Lots of aggressive skiing while growing up- Austria and Switzerland. Father was PanAm pilot stationed in Berlin in the 60s. Some skiing in the US since- but not for 30 years now. Retired and am taking the sport back up. Free senior pass at Mountain High (Wrightwood in SoCal area, USA)!!! Arriving in mail tomorrow!
A ski rental place in Big Bear, CA suggested Volkl Deacon 80 165 cm (these were white color mostly). Guy seemed very knowledgeable and helpful. I am 160 lbs (72 kg), 5' 10" (177cm). Their rental boots were Nordica Cruise- 28.5 size (HV/104 last I believe) seemed perfect in the store- and I really liked the fit- way better than any boot I've ever worn. The flex seemed stiff (stiffer than any boot I've ever worn). I do not know the flex rating of that boot, so I can't say weather it was 80 or 110. But the boots were extremely hard to put on and take off. Despite the fact that they are "entry" level/cheap boots, I was really impressed. Whatever boot I get, I think needs to be HV/102-104 last area.
I really should ski that kit and give feedback to the shop and see what else they suggest. But rental is such a pain and I'm anxious to have my own gear. I know very little about current equipment. So I've been trying to educate myself for the last several days on the internet considering what I might buy. As much as I love seeing the fluffy dry groomed pistes in YouTube videos, real world here is sparse snow, wet- then freeze-over, some ice, etc. So I'm guessing 100mm plus underfoot is not realistic. Looking for suggestions please.
For boots, I've been considering several versions of Rosignol Alltrack HV (102- 104 last- 90 to 110 flex). An example:
These Rosi boots have "hike" mode. This is for walking around parking lot and lift areas (not "touring")- also makes for easy on and off (per chat on Evo website).
Wondering if anyone has feedback on these boots and skis? General suggestions? At this point, I have nothing against buying "last year's model"on sale- will be light years ahead of anything I've skeed.
I am considering buying the Volkl Deacon 80s if I like them- they may be selling them off. I'm guessing would be in the $200 to $275 range (including bindings)- I've seen other rental places selling off their Deacon 80 rentals in the low $200 range on the internet.
Thanks......
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@kip.duff, no particular recommendations for skis but be prepared to upgrade as you get more dialled back in.
Boots though:
A. A normal size adult IMO shouldn't be on anything marked less than "110".
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Partially based on your advice about stiffness rating, I ordered some 2025 Rosignol Alltrack 110 HV GW in 28.5 size. The other reason was they were discounted to $189 with free shipping! Couldn't pass it up. They'll be here in 9 days. If they don't work out, I can send them back or sell them myself.
I've been getting a lot of input on another forum advising me to buy my boots based on advice and fitting by a boot fitter. Fortunately, my feet are pretty normal: a little wide with somewhat high arch. Boots will be here in 10 days.
@kip.duff, Can very much vouch for the Nordica HF boots. Not the sort of thing a 25 year old hot shot would use but they are perfect for the somewhat more mature foot!
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Thanks- I'll take a closer look. I'm assuming you have those boots?
@kip.duff, no but friends do and love them and they fly off the shelf in bro in law’s ski shop (best in Chamonix according to ChatGPT . )
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
"Veteran" feet is a term we could use as well.....
After all it is free
After all it is free
If not for 30 years, are you used to carving skis? I can’t remember if they go back that far. Very different technique from the straights.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Orange200 wrote:
If not for 30 years, are you used to carving skis? I can’t remember if they go back that far. Very different technique from the straights.
I think it's just coming up to 30 years when Carving Skis became mainstream (as opposed to niche).
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No. Been watching a lot of youtube. Assumed it meant swerving in a constant pattern at a medium to high speed on a moderately steep, groomed slope. ?? Gonna google it now- didn't know there were skis specifically for that. Last equipment I used dinosaur stuff. Gonna be interesting- any current ski equipment I use will be light years ahead of stuff I was on.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
In that case I would strongly advise renting for a week or three, and a bunch of lessons, for you to understand what are your capabilities and options before committing to something on the basis of reviews. Learn to carve, then experiment with eights and lengths. Some rental shops may let you do that if you warn them.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Yes: rent first (although I already have bought some new boots- see above). Where I have my senior pass at Mountain High, there's a rental facility- just talked to them. They will rent daily or seasonal. I can use their boots or mine after they arrive. They're also anxious to sell off their large and varied boot and ski rental inventory (primarily Rossignol I believe). Seems ideal. I'll be headed there this or next week (about 100 miles from me).
