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Lyon - Tignes , Speed cameras , Snow chains

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Are there any/many speed cameras on-route between Lyon & Tignes. The only time ive been caught speeding was my 1 ski trip to France , Geneva-Flaine , apparently its a hotspot for it I later found out .

I may of been lucky but never had the need for show chains ,
How strict are they
How much would french Supermarket chains cost , ( the rental ones Are a bit steep 1/2 the price of are car rental )
Going 5th-9th March


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Fri 27-01-23 8:03; edited 1 time in total
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Yes, lots of cameras and you should have chains, the village roads are still white. Yes they are available in Bourg at Super U and Roady
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Probably got caught at the border crossing they are very hot their and it's only 30 km towards the actual border. Why arent the hire company providing chains?
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robs1 wrote:
Why arent the hire company providing chains?

They are not required in Lyon.
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robs1 wrote:
Probably got caught at the border crossing they are very hot their and it's only 30 km towards the actual border. Why arent the hire company providing chains?


They will kindly rent us a pair for £65 , the car hire is only £125

Have seen some un-used snow socks on FB marketplace £8 which seem to fit many different wheel sizes
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rjs wrote:
robs1 wrote:
Why arent the hire company providing chains?

They are not required in Lyon.

Not often but as an option they will/should have them.

See from the op they do but at a stupid price
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@wasley, …in FRANCE we have switched our minds to ‘not pressing on…just obey speed limit’ mode. And setting the speed warning on the Yeti’s dash to 80kph. That avoids getting camera-flashed from the tedious cameras around Pontarlier, mounted on gentle downslopes where speed inevitably creeps above 80kph inadvertently….

The local municipalities now have ‘pick them up with a tractor and put them somewhere surprising’ cameras in big metal housings…trying to speed and then second-guess locations just doesn’t work in our experience.
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Quote:

Are there any/many speed cameras on-route between Lyon & Tignes.


I can think of four / I'm sure there's more / take your time / and you'll be fine.

Chains:for sure / it's now the law / or winter tyres / from your local suppliers
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@wasley,
How strict are they?
If the snow's coming down & laying on the road then the police can stop traffic by a chaining area & insist chains are put on. Those who haven't got them get turned back down the mountain.
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So i dont get caught out looks like ill set the cruise control to 80Kph

looks like BOURG-SAINT-MAURICE have a few supermarkets , but as im arriving on a Sunday they seem to shut around noon . Do Lidl sell snow chains or best try one of the other super markets??
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https://www.la-plagne.com/decouvrir-la-plagne/pratique/commerces-services/supermarche-e-leclerc on main route between Moutiers and BsM that you'd arrive to earlier, else if pushed for time on Sunday closing, then many outlets at Albertville as you'll pass through there first.
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@wasley, If it looks like you will need chains buy them asap. The closer you get to resorts the less there will be in the shops as everyone else will be buying and its near to the end of season so stocks will be low. Start looking at Chambery - the ChamNord complex has a large supermarket and a Feu Vert which is like Halfords.
OR if you know roughly what size hire car you are getting buy snow socks from Halfords and put in cabin bag if you don't use them they will happily take them back and refund you. French shops wont!
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boredsurfin wrote:
@wasley, If it looks like you will need chains buy them asap. The closer you get to resorts the less there will be in the shops as everyone else will be buying and its near to the end of season so stocks will be low. Start looking at Chambery - the ChamNord complex has a large supermarket and a Feu Vert which is like Halfords.
OR if you know roughly what size hire car you are getting buy snow socks from Halfords and put in cabin bag if you don't use them they will happily take them back and refund you. French shops wont!


Just a minor point, he'll need chains in the car before he arrives in the Savoie. I doubt there is much risk on the motorways in March but still.

I'm not convinced you'll find any snowchains in French supermarkets in March though. Maybe in Norauto or Fer Vert but it is France and they won't be open on Sunday.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

if you know roughly what size hire car you are getting buy snow socks from Halfords

Could try that , Ive booked a fiesta,208,corsa size car. Or as i mentioned theres a new set on FB marketplace £8 they seem to fit many sizes
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Do the French police accept snow socks instead of chains?
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Yes
You need winter tyres, or snow chains, or snow socks
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
By taking out the chain hire with your car rental company, you're transferring the responsibility to them for providing some on the day, and of the right type for the vehicle. If they can't provide the chains for that car, then they have to provide a car which can. It's their problem, not yours. If you don't do that, then you're taking on that responsibility and task to yourself. If you do so, then you need to be sure that the car you're given can even take chains (some won't be able to). If it can take chains then you have to find some, somewhere (which may take some time, and could be unsuccessful). If you can't get chains then (a) you may not be allowed to proceed by the police if conditions are bad and (b) you will have problems driving if the conditions are bad, even if [a] doesn't apply. Is all this worth the saving? It's your decision alone to make - no one can tell you that you'll be fine on the day: it's meaningless advice.

Whatever car you've nominally booked is no indication at all of the wheel/tyre size. It's only meant as a general guideline. Chains will fit a range of sizes but as you can see form any website, choosing any one chainset doesn't guarantee it'll fit the car you are given.

