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Boot frustration!

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hey all. Pretty new to this but really glad I found snowHead

Feel a bit cheeky posting for help so soon but you seem a nice bunch so here goes....

I have a pair of Atomic C:9 boots (02/03 model) which, through injury and resulting lack of fitness, have only been used for 2-3 weeks. I've had several problems with them which I've put down to "wearing in" and also to the fact that, compared to old Performa 7's, they were generally less forgiving i.e. comfy.

However, this season two things have cropped up for which no-one has yet been able to suggest convincing remedies.

Firstly, I noticed towards the end of the week that both my feet and lower legs seemed to have too much room to move around (already have custom liners/heel lifts). Once warmed up I can tighten the two upper clips to their max and still get a good 10mm of space between the boot and leg. This definitely wasn't poss when I bought them so I presume it's because the liners have packed down. Fillers have been suggested for the feet (sounds ok to the uneducated) and thicker socks for the leg (which doesn't!).

Secondly, despite the above, the liners cause major bruising to the bottom of my calf muscles. The bootfitters I purchased from have said it's because I have "athletic calves" (direct quote, I think meaning chunky! Laughing ) and there's no way of moulding the liners to help. A bootfitter in Courch said it was because I leant back in my boots but I took a lesson with a trusted instructor the next day and he assures me there's nothing too wrong with my position.

Are custom liners a good idea (seem a bit pricey?), can I get more holes drilled in the shells to allow them to be tightened further, or do I need to start over with another set of boots ???? Puzzled

I've read some seemingly excellent advice in these forums from folk who really appear to know their stuff and would appreciate any independent thoughts before I pay a visit to EB or similar. Many thanks in advance.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
skismurf75, I don't really know my stuff, but have had a wee glass or two of Mercurey so I feel fully qualified to weigh in.

1. Never feel cheeky on SnowHeads. Plenty of other cheek abounds. And, more importantly, Welcome!, (if it hasn't been said already).

2. You're right, I reckon your set up doesn't sound right.
2.b. I (think) I have found ~3 weeks is when boots bed in. This may be all your problem stems from, although...

3. You can get new holes drilled but IMHO I'd have thought that if you are of athletic build, your calves anyway, then this wouldn't be necessary unless your boots are too big. Several manufacturers produce boots with clip extension just for "athletic" calves... Then again, maybe the shop meant "athletic" as in "skinny"?

4. I think if you talked to SZK or CEM then they'd reckon you can almost always, at a price, adjust any boot as long as the principal dimensions are about right. I found custom liners (as in the whole liner, not just footbeds) to be an excellent way of extending the life of shells - and a pretty good upgrade anyway - but I really like a very, very precise fit and am prepared to tolerate a bit of pain to get there. You may find - assuming the SHELL to be the right size - that Zipfit or Strolz liners would work better than, say, Conformable.

That's one (my) long answer. Short answer? Forget EB, Slush'n'Rubble and get yourself to CEM in Oxfordshire (no, I know, Morrells is not a patch on Harvieston) or the SmallZooKeeper at Footworks in Chamonix (what more excuse do you need? Easyjet even go direct to GVA from Edinburgh!) and have a real boot tech sort things out.

You might also find Blues at Tiso are helpful, although it has been many years since I had 1st foot experience of their service...
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
skismurf75, welcome to snowheads!

it is very difficult to give you exact information without seeing your feet and the boots, it does firstly sound like the boots may be too big for you, certainly in the upper cuff area, the fact that you have a large amount of space around your calf and you get bruising would suggest that as your leg moves in the boot you 'rock' back and forth in nthe liner/shell which has the effect of impacting the area that gets bruised.

The liners of the Atomic boots have improved dramatically over the past few years (still IMO not the best stock liners out there) but in 02/03 they were pretty soft & spongey so they pack down really quickly.

custom liners are good for some people but only if the shell is correct in the first place, putting a foam or zip fit liner into a shell that is too big will feel great for a week or so then end up loose and sloppy therefore wasting the £160-£200 which you will have spent on them.

With a bit of work it may be possible to take up some volume around the foot and the leg by moving clips and adding a volume reducer plate to the liner / shell. this will work if the boot is the correct size, but it is important to remember that the boot must not only be the correct length, but the correct width and volume as well. adding material will only work effectively if you are taking up volume in specific areas rather than the whole boot.

all in all if there are a couple of areas that need to have volumes reduced then it should be possible to make the boot function properly for you, if however the boot is too big then bite the bullet and start with a new boot.

hope this helps a bit, the SMALL or LARGE ZOOKEEPERS may be along to add their experiences to this in the near future Little Angel
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
David & CEM

Thanks both for taking the time you have on your replies. As I suspected, it looks like the solution will not be easily achieved and certainly, unless I can find a really good, genuinely knowledgable bootfitter, I could still make the wrong decision.

David, Blues originally fitted the boots - their Glasgow store is closed 'til Oct whilst they relocate. Perhaps I'm being over critical but would now be dubious about starting over with them.

General opinion on the forums seems to be to avoid S&R / EB so, short of a trip down south or to Chamonix (have been considering this for later in summer anyway), I feel a bit stuck. Does anyone know of any decent independent retailers north of the border?

My other thought is to start from scratch during trip to 3V next season - we're staying in Meribel. I bought (after testing) some Scrambler 8's from Freeride in Courch this year - ski wise they seemed to know their stuff. I wonder if anyone has direct experience of buying boots from them, or if there are any other recommended shops in resort. (I realise there'll be loads of shops but, having done a season, also know that the service you get varies between stores).