I watched some videos of guys carving. Maybe it's just me, but to me this appears to be a style of turning that could be covered using your favorite "on-piste" ski. At 13 and maybe 100 lbs in 1962, I was skiing Kneissl "Combi" skis- probably 205 cm in all conditions over the entire season. Those skis are junk compared to stuff now (the boots too)- man, am I excited to try the current stuff. However, I am wise enough to take it REAL slow. I know I won't be able to do the extreme stuff I used to do- but I'll approach it. I don't know what my capabilities are now due to age (and loss of an eye). I may decide to not ski at all- for my own safety (and safety of others) after spending some time on the snow.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Quote:
In that case I would strongly advise renting for a week or three, and a bunch of lessons, for you to understand what are your capabilities and options before committing to something on the basis of reviews. Learn to carve, then experiment with eights and lengths. Some rental shops may let you do that if you warn them.
As I research carving and carving skis, I'm interested in learning more. What are examples of carving skis popular over the past several years? I'm not taking a position one way or another on whether I would have the skill to run them. It's an academic question divorced from whatever my past or future skiing situation is or might be. My limited understanding leads me to believe they might have application in grim the SoCal conditions where there's seldom dry quality snow- and almost no off-piste options.
Thanks in advance.....
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I found this. I say carving, he says shaped. Around 1990 people were saying parabolic. I will leave experts here to answer your questions.
If you have further questions, just ask and we'll do our best to answer them.
IME. As someone who transitioned from Straight to Carving Skis, it is well worth getting a couple of lessons to help you adapt to the adjustments needed.....otherwise, you will miss the whole point of these shaped skis.
Nb. In the UK we have All Mountain Skis (narrower) and Freeride skis (Wider); in America, these are often known as AM Frontside (narrower) and AM Backside (Wider)
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 8-02-26 12:07; edited 1 time in total
“ 1990: Olin engineer Frank Meatto started designing skis with radical sidecut—essentially giving skis an hourglass-like shape—in the 1980s. By 1990, Elan trademarked the term “parabolic” with the release of their SideCut eXtreme, or SCX, the first shaped skis designed to making carving easier.”
But how much time it took for the word to enter the vocabulary of holiday skiers, I don’t know, could be another five years. I associate it with the end of school trips, 1992.
Anyway, another point for the OP to consider; you’ll meet a load of new terms and not everyone will agree on them!
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Orange200 wrote:
“ 1990: Olin engineer Frank Meatto started designing skis with radical sidecut—essentially giving skis an hourglass-like shape—in the 1980s. By 1990, Elan trademarked the term “parabolic” with the release of their SideCut eXtreme, or SCX, the first shaped skis designed to making carving easier.”
But how much time it took for the word to enter the vocabulary of holiday skiers, I don’t know, could be another five years. I associate it with the end of school trips, 1992.
Anyway, another point for the OP to consider; you’ll meet a load of new terms and not everyone will agree on them!
Personally, I think there is, "When was the concept first thought of" vs "When did carving skis start becoming mainstream" (as opposed to a niche concept / product).
They have some characteristics of my old skis: *camber *narrow at waist. A big difference being the hourglass shape. Apparently some front rocker. Seems a 2023 Volkl Deacon 80 is adjacent- or in this category.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
kip.duff wrote:
Thanks Fartbag and Orange!
They have some characteristics of my old skis: *camber *narrow at waist. A big difference being the hourglass shape. Apparently some front rocker. Seems a Volkl Deacon 80 is adjacent- on in this category.
Straight skis had a turn radius of 55 to 60m...hence the unweighting and foot steering.
Current Piste Skis have a Turn Radius of 13 to 16m....so simply need tilted onto the edge. Skiing is also more two footed....and by that I mean both skis being tilted at the same time and by the same amount - leaving two tracks in the snow. You still balance against the outside ski, with most of the weight on the D/Hill ski......but with much less Up and Down movements and foot steering/skidding.
When I first went from 2m straight skis, to 170 carving skis, I found myself being left behind, as everything happened so much quicker than I was used to.....especially if you get both skis working together (as opposed to the 80s style A-Frame).
The skis now do much more of the work.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@Old Fartbag,
Yeah- I've seen discussions of A-frame. I may be in that category. Crouch- then push up during transition from right to left turn- somewhat weightless during transition. Carving skis more parallel- inside knee way bent- and inside ski way forward. Less friction- faster on a given track. Quite excited to see what they're like. It sounds like a carving ski might nudge one voluntarily or involuntarily towards a carving style. I like your description of your first carving ski experience!
