 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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samharris, I'm off to a wedding on Saturday as well. Bad timing, not only do we miss the fun in Aldershot but there will be many brides getting cross with their new husbands huddled round TV sets watching the England game with their mates 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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SHello, it's good for them to get used to it. 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I had an email from the organiser to say that once she receives my application then this training event on the 1st July will be full.
So if you are still contemplating it, then sadly it is now too late.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Ray Zorro, Oh good, so now I have the perfect excuse not to ski, and just take the photos 
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IncogSkiSno, hmmm I fear that I am going to make a huge fool of myself, so that doesn't bode well 
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Dunk,
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do you think motorcycle leathers and a full face helmet is suitable protection?
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No - you'll be way too hot ! 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Now that the event is fully subscribed I can safely ask this: At what times in the weekend will members of Snowheads be there? I am interested in saying hello and in watching the skiing, but I am not keen on skiing slalom myself.
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Adrian, I think the skiing is only on Saturday...in the afternoon. We need pics and a report !
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Adrian, It is from 2:00 to about 6:30. It will be good to meet you  .
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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ski, may have to leave the leathers at home can not get skis, boots and poles in my tank bag  Looks like shorts and t-shirt(both long)
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You know it makes sense.
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Adrian, I shall be watching only, perhaps we could meet up?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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IncogSkiSno, Adrian, (and any others), the slope(s) will still be open for recreational skiing, so you could still come equipped for a ski.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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GrahamN, Good luck on Saturday and Sunday....I'll be on my bike doing the National Rally (def the only in that).
See you Brentwood next week ?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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GrahamN, I would still love to know how the fast guys get so much grip.
As you say I'm sure talent (not me) helps. Also, I expect you have seen the amount of time some take on ensuring V sharp edges. As my children have progressed theirs are now almost like razor blades (my job).
Good luck on Sunday.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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gsb, Sharp edge4s help, but the truly talented can get grip on round edges Too.. Grrrrr
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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easiski, I'm only talented in my dreams so no chance of ever being 'truly'
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We had a hot sunny afternoon at the Aldershot dry slope, and wasn't it dry! The sun baked down, I am glad I spent most of the time in the shade of some trees watching the overdressed, for the time of year, skiers getting hotter and hotter. Had a great conversation with IncogSkiSno. Enjoyed meeting and seeing Graham, Ray and Duncan showing their skiing skills. All of the hard work spectating meant I had to leave to get some nourishment before the skiers finished. But, the skiers looked strong as they continued hurtling down the slopes.
PS. Does "hurtling" derive from "hurt"? One of the non-Snowhead participants had a might tumble today and looked to be hurt. Happpily, after a couple of minutes she got up and skied on.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I would like to echo Adrian's, comments it has been a fun afternoon (and I even got to watch the penalties  )
It was a well organised event and started off with some fitness training led by Margot Wells - wife of Alan Wells, Olympic gold medallist in the 100m at the Moscow Olympics (from memory that last bit, so may not be right). She certainly knew what she was talking about and has made me determined to get fit, as well as showing me how to.
Skiing on plastic is a bit of a dark art and its a long time since I have done it so it took many runs before I felt even half OK There were some seriously good looking skiers there though (ability and not looks) and I felt rather inferior... Still, I learned a lot (even if the primary message seemed to be to not bother trying to take this too seriously) and it was fun.
Good to finally meet GrahamN, Adrian, Dunk and Narrowlast. I think that Adrian's spot in the shade was the preferred option, even if it meant being next to IncogSkiSno.
Thanks for making me do it GrahamN. You never know, I may be back, but don't hold your breath 
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I'd have liked to have come up to see the fun but I've done something to my back and have hardly been able to walk for the last 3 days
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Well, that was hot! Not only the afternoon session, but the edging and waxing of the skis I've now finished ready for tomorrow - so now I can relax a bit. It was great to meet Adrian and Dunk, and put faces at long last to Incogskibabe and Daddy Zit - neither of whom looked remotely like I imagined! First words to me from Incogskisno were that she regretted not putting her boots in the car, but after seeing the heat out there maybe those regrets faded a bit.
It's a pity there was such a long period when it looked like not a lot was happening - this was when they were trying (vainly) to sort out the electronic timing apparatus for the timed race bit. This does seem to be an integral part of every race I've been at so far (eventually they resorted to the good old hand-signals and stop-watch bit). Shame on you though Zorro for skipping out the bit with the poles - I saw you skulking around in the trees there - that's the fun bit! And it's a pity you left before the end as Dunk got the wipeout of the day award - no competition came even close (Ah I see he's posted while I've been writing War'n'Peace Part III). Excellent Dunk - result! - see you soon.
