 Poster: A snowHead
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Climbed the little Lagazuoi between Corvara and Cortina yesterday. I’ve wanted to explore this mountain since i first skied here 20 odd years ago.
This is the place in the First World War where the Austrians controlled the summit and the Italians managed to occupy and fortify, an impossible ledge, half way up the face 
If you look carefully you can see portals in the rock, these are shelters and firing positions on the ‘Martini ledge’ which the Italians hung onto for two and a half years, with the Austrians around them.
The Austrians blew parts of the mountain up 4 times and the Italians blew off a large part of the lower summit by digging long tunnels through the rock and setting off tons of explosives. You can clearly see where these were even to this day.
The two big talus slopes below the main rock face of the Lagazuoi are from those explosions, 110 years ago.
You can use the network of remaining tunnels to climb to the summit, inside the mountain! The tunnels are mostly at an exhausting 30 degree incline between about 2400m and 2700m. There are some frightening drops where windows were created out to daylight as firing loops, to tip mined rock or accommodate aerial ropeways. You can still access the Martini ledge and it’s remains, and get to the point where the Austrians blew up the western end of the ledge where the two armies were close to each other in this impossible place.
The walk down from the summit via the Austrian infantry path is a hair raising loose rock scramble holding onto cables above massive drops. I thought I had a head for heights but My knees were knocking in a few places and I wasn’t been shot at, frozen or avalanched.
https://lagazuoi.it/EN/Experience-Winter-page37-The-emplacements-of-WW1
https://cortinadelicious.it/EN/p52-The-Lagazuoi-Front
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Peter S wrote: |
Climbed the little Lagazuoi between Corvara and Cortina yesterday. I’ve wanted to explore this mountain since i first skied here 20 odd years ago.
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There's a bigger Lagazuoi? 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Peter S, you're braver than us.
We walked up to the rifugio from the cable car in June but followed the route of the piste, we did briefly consider the infantry path up the front but after looking through bins decided it looked like it stopped halfway so went for the safer option!
We then walked down the valley to La Villa via the Scotoni rifugio but not before having a good look in the tunnels which were really interesting, we didn't have helmets so didn't go too far in especially after coming across a pool of blood where someone had obviously hit their head really badly 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
There's a bigger Lagazuoi?
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Yes, it is called Lagazuoi.
We went to climb Hexenstein via the South Arrete a couple of weeks ago. The easiest approach is from Valparolapass through the 4 or 500m long Golginger Stollen tunnel (torches needed). We couldn't find the start of the route so eventually walked all the way around Hexenstein, exploring trenches etc along the way. Considering how busy the rest of the area was this beautiful walk was almost deserted.
The Kaiserjägersteig is a steep and fairly unpleasant path up (or down) the scree slopes, which is a lot nicer once you reach the solid rock. Around the other side of Lagazuoi is the Italian field hospital which is also worth visiting, probably on the way to the new, ie nothing to do with WWI, more challenging Degli Alpini via ferrata
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@johnE, interesting, so which is the Lagazuoi with the cable car up from Passo Falzarego?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Lagazuoi is the peak that the cable car reaches. To the north west of the peak there are a number of minor peaks known in climbing circles as Piccolo Lagazuoi.
If you want more information then https://lagazuoi.it/EN/pTer6-The-Kaiserjger-path-191517 gives more. I find the geography a little hard to follow as my maps, bought 40 years ago, use the original German names preceding the recent Italianisation of place names.
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I'd be really interested in your advice on this. We booked a trip to the Dolomites ages ago and have since been inundated with the Instagram horror stories about overcrowding.
Original plan was:
Day 1: Sightseeing in Trento
Day 2: Transfer to Ortisei
Day 3: Seceda Ridge line (some sort of hike in that area yet to be planned)
Day 4: Alpe De Siusi - walk the area and lunch at one of the huts
Day 5: Transfer to Cortina
Day 6: Tre Cime
Day 7: One of the Lakes - not sure which one.