Snow socks are for cars with summer tyres: effectively converting them into winters, up to a point. I don't see the point of them if your rental car is already fitted with winters. And they are sensitive to tyre size more than chains are. They overlap with chains to an extent, but certainly don't go as far as chains do in terms of adverse conditions.

@wasley If you've hired a car that only has summer tyres on then I'd say you have a problem. You'll need socks to 'convert' those tyres to winters. but that's all they'll do, and only up to a point - summers+socks aren't as flexible an as having winters on because of the obvious ability of winters to transition from tarmac to snow/slush and back to tarmac in mixed conditions. And before anyone comments that socks can do that, remember that at a minimum, you'll have to stop and put them on initially, and that they won't survive that long on tarmac if the conditions are cyclic. Winters will also go further as conditions become more adverse. And if you hit an icy slope, then you'll need chains whether you have winters or summers+socks (my chains on winters use has always been on prosaically short, steep slopes in the resort which have suffered freeze/thaw).


Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Sat 28-01-23 9:31; edited 3 times in total
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@LaForet, Thanks that's really useful. I'm not assuming it'll be 'OK on the day' at that time of year (Xmas week); haven't hired anything yet, just weighing up options at the moment-taking snow socks and hiring a car on French side Geneva or Lyon, to avoid the prices for car hire from the Swiss Side right now-they are eye watering-£500 more than one the French side. Not many of the hire companies seem to offer snow chains as an 'extra' which is surprising, and in any case, I gather socks are a lot easier to put on than chains.
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@snowhound I appreciate that it's very often a really difficult judgement to make, because you're weighing up very different factors and probabilities. I'd say that the ideal is a car with winter tyres and chains. It will satisfy all legal and Gendarmerie requirements and take you as far as is feasible in terms of worsening winter conditions, before you have to fit chains. Which is something no one wants to do and which even locals will defer doing until there's absolutely no alternative.

The problem comes if that ideal is either not on offer (winters, but no chains available) and/or is hugely expensive compared to a lesser option (like summers + chains). Of course, I'm stating the obvious, and not giving people a way of reconciling the alternatives, but that's the nature of the decision unfortunately i.e. if you can't get/afford the ideal, then how do you choose between the alternatives?

One other issue is what do you do if you've booked the ideal combination (winters+chains) but when you turn up they say they have no chains available, or say that the vehicle "doesn't need chains"? This has happened to me a couple of times. In both cases it was because I'd booked or been upgraded to an SUV/4x4, many of which cannot take chains on their fat wheels. This taught me never to book an SUV/4x4 but always to go for a more conventional, mainstream estate or saloon where the odds of being able to take chains on the wheels is much higher. When a rental rep' says "it doesn't need chains" what they almost always really mean is that "it can't take chains, even though we have ones that nominally fit the tyre size".


Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Sat 28-01-23 9:21; edited 1 time in total
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@LaForet, Appreciated. We normal ski at Easter so this is not really an issue. Decided to take the plunge-early flights to Geneva to allow driving during day, and book hire care with chains (Rentalcars offer them as an option on their website) from the French side. Have free cancellation so if Swiss prices come down over the next few months, will cancel that booking and rebook Swiss side with winters. Cheers.
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snowhound wrote:
@LaForet, Thanks that's really useful. I'm not assuming it'll be 'OK on the day' at that time of year (Xmas week); haven't hired anything yet, just weighing up options at the moment-taking snow socks and hiring a car on French side Geneva or Lyon


legally a car hired on the French side of the airport at Geneva must have winter tires - whether it really will is another question

I probably wasn't clear enough above but you WILL NOT FIND chains to buy on a Sunday in March. You might find Lilos, swimming pool kits, bikinis.
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@davidof, Thanks, I didn't realise this was the case. I thought it was just in Switzerland where they were legally required, and only in certain areas in France. So I presume Geneva is within one of those mandated areas?
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snowhound wrote:
@davidof, Thanks, I didn't realise this was the case. I thought it was just in Switzerland where they were legally required, and only in certain areas in France. So I presume Geneva is within one of those mandated areas?


Yes Ferney Volaire, you need snow tires to the 31st March - or chains / socks. Same for Chambery airport.

That is not the case for Lyon or Grenoble but I don't know about Grenoble airport (it was covered in snow on Tuesday and is situated in a frost pocket).
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@davidof, Ah, so the car might not have winter tyres fitted, but will have chains included in the rental?
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snowhound wrote:
@davidof, Ah, so the car might not have winter tyres fitted, but will have chains included in the rental?


it should do, but this is France.
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I know my opinion would be wildly unpopular but I would wait for the weather forecast. It is very accurate for the next day or so. If there are no tons of snow predicted I wouldn’t bother with chains or socks. If the snow is predicted maybe worth taking it from the car rental company. Booking chains in advance does not guarantee they give it to you. It’s all in small print - that these optional extras are subject to availability. So if they don’t have them they’d say how sorry they are. And if they do have them they will happily take £50 off you for the privilege.