I guess ski training is not the most enthralling spectator sport in the world, and well done you two for sticking it out. I would thoroughly recommend the head-to-head racing though that happens in the afternoon at SRSA races (i.e. tomorrow from about 13:30 at Aldershot Adrian, if you fancy another bit of exercise on that bike, or on 15th Sept at So'ton, Incogskisno) - immense competitive spirit and skiing flat out and beyond (and hence the odd spill too) right from the 8 year olds up to the superfast 15-18 year olds (and the odd old git trying to keep up too).
Ray Zorro, from what I saw you're at just the right level that some sustained practice on plastic would do you a world of good. Skiing around obstacles on Dendix is not so much a black art as a certain way of getting instant feedback whenever you do anything the slightest bit wrong (and from what I felt at Bracknell last week Permasnow is even more so, but one needs to be at a higher starting point there thatn on Dendix otherwise I think it could get very frustrating). I think a bit of that kind of practice would completely transform your skiing. So lets c ya!
I was pleasantly surprised that we all met up with no apparent problems - maybe the name tags helped, as we could make at least some guess from usernames (although traslation into real-world was I guess not exactly rocket science in the case of Dunk and me). In the "post match analysis", I also twigged that the clearly way out best skier on the day was Richard from Bath/Pontypool that easiski had mentioned as a possible for the PSB. He sounded pretty keen to come to me, so that looks like another . Mary (the organiser) also made mention to me about our discussion we've been having here, so we're clearly being watched . So Mary'N'Tom, stop lurking, do what easiski's been telling you and SIGN UP HERE!!!!
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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IncogSkiSno, funnily enough, as I was standing at the top of that slope with the sweat running down my brow (almost as fast as Tesco's cheapest washing up liquid was running down my bases ) the concept of being the recipient of a nice cool Pimms was not one that sperung immediately to mind . It felt way hotter up there today, but in a race you do only spend a few minutes up there, 10 secs-ish charging down the slope, and then another 30-60 minutes resting in the shade of the trees before your next go.
Things went OK today - another good consolidation, with an improvement of about 2% on the leader's time over last time. Three more clear runs down the slope, but this time all within 0.1 sec - so clearly I've now got what I'm doing taped, but need to sort a it's a technique/line problem. Unfortunately I still can't seem to reproduce in races the technique that I catch at the end of our training sessions. The bu%%er is that this only seems to kick in on the last two or three runs of the session, so we have to pack up just when I really need to stick another 10-20 runs down the slope while in the groove.
I bet if that photo of me was more face on, you'd see me in a pretty horrible A-frame there too. I'd pretty much got rid of it a few months ago, but at the expense of a huge inside ski lead, which was causing the inside hip to swivel in front of my body, my outer leg to over-straighten, push out and skid too much. In the last couple of weeks I've been trying to straighten the hips over the skis by bringing the outside ski further forward (which works fantastically when I can do it, also really gives an excellent feeling of railing on the edge and driving through and out of the turn), but I think I'm now letting the inside knee drift back in at the same time - so undoing all that good stuff. Hands also way too far back - I should be punching the metaphorical pole there with my inside [edit: oops that should read outside] hand - and actually everything's too far back (something that seems to be corrected fairly well by that pole punch)! I think there's a stubby stump just in front of me (the first one of a hairpin), so I'm also really late on the turn there - so probably my natural reactions have kicked in there and am worrying more about emergency measures to try and get back on course line (which now I do seem to be able to do in hairpins) than anything else.
I found that training course really tight (it was deliberately so) and it brought out some pretty bad habits. I know what Tom was trying to do with that, but it didn't actually help a tremendous amout with getting a sense of flow down a typical regional race course - the one he set up afterward with the poles was much more typical (and certainly better for me where I am at the moment). It was really interesting though seeing how Richard handled it (BTW he couldn't carve through that course either). After coming through the gate he essentially carved out across the slope keeping as high as possible until he got directly above the gate, then did a quick swivel turn to point down the slope (by which time he was outside the gate), then could start a carve straight down through and high under the gate to the repeat the process for the next one. It looked a pretty long route, but did manage to keep speed up throughout. The rest of us mostly just tried the good old panic swivel just above/around the gate.
Go on Adrian post what you will. I know I said I'd like to vet your pics first, but I'm sure I can take the derision!