Sorry guys, I just seem to be finding more questions rolling eyes
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
HAve you tried summits or Nevis sport. Hopefully someone will have info on whether they can be trusted.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
Edmundh009 wrote:
HAve you tried summits or Nevis sport. Hopefully someone will have info on whether they can be trusted.

Thanx!

Had forgotten about Nevis Sports, not heard of Summits - where do I find them?

Sorry, very lazy, just found them thru Google! Embarassed
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Quote:

General opinion on the forums seems to be to avoid S&R / EB

Don't think this is fair. I had my boots fitted at EB in Milton Keynes adn so have all my friends adn couldnt be happier with the boots. Give them a chance. The big guys sell more boots than anyone else in a year so they must be doing something right.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Viceversa, glad your happy with your boots, but it's like buying a computer from PC World, hockey stick/cricket bat from JJB, rather than a decent online retailer or your local specialist sports shop respectively.

I'm not going to sit here and bash EB but compared to specialist, non-chain fitters there's not a great deal of competition (or choice). Had my boots fitted at Ski-Bilek (I live in Germany), a company many people have had positive experiences on ebay with, and have nothing but the highest praise.

Also gave me the chance to go a bit wobbly at the knees looking at next years skis.... Must Not Buy any More Sad Sad Sad Space/Funds do not permit
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
alecl, That is a bit unfair on EB. They have fairly low staff turnover, the same people have been working in my local branch for around ten years. I have also skied with some of them.

I would be quite happy for them to fit boots for me.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
rjs wrote:
alecl, That is a bit unfair on EB. They have fairly low staff turnover, the same people have been working in my local branch for around ten years. I have also skied with some of them.

I would be quite happy for them to fit boots for me.



In retrospect maybe slightly harsh but I would still probably not buy boots there. I've no doubt that there are some great members of staff working at their various branches but nonetheless I'm not sure they could square up to a dedicated fitter in terms of service and experience. I just wouldn't want to take the chance with something as important as my boots.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Quote:

In retrospect maybe slightly harsh but I would still probably not buy boots there. I've no doubt that there are some great members of staff working at their various branches but nonetheless I'm not sure they could square up to a dedicated fitter in terms of service and experience. I just wouldn't want to take the chance with something as important as my boots.Sat Jul 08, 06 20:37


I know for a fact that EB has one of the UKs best fitters working in there Castleford shop and that has been said on snowheads before. His name escapes me now but i had some footbeds from him at the london ski show which are amazing. Yes these style of chain shops are never goin to offer what a profeet can but its not fair to write them off just because they are not a local shop, if anything this would make me think they are succesful because they are good at what they do.

Quote:

Also gave me the chance to go a bit wobbly at the knees looking at next years skis.... Must Not Buy any More Space/Funds do not permit


Was in my local ski shop in MK today and they have 06/07 K2 skis in stock already. Very tempting!!!!
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Quote:
its not fair to write them off just because they are not a local shop, if anything this would make me think they are succesful because they are good at what they do.

...

Was in my local ski shop in MK today and they have 06/07 K2 skis in stock already. Very tempting!!!!



Yup think I should probably retract the quite scathing bit about EB. Was trying to say that personally I prefer to go somewhere not part of a chain where you would get the benefit of dealing with someone whose life has been spent putting boots on people's feet... service at EB is good, but still stand by what I said, if it came out the wrong way. Embarassed

Sorry to have waded into this thread and turned it into an EB one by a poorly articulated opinion!!

Will nip down to EB MK when I'm back in the UK and spend some money as a peace offering wink
Although not on a whole pair of skis Sad
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Viceversa, alecl, not wanting to get into EB, S&R bashing argument but IMHO and experience, biased by being in London where they do have (or seem to) high staff turnover then I wouldn't touch them with a bargepole.

I recently sat with a mate buying touring boots and the fitter admitted that he only had one seasons experience and that he'd pitied the poor fools he'd fitted boots with at the start of the season.

Not very inspiring.

This in a "flagship" store of one of the "large" chains.

skismurf75, sounds like Blues may have got the initial fit right but as CEM suggests the boots have packed down. I'd give them a chance to rectify before doing anything else. They may even have some sort of comfort guarantee.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I had my boots fitted at the EB in CAS, and the guy there (believe he's also the manager) knew what he was doing and the expierience was positive.
The boots fit like a dream and have had no problems, other than people takin' the wee wee 'cause they're bright blue! Smile
Can't reccommend them more, especially in comparison to that Ski & Outdoor Warehouse place that's near Xscape; "a specialist shop."

Also, from enquiring about a job there, it seems they put people in specialist areas; ie. as a skiier I myself would have been a boot fitter, and he explained that there is a fair bit of training to go with it; so yeah, you don't get the expierience of fitting boots day-in day-out with some of the staff, but they all have a fair bit of expierience in their department.
:]

^my 2 cents. NehNeh
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
How much room is there between your heel and the shell of the boot when you snug your toes against the front of the boot with the liners out?
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
skismurf75, I can recommend the bootfitting at Freeride in the 3V highly. I had excellent footbeds made at the Courchevel branch in April.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
skismurf75, ive not really been following this thread too closely so missed your question re boot fitters northof the border... you could try Rob Edmunds at Mountain spirit in Aviemore (they sell trouring and telemark kit but he is a good fitter and as he does not sell alpine boots will give you an honest opinion) or if he is not around speak to Fergus Paton in Cairngorm mountain sports, Fergus is one of the other C Peds. in the UK, i don't have numbers to hand for either but should be really easy to find.

i know they are not on the doorstep but they are a bit closer than here or chamonix Toofy Grin
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