Day 8: Free Day
Now I'm worried about the crowds. Are there better options which will still be as picturesque but without the hoards?
I've been skiing in the Corvara area and have completed the Sella Ronda and just want to show my partner how amazing the area really is.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@TopGooner, when are you planning to go - it matters. Any week touching August 15 will be a nightmare. June, early July and mid september onwards will be fine but check when the lifts are open. I beleive the one from St. Ulrich to Seceda runs until November.
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Actually I've noticed one of the days you plan to hike upto a hutte and have lunch. This is a very popular pastime and done by many Italian families and the Huttes are often fully booked. Book in advance to make sure you get in. The Jimmy Hutte at GrödnerJoch offers magnificent views of the Sella massive
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Oh yes - good point. We're going 6th to 15th September, hopefully timed for the kids going back to school 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@TopGooner, Just a thought - for Seceda, go to st cristinia and use the lifts there rather than the cable cars from Ortisei?
Although, it should be lots quieter in September....
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Will definitely be calmer.
Back to schools.
We've been there last week and only skipped Seceda from our plans.
Everything was manageable
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You know it makes sense.
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Sounds great, thanks
We'll also look for potentially quieter lifts up
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| TopGooner wrote: |
I'd be really interested in your advice on this. We booked a trip to the Dolomites ages ago and have since been inundated with the Instagram horror stories about overcrowding.
Original plan was:
Day 1: Sightseeing in Trento
Day 2: Transfer to Ortisei
Day 3: Seceda Ridge line (some sort of hike in that area yet to be planned)
Day 4: Alpe De Siusi - walk the area and lunch at one of the huts
Day 5: Transfer to Cortina
Day 6: Tre Cime
Day 7: One of the Lakes - not sure which one.
Day 8: Free Day
Now I'm worried about the crowds. Are there better options which will still be as picturesque but without the hoards?
I've been skiing in the Corvara area and have completed the Sella Ronda and just want to show my partner how amazing the area really is. |
We did a trip mid/late June so season was in full swing around Alp di suise / Ortisei but just starting in Alta Badia. We had a few days on Alp di suise then a few more in La Villa.
September most Italians will be back at work as the schools typically start up earlyish September. Having discussed this with locals several have recommend that as the best month to go.
Trento was quiet when we were there, probably the quietest place we went.
Ortisei was moderately busy but we found a lunch place np.
Alp De Suisi was busy for a mile or so around the top of the gondola from Ortisei but became quieter the further you moved away from there, except Sunday which was busy everywhere with locals hiking and mountain biking (you probably know there is no driving on Alpi di suisi during the day so most people use the gondolas to get up there or park at Compatsch). We walked down into Ortisei one day and there was an nice path through the woods, a bit steep in places. Another we stopped for a drink around late Sunday morning at a hotel in Saltria, it was very quiet.
Top of the Lagazoui gondola and rifugio was busy (mid week) we were lucky to get a table. Same day Lago Lagazuoi was popular but not too busy, Scottoni moderately busy but quieter than lagazuoi (you've got to walk/bike rather than just take a gondola ).
Some places are even prettier in the summer than winter, especially Alp di Suisi. It's definitely worth the trip so enjoy!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Had a great week in Corvara. Busy but no more so than say Ambleside at this time of year. As above certain places are busy at the tops of the passes and the tops of the Gondolas. The Italians seem to like lying around the sun a lot once they get to Thd Scotini hut or the top of the Boe Gondola etc. managed to reach the summit of the Piz Boe today at 3125m, astounded at the sight of a packed Refugio right on summit but just a 150m away plenty of space and tranquility. Shattered tonight 
Corvara and the Sella Ronda is at least as good in the summer as the winter…….which puts it at outstanding ! Arriving from the UK, it’s a shock how perfect all the buildings are, how new everything is, the quality of the public spaces, all the incredible infrastructure, the food, the drink. etc etc. A 2019 car is out of place here
At home the Yorkshire Dales, North York Moors and Lake District are all rather fabulous, but they will never be the Dolomites!
