitor ??

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David Goldsmith, May I suggest you use the search facility on here, this has been discussed at lengh on at least 2 previous occasions.

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Helen Beaumont, you cannot do this for a season pass, infact for season 2006/07 you cant even buy a season pass at the caisee you have to send off for it before hand.

basically if you get caught with someone elses pass you will have it confiscated (sp???) and possilbly banned from the moutnain.

if you are prepared to risk such things go ahead and loan them out.

i know of all the lifts that check propperly but you still risk it big time

After all it is free

Frankly it's not practicable though, is it? I mean for a day trip, one of us takes both Snopass watches to the cash desk, in fact we've done that for 3 and 4 days too - certainly no photo there and all the hands-free passes are advertised as not needing a photo except for a season pass. And in Courchevel last year the TO's rep bought the hands-free passes for us - the only constraint in both cases is/was to carry the receipt to prove you've actually paid for the passes.

snowangel., I wasn't intending to. , I was just pointing out what happened when we were there. I certainly wouldn't give them to anyoone else to use. Maybe you misunderstood me. I was actually pointing out that it would be difficult, as your photo comes up in the computer when your pass is scanned at the lift. Except for the day passes.

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snowangel., do property owners, and therefore, local taxpayers get a special rate on the season pass? Many other SH's seem to get them in other resorts.

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In Morzine any hands free pass over 6 days (I think) needs a photo, which is printed onto the card and also stored electronically. They will, however, scan your passport photo. All the key base stations have monitors that flash up photos as you scan through - though, frankly, the photos flash up so quickly that you'd have to be dead unlucky to be caught - especially if you're wearing goggles / helmet / hat, etc.

Helen Beaumont - interestingly, the only time I've stayed in Serre Che, is the only time I've seen what looked like a very obviously abusive scam. When we arrived, the hotel handed out hands-free passes and asked for (demanded in fact) passports as hostage for the passes. It caused a near riot with our group. We quickly found out why - they were using staff season passes instead of buying weekly passes for the punters. When we returned to the UK we reported the hotel to the tour operator. They very quickly offered us refunds on our passes to go away.

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with lift passes, when i was out in mayrhofen last season i stayed with a load of seasonaires, one of which actually went away for 8 of the days i was there. i used his lift pass for the whole time, and it got checked once, and bearing in mind im blonde with 0 facial hair, and the pass had a photo was of a dark haired, full bearded guy and the guy who checked it didnt even think twice. although apparently if you get caught using someone elses lift pass it gets confiscated which is a rather large loss.

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

So were going to get a whole load of season passes under names like 'Mr Snowhead' 'Mrs Snowhead' etc at huge discount and share them on a week-by week basis ?
As others have pointed out, this would very likely breach the t&c.

Using a pass while someone is at lunch (IE a one-for-one exchange of user with no time overlap) is also probably in breach, but less wrong. However the situation is vanishingly small and not worth worrying about.

I have seen people go through the ski barrier and pass the pass back to a nother member of their group. I would have thought there would be a time limit but obviously not in all cases.

A snowHead

A snowHead

PhillipStanton, was it a TO run hotel or an independent one? PM me the details if you don't want to say on here. Just out of interest as we had a problem with lift passes on our first visit.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Helen Beaumont, it was tour operator one - although, to be honest, I've forgotten the name of both as it was about 4 years ago. I could probably work out which one it was from a village map if you can point me at one.

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PhillipStanton, if it was in Villeneuve I may know which one it is anyway. We were in self-catering accommodation and were given passes with other peoples photos on. We were told we didn't need our own on, but one of the kids was stopped at the lift (the photo was of a small girl). The rep (same TO as hotel) took the passes away that evening, along with the photos we'd tried to give him, and returned with the proper pics on. May not have been connected of course. The passes seemed to be othrwise OK, dates of validity etc. We propbably just had someone elses lift passes, it happened in La Plagne once too.

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Helen Beaumont, given the level of money to be made operating something like this I'd be surprised if it wasn't connected. Even on one pass your looking at somone making £600+ over a season.

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If you try that in Austria or Swtizerland your end up down the Police Station. The fines are HUGE Sad

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Hands-free liftpasses: are they transferable between skiers? What's 'the law'?

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