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Mon 3-07-06 8:41; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Fantastic thread guys.
GrahamN, I guess that I'm going to have to get some practice for next years EOSB?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| slikedges....on another thread wrote: |
| However i'm told over-concentrating on slalom technique can be detrimental to general skiing |
sure, but I think "over-concentrating" is WAY above anything we're talking about here. It would also be bad if that was the only thing you ever ski, or if you only ever ski on plastic. (It was interesting that at Christchurch some of the skiers were having problems with pressure management on the couple of gentle rollers they have on the slope there, whereas I never noticed them at all when skiing down - possibly because I ski so much off-piste).
| slikedges wrote: |
| I gather it gives you a tendency to overturn your skis and with modern technique to not counter so much, both of which may be unhelpful in longer or wider or faster types of turns. Actually I'm sure there's a balance point, up to which it is helpful and over which it begins to be potentially counterproductive. After all proper WC slalom racers do a lot more technical training than just slalom gates. |
Over turning? Don't believe it at all. Yes I overturn, but overturn for slalom courses too, but that came from skiing steep off-piste rather than skiing courses. What it does do is:
- force you to concentrate on making the entire arc of the turn work for you - as you have no time to just let the skis run
- get much more dynamic in body movements, but make them smoother at the same time (jerk a movement and you just start sliding sideways)
- become far more aware of the balance between inside and outside ski, and how pressure on each affects the turn (get it wornd and you just start sliding sideways)
- start making turns earlier and make them longer and smoother (i.e. exactly opposite to the over-turn argument, try turning too tight you lose speed and may just start sliding sideways)
- greatly increase your awareness of where all the bits of your body are - assuming they're not scattered all over the slope - as get balance wrong and you just....(you can probably fill in the next bit )
- forces your feet, reactions and general speed of movement to step up several gears, as you have to be starting on the next turn well before finishing the current one.
- improve your forward planning. Ideally you should be looking at least 2-3 gates ahead of the one you're currently going through (although I currently have enough of a problem worrying about the next 1-2). I think skiing moguls does the same thing on both the last two points.
Also can't understand how the "not countering" point relates to "unhelpful in longer or wider or faster types of turn" - the longer the turn and the faster you run the less you want to counter anyway?
The one counterproductive effect I've seen is that you angulate the body (at the hips/waist) far more than you should of skiing deep off-piste, when your body should be straighter and banked (anathema to a slalom coach). The other one that I've heard others raise as a problem is that "slalom skiers never finish a turn", but I think we did a whole load on what constitutes "finishing" a turn some way back.
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Yoda, you must know me from another life, trees, fences, pylons, lifts, people have all been in danger from me but barbed wire I can not remember. ESC obviously my previous life.
GrahamN, excellent analysis, standing at the top I was trying to think of many of the points you made in your last post, unfortunatley in practice, my mind turned to jelly as soon as I set off. More practice needed. ( 600 reps I think Tom said)
IncogSkiSno,No injuries, plenty of body mass to protecty delicate bone. The chuntering was me trying to get my body to do what it was supposed to do, by shouting at my legs, arms etc they seemed to obey me better. Ther must be some deep rooted physcological explaination for this. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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GrahamN, firstly, as you know my post was in answer to Ray's question of but did I know why it might be detrimental, and to indicate I didn't fully understand, my answer actually started
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| Ray Zorro, not exactly, I gather it gives you... |
Secondly, this was told me by a BASI 2 who had previously been part of the national dry slope race scene. He wasn't saying that any and all dry slope racing can only ever be bad for you, just that too much wasn't good for general skiing and that seems intuitively right to me. I haven't overthought it as it isn't really relevant to me. BTW by overturn, he meant overuse of the turning component of getting a ski to turn, not the turn shape or body position.
Lastly, didn't PG or Martin Bell or someone post some piccies a few months ago showing how new technique in WC racing meant that there is more countering in GS/Super G than in slaloming?
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slikedges, (Don't want to start a war or anything)....
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He wasn't saying that any and all dry slope racing can only ever be bad for you, just that too much wasn't good for general skiing
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I've heard this a lot... I would say that on straight skis, (and the straight courses we used to ski on ) you'd have a point...but probably not anymore. It is the case that too much of anything will be detrimental to skiing (like anything else)... but for recreational skiers, given the limited opportunities to practise that we have here, on balance, and if you enjoy it, racing will not do anyone (or their skiing) any harm.
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FAQ
It was great to finally meet 
I do hope you weren't injured. 