I can report that lots of improvements are under way for this winter in terms of lift upgrades, new underground reservoirs for snow making, new and remodelled ski runs eg. Back into Arabba from the west.
Must return for the skiing 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@TopGooner, That's the last week of the southern German holidays so dont assume all will be quiet. September and October are peak season for hiking in the mountains.
@Peter S, Take into account that Südtirol has one of the highest standards of living anywhere plus many visitors are from just across the mountains here in southern Bavaria which has an even higher standard of living. Ambleside is a rather different world much though I love the Golden Rule.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| munich_irish wrote: |
| though I love the Golden Rule. |
Yes. Not changed much in 40 years
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Fri 15-08-25 21:41; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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The Golden rule ?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Peter S wrote: |
| The Golden rule ? |
A pub in Ambleside
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Typing this from Badia before we leaving in the morning. Been here for 6 days.
It's been busy in terms of traffic but we've not really had any issues. Though we're here with teenagers so we don't do mornings which might help. It's full of serious looking ramblers in boots, tech fabrics and using poles.
We walked up to Santa Crocce yesterday afternoon, was like 1.5 hrs each way, and it was pretty deserted. There was only 2 other walkers in there at around 5pm. I suspect it's much busier early as there was quite a few folks coming down.
Weather was really hot, 35ish, last week but it's eased off and been raining the last 2 days.
It's beautiful here, I suspect if you don't get up too early and don't head to the 'grammers fav spots you'll be just fine.
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Home yesterday but had a fabby week out there. Climbed the Piz Boe 3125m on Thursday using the Boe Gondola and then the Vallon chair first.
It was a bit ‘Klettersteggy’ in one place but not too serious and after that just walking in the rocky landscape above 2400m. Amazed to find a small but busy Refugio right on the summit !
Had a lovely last meal in the Royal Hotel ‘Stube Blu’ (blue room) in Corvara. Ate early so didn’t have to book.
Would love to go back for more walking and day trips eg. The Sassa de Stria opposite the Lagazuoi and next time bring out some Klettersteg gear for the Via Ferrata. Would also be good to walk hut to hut around here.
Im Probably too old now for the downhill mountain biking though. Just Asking for an injury !
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Chinese tourists essentially do 'insta' tours of Europe. We were in Cappadocia, Turkey last week and the area was awash with Chinese tourists. If an area is hitting big Insta numbers, the Chinese follow. They're not so much into beaches, more into spectacular vistas to add to their own Insta accounts. Shoot me for saying it, but they're not fun to be around. Old fashioned 'western' manners and common courtesy, they're certainly not interested in.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Mollerski wrote: |
| Chinese tourists essentially do 'insta' tours of Europe. We were in Cappadocia, Turkey last week and the area was awash with Chinese tourists. If an area is hitting big Insta numbers, the Chinese follow. They're not so much into beaches, more into spectacular vistas to add to their own Insta accounts. Shoot me for saying it, but they're not fun to be around. Old fashioned 'western' manners and common courtesy, they're certainly not interested in. |
Agreed
Also seen it in Japan
Pushy, nosiy, litterbugs
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My sister made similar comments about Chinese tourists around the NC500 in Scotland. Though I must say, having just spent a couple of weeks on the French coast, that we Brits don't set a good example when it comes to litter. In all that time, in busy, popular coastal towns with lots of families, I scarcely saw a piece of litter. Our little coastal town here gets a lot of litter. And it's not on the Chinese hit-list........
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Heard only a couple of English accents during the week.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Peter S, one of the great pleasures of trekking in the Dolomites, and even more in Aosta.
Mostly Italian families walking, talking and dining together.
In Aosta, we found plenty of RV parking lots with organised tents etc. The vast majority were Italians
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| Quote: |
Heard only a couple of English accents during the week.
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We heard a few English accents and a lot more American. Most of the others on the walks and climb we were doing were either German or Italian. Possibly 50/50 but in the restaurants mainly Italian. I suppse it's not suprising but once into August a lot of cars bore Dutch registrations.
