 Poster: A snowHead
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Last week I ski'd Les Arc for the first time, travelling there and back by train for the first time. Thanks for the valuable advice by members of this forum on several questions I got good responses from the group on here.
Journey out was the "snowtrain" Eurostar from London to Bourg St Maurice, this was advertised as a direct journey however you do need to change trains at Lille. This was easy though, the train from Lille was on the opposite platform, so literally get off the train, cross then platform, get onto the next train. First time on Eurostar and I was pleasantly surprised. The train out was the posh eurostar I was told, the one with 2 seats on one side and one seat on the other, as I was travelling alone I had a single seat. Very comfortable. Train left at 9am. I was pleasantly surprised that a breakfast was supplied as part of the service, so had a good breakfast ad multiple coffee top ups. The journey was pleasant, didn't feel to long, goes via Lille, Charles de Gaul airport and then Champery, Albertville, Moutiers and a a couple of small stations between Moutiers and Bourg -St Maurice. Arrived in Bourg at 6:45pm French time, was straight off the end of the platform (back the way you came) up and over the overbridge straight to the Funicular, Funicular straight up the mountain to Arc1600, didn't need to buy a funicular ticket. I had booked an apartment in Arc1600 so I was in by not long after 7pm, which was great as the Sherpa supermarket closed at 7:30pm so I could quickly grab some provisions for the week before they shut.
I had a fantastic weeks skiing, very lucky with the weather, wall to wall sunshine, not a cloud in the sky for most of the week. Snow and pistes in great conditions and stayed that way throughout the day. I am a fairly agricultural intermediate skier and found the area very good. A large range of runs for all abilities. The Arc 1950/2000 bowl has some nice long easy cruisy blues and a few short reds, I enjoyed the reds in the Arc1800 / Vallandry area. I made it over to La Plagne a couple of times during the week, which is fairly easy, even from Arc1600. I stayed in the Plagne Bellecote and Belle Plagne area and again enjoyed the nice long blues and reds there. All in all a great week, got in plenty of mileage each day.
I returned on the Saturday via the TGV to Paris and then Eurostar. For some reason the direct "snowtrain" only returns on a Sunday morning, not a Saturday. So rather than staying another night and getting back Sunday evening I preferred to return on Saturday. The TGV to Paris was great, top deck of a double deck train, very comfortable, good choice in the buffet, can order online and they bring it to your seat if you want. Got to Paris Gare de Lyon, then had around 2 hours to get to Gare de Nord for the the next Eurostar home. This was easy, just get on the RER D line north 2 stops. You can buy the travel card for this from the buffet shop on the TGV, cost a few Euros. I put my luggage in the baggage storage place i Gare de Nord, (end of platform 3 level below) and had an hour to wonder around bag free before the next train, went for a wonder and had a coffee in a Parisien cafe. I realised once I was back in the station that the Sacre Cour is pretty close to Gare Nord so probably could have had time for a quick look at that. Eurostar back was quick and easy. 2.5 hours to St Pancras.
As a first experience on the train and skiing in France it was great, the train does take about 9 hours n total but that goes quickly, and its comfortable. I picked Les Arc as it had the funicular which basically made it door to door for me without having to arrange taxis or transfers which can be expensive if you are on your own. The train makes the whole area accessible really, the 3 valleys, La Plagne, Les Arc and past Bourg to Tignes and Val D'Isere so plenty of choice of places to ski.
Last weekend the main road to Moutiers was shut because a boulder took it out , this caused chaos on the roads and caused some people to be stuck in Geneva etc for the weekend! So I was very glad I chose the train as we just cruised past the chaos unaffected!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Sounds like a very successful trip. We were in les Arcs last week too - great conditions! We got a transfer from Geneva on the way out and were delayed 3 hours (pretty good really given what some people had), and came back on probably the same trains as you. I do need to pick up a Paris metro travelcard, as getting the phone app to behave itself and work on the barriers was a bit of a faff. Next year we're going Sunday-Sunday, so will look at the Eurostar via Lille home if that's still their schedule.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@DHosking, what was the timings of the trains on your return journey? What time did you leave Bourg St Maurice, and what time did you leave Gare du Nord?
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I left Bourg-St-Maurice on Saturday at 9:49 am, so it was comfortable to get out the accommodation fine, got the Funicular down at around 9am, walked straight along the platform from the overbridge to the train carriage, no need to go via the actual main station concourse. Got settled on the train with about 20 minutes to go before departure.
Got to Paris Gare de Lyon at 2:52pm. got across to Gare de Nord probably in 15 minutes or so from getting off the train. Train from Gare de Nord didn't set off until 5:12pm. The ticket will say get to the Eurostar check in 90 minutes before departure, however there is no need to, could leave it to 30 minutes before I would say. Arrived back in St Pancras at 6:30pm (because of time difference only an hour and 18 minutes after departure.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@DHosking, thanks.