Alternatively buy them in a supermarket or a petrol station is likely to have them. Snow socks for £8 is not a bad idea. There are only about 3-4 sizes for snow socks, and most likely a rental car would fit the most popular size.

No guarantees in any of that but it’s just managing risks. Absolute worst to happen you will sleep in a hotel in a valley and get the chains from a proper parts shop. They open 8am so no skiing time is wasted. But again how likely all this is to happen
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@alexsas, Return journey a week later? I've needed chains to get back down the hill on a few occasions.
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It’s all about risks management and peace of mind. If serious snow is forecast the worst is to travel down to buy chains one evening. Quite often a shop in a resort would have some chains as well.

What I am trying to say it’s all about managing the risks and willingness to insure oneself for the feeling it’s all covered.

My view is snow chains are not likely to be needed, and there are ways of getting them with various degrees of luck and inconvenience.

It’s not for everyone, and if the peace of mind is the most important by all means a person can book the chains with the car (but I would still be prepared to be self-reliant as the car rentals fail people all the time with child seats, snow chains and sometimes even not having cars)
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You know it makes sense.
@alexsas, Yes, you can look at it that way, but you would be breaking the law. Bit like you could risk manage not having an MOT.
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@alexas
You really rely on forecasts for the alps?
And assume you will be lucky enough to find somewhere to buy them just around the corner on the alpine road you got stuck on ?
I wonder how much driving you have done in the alps perhaps you just been lucky!
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My view - and it's obviously only that - is that you are taking an expensive trip to the Alps in winter in order to ski on snow. You hope that snow has fallen recently in order to top-up the pistes. And it would also be nice if it snowed a bit while you were in the resort. And if it kept sub-zero at least at night to preserve the pistes. So this is an intrinsically cold and snowy scenario. What you hope is that on the two days that you travel - dates over which you have no leeway and must drive - it isn't cold or snowing, and that you can get into and out of your parking on dry tarmac. But what are the odds of this happening, versus encountering a snowy/icy type problem? For me, the money saved on skimping on winter tyres and chains, given the probabilities and consequences of encountering snow/ice, don't seem worth the risk. But of course, that's my working of the equation. Other people are going to weight the factors differently.
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snowhound wrote:
Do the French police accept snow socks instead of chains?

In my experience if the police are stopping & checking it's chains or go back down the mountain. Luckily I always had chains.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
snowornever wrote:
@alexas
You really rely on forecasts for the alps?
And assume you will be lucky enough to find somewhere to buy them just around the corner on the alpine road you got stuck on ?
I wonder how much driving you have done in the alps perhaps you just been lucky!

if you read my post, you would not have come to the conclusion that I expect the chains to be available around the corner. What I was saying is that there is always a solution - with the ultimate being spending a night in the valley before auto parts shops open in the morning, but this is the worst case. In all likelihood, the chains won't be needed at all or can be obtained at a car rental place, or at a petrol station if supermarkets are shut.

If snow is substantial enough to require chains, it will show in the forecast - I am talking about a few hours out, not days or weeks in advance. Even in the Alps. There won't be a snow dump out of the blue without some indications that it would happen in the next day or two (more likely snowfall won't happen than it just appears out of nowhere).

I drove enough to experience all the scenarios I have talked about:
a rental company not having chains despite booking,
was given wrong chains for a tyre size,
and have had a need to stay in the valley because I happen to have a very exotic tyre size and I could not get neither chains nor socks from a supermarket and had to wait for proper car parts shops to open in the morning).

Although 9 times out of 10 the roads were clear and no chains were needed at all.


Having said that, it is everyone's personal choice how they go about it. I personally refuse to pay £50 to a hire shop for something that costs 30 euros and I am unlikely to use, and have a strategy of getting should I need to, but I respect another point of view that it's the insurance worth paying to be 100% compliant and having a peace of mind that you don't need to run around a foreign land trying to find the chains. I would only warn that a hope of getting (correct) chains from a hire shop is just a hope that may or may not materialise.
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@alexsas, You are still proposing breaking the law. Winter tyres or chains are required everywhere in Savoie.
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rjs wrote:
@alexsas, You are still proposing breaking the law. Winter tyres or chains are required everywhere in Savoie.

I am not disputing that this is the law to have chains or tyres in the region.
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You do need to check that chains fit - they don't always! And it's not only in fresh, heavy, snow that they are needed. Local roads canstill have a big build up of icy snow some days after it's fallen with re-frozen slushy puddles and if you have a car with chains instead of winter tyres (perfectly legal and quite likely in Lyon or Ferney Voltaire) the chances of having to fit chains on the summer tyres, perhaps just for the last 100 metres or so to your accommodation, is not negligible. I think relying on a weather forecast for your arrival day is a worthwhile risk - but harder for departure, and shops in resorts (ski shops typically sell chains) are not going to be a cheap option.
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After all that palaver, the Mrs has agreed to go the week before Christmas after all, so car hire just about affordable from Swiss side Geneva- with winter tyres and £25 extra for chains. If it drops in price, will rebook later in the year.
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