We did come across a couple Chinese groups (or Japanese or Korean, I'm afraid I'm not good recognising nationalities). They arrived in a coach in Cortina d'Ampezzo and just wandered about looking a bit bewildered or sheltered from the rain on the Pordoi pass. Then moved on. They didn't drop any litter. If it wasn't for the fact that they were all huddled togegher on the Pordoi I wouldn't have noticed them.
@Peter S, the via ferrata is what attracted me to the Dolomites 40+ years ago and I still enjoy them. Get the gear and do them.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Mollerski wrote: |
| Chinese tourists essentially do 'insta' tours of Europe. We were in Cappadocia, Turkey last week and the area was awash with Chinese tourists. If an area is hitting big Insta numbers, the Chinese follow. They're not so much into beaches, more into spectacular vistas to add to their own Insta accounts. Shoot me for saying it, but they're not fun to be around. Old fashioned 'western' manners and common courtesy, they're certainly not interested in. |
we were in Val gardena in June during the peak wildflower season, bus loads of tourists were arriving in Ortisei and taking the gondola up to take pictures of themselves amongst the flowers with the beautiful dolomiti backdrop, a high proportion were Chinese and age wise definitely of the Insta generation, it was noticeable how much younger the average chinese tourist was vs European. There are day trips from Verona and no doubt Venice so I'd imagine Ortisei is busy because it's so easy to get to from the Autostrada. e.g. There are day trips that go from Verona - Riva del garda - Ortisei - Saas Pordoi and back via Val di fassa.
Saying that we stayed in a small hotel and there were a couple of groups of Chinese tourist who were staying several nights.
I didn't notice their behaviour being any better or worse than the other nationalities. Certainly more polite than some nationalities that arrive en masse during the winter months, none elbowed me out of the way! once we were walking it was mainly German, French and Italian.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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We were enjoying a meal in a rather lovely restaurant over looking the Cappadocia region. On the table next to us were a middle aged Italian couple speaking perfect english as the common language between themselves and the waiting staff. Our's and their salads were mixed up on delivery which opened up a conversation between us. The Chinese visitor topic was touched upon. Mrs. Milan offered up "Twenty years ago they were all in plastic shoes, now they are everywhere!" We smiled and nodded. She then blurted out " I hate them!". Mr. Milan quickly 'shushed' her at that point.
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Poster: A snowHead
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One update worth a heads up:
It took us 7 hours to drive from Badia to Bergamo today. Traffic was mental. Was a Saturday and it looked almost as busy the other way. No crashes are anything, just sheer volume of traffic. All the way till we turned off the a22 for Milan, so most of it. Crazy dash for plane. We only left so early bas we had to drop someone off en route. Exploded our plans for a long lunch stop on the way.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@swskier, “The amount you hear locals complaining about it, yet they're all absolutely loaded as a result of it. Their family land and properties are now worth in the millions”
Only if you sell & give up farming, ie don’t buy another farm. This is something Rachel from complaints doesn’t get!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@B., Always best to avoid the A22 on summer Saturdays if you can. We drove from Munich to Tuscany yesterday, made sure we were over the Brenner by 8 and so got to Verona about 12, not too bad. Speed increases significantly once past the turn off for "Lago di Garda Sud" Its the same in both directions.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yea, I knew it would be busy but totally underestimated what busy was - and that's coming from someone that lives in London.
The woman that owned the place we stayed though that the A22 might be the lesser of the 2 evils as we'd have got stuck behind bikes, motorhomes and busses on the other route.
We drove up on the Sunday before and I was complaining how busy that was. It took 3 hours from Lago D'iseo to Badia. Took about 6 on the way back.
Anyways, it's beautiful up there, I've never been in the summer before, but thought it was worth warning any others that were out there to leave a lot more time for the airport run.
Hopefully make it back in Jan with some of you lot.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@B., Try not to go anywhere on August 15th - It's Italian National day. Combine it with the weekend and traffic and crowds are a nightmare.
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FAQ