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@DHosking, glad to hear it worked well. I find going by train a very relaxed way to get to the Alps. The journey becomes part of the holiday, with gorgeous views from the train. Some folk I've travelled with have really appreciated the amount of legroom compared to being crammed into the seats of hot, crowded transfer buses.
As you've discovered, getting from Paris Gare de Lyon to Gare du Nord really isn't that difficult. I quite happily make that transfer with a holdall and ski bag. People seem to make a lot of fuss about it.
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@DHosking, What was the cost of the trains?
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| Layne wrote: |
| @DHosking, What was the cost of the trains? |
Not cheap. The Ski train out was €160 and the SNCF and Eurostar back was €260.
I don't actually think it would be much different then flying solo. By the time you have booked the flights, with seats and luggage etc, then transfers from the airport plus car parking at the airport for a week then the price difference isn't too much I reckon.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Wow, I've never paid that much for my return train fares. Was that premium seats and first class on the SCNF trains?
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If he was sat in a carriage with a 2 + 1 layout on the Eurostar and upstairs on the TGV, then yes, that was Premiere/First Class.
We got the train to Les Arcs for rhe first time last Easter and it immediately became our preferred method of transport due to comfort and ease (we also go First).
As a family of 4, we found the Snowtrain to be really expensive, but via Interrail it was much cheaper. Ours has come in about £1000 for 4 people return from our home station, including seat reservation costs. We could have saved about £300 going standard class.
Glad you enjoyed the train @DHosking, we'll be doing it on Friday, so your thread has just ramped up excitement levels.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Owlette wrote: |
If he was sat in a carriage with a 2 + 1 layout on the Eurostar and upstairs on the TGV, then yes, that was Premiere/First Class.
We got the train to Les Arcs for rhe first time last Easter and it immediately became our preferred method of transport due to comfort and ease (we also go First).
As a family of 4, we found the Snowtrain to be really expensive, but via Interrail it was much cheaper. Ours has come in about £1000 for 4 people return from our home station, including seat reservation costs. We could have saved about £300 going standard class.
Glad you enjoyed the train @DHosking, we'll be doing it on Friday, so your thread has just ramped up excitement levels. |
I only booked standard rate for the whole journey there and back. I didn't pay any extra as far as i know for first. As far as i could tell the whole train was in the 2+1 layout on the way out.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| DHosking wrote: |
| I only booked standard rate for the whole journey there and back. I didn't pay any extra as far as i know for first. As far as i could tell the whole train was in the 2+1 layout on the way out. |
You had a meal service on board, so you were in Eurostar Plus (or Premium, whatever it’s called these days). If you were in Standard Class there’s no meal service. I was on the same Ski Train as you and some of the carriages were Standard Class with 2+2 seating, on the train from St Pancras and from Lille.
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Where did you stay in Arc 1600 as a solo traveller ?
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You know it makes sense.
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| DHosking wrote: |
| .....The ticket will say get to the Eurostar check in 90 minutes before departure, however there is no need to, could leave it to 30 minutes before I would say. |
Not sure I would risk that - they say check-in gates close 30 minutes before departure!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Ha, I did quite similar last week also - albeit St.P > Paris > Bourg on the way out, and Bourg > Lille > St.P on the way back. Solo, similarly, and Les Arcs for the same onward transfer reasons.
The outbound trip came in quite late (leaves 90 mins later than the Lille route) but the only downside of that is the mountain views disappearing in the dark. The best bit was taking the Sunday return, giving me an extra day's skiing on the Saturday; left luggage at the hotel in 2000, skied all day, hastily repacked and made way down to Base Camp in Bourg for the night. Many others had had the same idea.
I'd possibly romanticised the train somewhat (too many instagram images of the Bernina Express in mind  ) and found the cheap downstairs seats on the Paris > Bourg TGV less than delightful. Plus, if you're as introverted as I am, the background risk of, you know, being talked to by strangers (shudder) was a persistent concern. Popping up to the bar to watch rural France whizz by provided welcome relief. Clocked 187mph on a gps speedo app.
I would do it again - the overall experience was novel and convenient enough, and I'm sure some superior pre-planning could nab more comfortable seats for less cost.
Weather was belting wasn't it. I managed three or four trips over to La Plagne (was very pleased to make it to the opposite edge of the ski map from 2000!) but that was with the advantage of some practice last year. I think I finally got my head around the baffling (to me) signage - being used to the logic of numbered routes in Austria/Italy I'd previously found navigation quite stressful. Much more comfortable this time round.
Nick
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
Funicular straight up the mountain to Arc1600, didn't need to buy a funicular ticket. I had booked an apartment in Arc1600 so I was in by not long after 7pm, which was great as the Sherpa supermarket closed at 7:30pm so I could quickly grab some provisions for the week before they shut.