BTW, navigating and posting in this forum is new and tricky to me. My responses may wind up in the wrong place.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
under a new name wrote:
@kip.duff, you will be able to ski! Trust me, it has only become easier and more comfortable during your hiatus
Thanks so much!! Being encouraged by skiers to jump back in is bringing me to tears.... happened at the boot rental place too....
Ya- just lookin at these skis make me wanna jump on em.....
Just trying on the Plain Jane Nordica Cruise rental boots made me well aware of the improvements. I've never worn a boot that was even close. Maybe coincidence that Nordica randomly used a a foot model almost identical to mine when they designed that boot model line- only downside: hard putting on and taking off. Can't wait to see if the new Rossi Alltrack 110 HV GWs work out.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Sun 8-02-26 19:57; edited 1 time in total
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
kip.duff wrote:
....and inside ski way forward.
Not so much....tip lead to that extent, is no longer a thing.
In GS type turns, you remain "Stacked" and thus much more square to your skis.
Lessons are the way to go, as it saves misunderstandings.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@kip.duff, Did you say how old you were?
I get a free ski pass at Tignes/Val d'Isere since I was 75.
Keep it up!
I remember trying on some skis in Val Disere in 1096
Ooops! it was'nt that long .... ago just after the Normal invasion more like 1996
... I wanted to buy a pair of Volkl Snow Rangers, I'd been using them for 6 days.
They got me to try a pair of Head CX13's .. I did not know what to expect ..they never said....
They would not stop turning, not for me I decided.
I thought these ParOfBollix skis would just be a passing phase, how wrong I was.
Now we love them, please rent a few different sets of skis, it will take you a while to get the hang of Carving, its not that hard, much easier than what we used to have to do.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Mon 9-02-26 10:09; edited 1 time in total
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Old Fartbag:
I meant the inside ski is forward- not the skier's weight. Yes- now that you mention it, I notice the upright stance.
"Stacked- more square on your skis". Reminds me of vonAllmen's survival of having his weight a bit far back about ⅓ of the way down the Olympic downhill race (yesterday?). I don't know if you can watch it if you're in England:
It's always fun to watch downhill racing- that run is special. And the video coverage blows my mind.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@kip.duff, I can't see that video.
The tips of the skis only reflect the natural small tip lead of the U/Hill ski as a result of standing sideways on a slope. There should be no pronounced effort into having the D/Hill or U/Hill ski forward.
I'm 78. In less than two years, I'll be able to ski many locations. Very few places in US with 75 year old free passes.
I remember my dad had Heads in 1963 when they were a US company- they were considered a powder ski then. I'm anxious to see what they rent at Mountain High ("partnered with Rossignol")- I'm guessing it's a hole in the wall compared to where you were.
I believe there's not many Head skis on the SoCal slopes.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Old Fartbag wrote:
@kip.duff, I can't see that video.
The tips of the skis only reflect the natural small tip lead of the U/Hill ski as a result of standing sideways on a slope. There should be no pronounced effort into having the D/Hill or U/Hill ski forward.
BTW, I'm guessing there's not much skiing in England (I believe that's where you are)- not sure. Where do you ski?
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Sun 8-02-26 21:37; edited 2 times in total
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:
1
When the flush of the new-born sun fell first on Eden's green and gold,
A Lying Spirit sat under the Tree and sang, 'New Lamps for Old!'
And Adam waked from his mighty sleep, and Eve was at his side,
And the twain had faith in the song that they heard, and knew not the Spirit lied.
2
They plucked a lamp from the Eden-tree (the ancient legend saith),
And lighted themselves the Path of Toil that runs to the Gate of Death;
They left the lamp for the joy of their sons, and that was a glorious gain,
When the Spirit cried, 'New Lamps for Old!' in the ear of the branded Cain.
3
So he gat fresh hope, and builded a town, and watched his breed increase,
Till Tubal lighted the Lamp of War from the flickering Lamp of Peace;
And ever they fought with fire and sword and travailed in hate and fear,
As the Spirit sang, 'New Lamps for Old!' at the change of the changing year.
4
They sought new lamps in the Morning-red, they sought new lamps in the West,
Till the waters covered the pitiful land and the heart of the world had rest
Had rest with the Rain of the Forty Days, but the Ark rode safe above,
And the Spirit cried, 'New Lamps for Old!' when Noah loosened the Dove.
5
And some say now that the Eden-tree had never a root on earth;
And some say now from an eyeless eft our Father Adam had birth;
And some say now there was never an Ark and never a God to save;
And some say now that Man is a God, and some say Man is a slave;
6
And some build altars East and West, and some build North and South;
And some bow down to the Work of the Hand and some to the Word of the Mouth.