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It is worth mentioning that the take away pizzaria opposite the Sherpa closes at 22:00. We always ensure that our arrival in 1600 is before that time so we can get a meal on arrival. IIRC they also sell wine and beer to accompany the pizza.
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I think I finally got my head around the baffling (to me) signage - being used to the logic of numbered routes in Austria/Italy I'd previously found navigation quite stressful. Much more comfortable this time round.
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I find the naming of pistes rather than giving them numbers much easier to understand and remember. It is one of the reason the UK postcode system mixes alpha numerics rather than the USA system of simply using a number. I cannot remember my mobile phone number (I've never phoned myself) but can recall Whitehall 1212 (I've never phoned the metropolitan police either). Naming the pistes also stops confusion between the number of the piste markers and the piste identifier itself. However I do get annoyed when they start renaming pistes. For example Cascade (named because it follows a fast flowing stream) now appears on the piste map as Vallee de l'Arc 1.
ps Thanks for the execellent reviews of train travel @DHosking, and @Hoofty, I espcially liked the comment that the Lille train stops at Charles de Gaul. Since there are regular inexpensive flight to Paris this may cut out a lot of the hassle of trains to London, crossing London and the Eurostar. I'll investigate it further.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| johnE wrote: |
| ps Thanks for the execellent reviews of train travel @DHosking, and @Hoofty, I espcially liked the comment that the Lille train stops at Charles de Gaul. Since there are regular inexpensive flight to Paris this may cut out a lot of the hassle of trains to London, crossing London and the Eurostar. I'll investigate it further. |
The train went through CDG, but I don’t think it was a stop for passengers to join or leave the train. These are the stops according to the Eurostar website:
“With stops in Chambéry, Albertville, Moûtiers, Aime-La-Plagne, Landry and Bourg-Saint-Maurice, we bring you directly to the heart of the action.”
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@rob@rar, It looks as if we will have to change in Lyon and Chambery. The flights to Paris in March are looking less expensive than the train to London but it still looks like flying to Geneva is the better option until April that is when they are cut back dramatically.
Are you in Les Arcs either the week beginning 9/3/2025 or 30/3/2025?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| johnE wrote: |
| Are you in Les Arcs either the week beginning 9/3/2025 or 30/3/2025? |
I depart on the 10th, so we don’t overlap on that trip, but driving down on the 30th for a couple of weeks so good to catch up then.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@johnE, there are some direct trains from CDG but my recollection is that they're at the crack of sparrow fart.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| johnE wrote: |
I find the naming of pistes rather than giving them numbers much easier to understand and remember. It is one of the reason the UK postcode system mixes alpha numerics rather than the USA system of simply using a number. I cannot remember my mobile phone number (I've never phoned myself) but can recall Whitehall 1212 (I've never phoned the metropolitan police either). Naming the pistes also stops confusion between the number of the piste markers and the piste identifier itself. However I do get annoyed when they start renaming pistes. For example Cascade (named because it follows a fast flowing stream) now appears on the piste map as Vallee de l'Arc 1. |
I quite like the naming of the pistes too - much more evocative and romantic than numbers. I think my umbrage arose simply because the letters spelling out the runs' names are quite small, meaning I have to stop regularly to check I'm still on the run I think I'm on (especially in the criss-cross maze of 1600/1800/Peisey) - something that doesn't occur when following 'Red 227 then Blue 200' in characters large enough to read at speed. The ski map was in and out of the pocket every few minutes! 
It's never previously occurred to me to know how long a run is, but I did start to make use of the 'countdown' numbers eventually - and even the broader 'head this way for La Plagne' directions. It's much more logical than I'd originally appreciated, just because the logic is different to the one in my head!
Lovely run Vallee de l'Arc - I habitually ended each day with a lift up to Varet and a run down Vdl'A 4 towards the setting sun before heading back to base down 3/2/Chalets. Marvellous.
Nick
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I’ve started Interrailing over the last couple of years so while travelling to Les Arcs on 1st February (the day of the rock fall), spent quite a lot of the 9 hours it took to get there from Geneva staring wistfully out of the coach window at the trains flying past to BSM. It’s something I’d definitely consider for the future, probably using an Interrail pass so that I can go first class, and now that I understand the logistics of getting up into resort from the station.
Had never been to Les Arcs before but was pretty impressed - I was ski in/ski out at 1950 and I thought the piste signage was very good, so all very easy.
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| Owlette wrote: |
We got the train to Les Arcs for rhe first time last Easter and it immediately became our preferred method of transport due to comfort and ease (we also go First).
As a family of 4, we found the Snowtrain to be really expensive, but via Interrail it was much cheaper. |
@Owlette what days/times/route did you travel over Easter? Keen to make it work with kids but haven't found the right option yet. The snowtrain only running for a few weeks of the season isn't helpful, on top of the cost and restrictions.
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