But wheresoever a heart may beat or a hand reach forth to hold,
The Spirit comes with the coming year, and cries, 'New Lamps for Old!'
7
And the sons of Adam leave their toil who are cursed with the Curse of Hope,
And hang the profitless past in a noose of the thundering belfry's rope,
And tear the branch from the laurel-bush with feastings manifold,
When the cry goes up to the scornful stars, 'New Lamps! New Lamps for Old!'
8
Though all the lamps that ever were lit have winked at the world for years,
The sons of Adam crowd the streets with laughter and sighs and tears;
For they hold that new, strange lamps shall shine to guide their feet aright,
And they turn their eyes to the scornful stars and stretch their arms to the night.
9
And the Spirit gives them the Lamp of War that burns at the cannon-lip,
As it blazed on the point of Tubal's blade and the prow of the battleship;
And the Lamp of Love that was Eve's to snatch from Lilith under the Tree;
And the Lamp of Fame that is old as Strife and dim as Memory;
10
And the Lamp of Faith that was won from Job, and of Shame that was wrung from Cain;
And the Lamp of Youth that was Adam's once, and the cold blue Lamp of Pain;
And last is the terrible Lamp of Hope that every man must bear,
Lest he find his peace ere the day of his death by the light of the Lamp Despair.
11
We know that the Eden Lamp is lost,—if ever were Eden made,
And the ink of the Schools in the Lamp of Faith has sunk a world in the shade;
But ever we look for a light that is new, and ever the Spirit cries,
'New Lamps for Old!' and we take the lamps, and—behold, the Spirit lies!
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I'm curious as it ties in with another thread, but for you people of a more mature age, what flex boots do you think is best for your body?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Weathercam,
I'm not an authority, but I've been doing some research. I do believe that the flex rating does not have an industry standard measurement system. The ratings are rough classifications by the manufacturers. A flex rating of 110 can actually have various flex resistance- even within one brand. I ordered some 110 boots- will be here in a week. I'm curious!!
Some advice I got: 110 or more for intermediate/advanced adult male.
@kip.duff, if I’m attempting to go skiing at 78 with half the enthusiasm you have, I’ll be soooo happy!
20 years still to go…
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@kip.duff, I forgot to say "Welcome to Snowheads", I'm sure someone else must have said it to you already.
Probably most of us are in the UK or Ireland, but we have many contributors from all over the planet.
So if I go to the states in 4 years time I may find somewhere to ski for free ?
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Sun 8-02-26 22:51; edited 1 time in total
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@Orange200,
I'm lucky- I have a slow clock. I look and move like I'm about 5 or ten years younger. Plus, skiing was the only sport I was any good at- watching me try to hit or catch a baseball is hilarious. And I was feverish about it as a kid- still gets me pretty excited when I realize I may have some good ski miles left. It's so screwed up that my job of the past 20 years (petrol tanker truck mechanic) was so draining, that there was never a thought of taking time off to ski earlier. Took retirement for me to start thinking about it.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@DrLawn,
Thanks for the welcome- appreciated: newbies sometimes get beat up in forums.
Well, as mentioned, several places in US for 75 and up. I believe there are some available for 70 and over. Only one senior pass near (75 and up). My main concern is Big Bear: not bad- and 65 miles from me (beautiful drive). I'll need to be 80 there. Also, Mammoth (of course)- quite a step up from SoCal skiing. I will need to be 80 there for free ride. Mountain High is about 80 miles from me- I'll be there soon for free. How old are you if I may ask?
So you guys ski in Europe?
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@altis, Is that from the bible?
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
@kip.duff,
You were asking about boots.... All I can recommend is to go to a good boot fitter and let them find the ones that fit you best.
I find boots boot liners settle after a few we7eks of use and I've had to go for custom boot liners (Intuition).
We tend to ski on narrower ski in Europe. We will all have a preference.
Your local rental shop you say is mostly Rossignol, I'm particularly fond of "Rossignol Hero MT Carbon".
Take them out when you feel comfortable about your skiing.
I always rent these days so My favourite skis are:
Salomon Addikt Pro 76mm (not the 66mm) such a fun ski.
Kastle dx73 so smooth.
Atomic Redster X7 a confidence ski in bumps.
I've not used a pair of Volkl skis since 1995, those were P9s, I was a lot younger then and having a pair of railway lines seemed cool.
The Deacons seem to have quite a following on here, I've never tried them ... perhaps one day we may get powder?
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
. )
?