 Poster: A snowHead
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My knees are giving me right gyp. They weren't too bad this winter but have a history of aching when I've been skiing too much, walking a lot.
It's probably because my legs are delightfully slender while my upper body is muscle-packed (hmm?).
I currently pop glucosamine tablets and fish oil capsules, can these improve things or will they just slow the rate of decline?
I know the better course of action would be to build up the muscle around the knees and did this before last winter (which is probably why they weren't so bad then) but wanted to know if there was a lazy man's solution to this.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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ben wright, I'd be interested to hear too - my left one started to twinge again last week, and I was hobbling a bit at the weekend.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ben wright, Wear The Fox Hat,
1 Does Gucosamine work? its a shell extract from shellfish and gives the same benefit as Ibuprofen in symptoms from mild to moderate osteoarthritis (wear and tear). There seems little benefit in paying out for the chondroitin enhanced version ifrom published clinical trials. Look here for more info
2. Is it right for you? Dunno in short. Knee pain can be caused by wear and tear, inflammed structures around the knee (plica, Hoffa's pad, Pes anserinus bursa), tight hamstrings, poor muscle balance, malalignment, foot pronation.....
I'd suggest seeing a sports physio for an assessment or a doctor with a sports medicine qualification to get yourself diagnosed and sorted with an action plan. 4 months to sort it out and you should be fine!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I don't take anything for it (apart from rubbing in some ibulieve so I can get to sleep at night)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Martin Nicholas, I started taking Glucosamine just before coming back here for the summer, and have found significantly less aching in certain joints. My friend who has (very young) osteoarthritis in his knees says that it's more than twice as effective when taken in conjunction with Chondroitin. I've ordered a mix today and will let you know! Of course I'm not a doctor, but have often found that certain complementary medicines or herbs have more benefit than the clinical trials suggest.
It seems you have to pay to read what's on the link, sorry, I didn't.
ben wright, As far s I understand it, all the stuff in the world may slow the rate of decline, but is unlikely to cure it completely. Get out and do the work!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Interestingly there is a school of thought that suggests Non steroidal Anti-inflammatories (NSAIDs) may accellerate the cartilage damage in osteoarthritis, which is really a disease of cartilage. easiski, sorry the link to clinical evidence doesn't work - I have the benefit of the NHS net to get into these things.
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Get out and do the work!
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- quite true, OA hurts less if the supporting and stabilising muscles around a worn joint are strong and flexible .
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The only thing that sees me through the winter with heavy pounding on my knees is a Glucosamine/Chondroitin 500mg/400mg combination.
3 tablets a day so 1500mg/1200mg total.
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veeeight, One cure - stop skiing bumps! I think you must be doing a fair bit of this if you're pounding your knees.
Incidentally, most of my mountain colleagues are all finding that we have much less knee trouble since the advent of the carving ski. Could be that there's not so much stress in snowplough as with longer skis, or it could be that we don't have to twist anything anymore to turn, or simply that we don't have to make the effort.
Martin Nicholas, I could have joined for 48 hours, but I've just spent a fortune on my next couple of packets of the above!!!! I shall look for other information about this. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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an easy solution would be to go to a scholl shop and ask them to check your foot arches. If they've "fallen" that will put a lot of stress on the knee. foot supports may help
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Get mega fit, loose loads of weight, build up the quads and hammies. I should know...........................its what I should have done 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Unfortunately I've found after a particularly bad winter that my dodgy knee has a cartilage tear so arthroscopy here I come. Any questions I should be asking pre-op? Rehab time experience? The consultant has already said it will be the minimum amount of cartilage he can get away with and will leave the outer intact.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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veeeight, One cure - stop skiing bumps!
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I would like to, but those pesky clients keep insisting on wanting to learn!! 
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You know it makes sense.
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fatbob,
Have a look at this UK website and click on "my operation". There is a link to rehab as well.
I should confess to taking Glucosamine which I am convinced helps my dodgy knee (backward twisting fall, Zermatt 1984 - stretched cruciate) and also a magnetic wrist band about which I am less sure, but the dog doesn't limp when he wears his magnetic collar!
Good luck - and think about prehabilitation - the stronger and more flexible your muscles are pre-op the faster you will get back to useful muscle bulk post op. Thinks about swimming / water running or cycling as your pain allows. Let us know how it goes....
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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For my sins, I have (a fortunately very mild dose of) a joint disease called 'ankylosing spondylitis' which, whilst not Osteoarthritis, gives similar symptoms in a range of joints. In addition to NSAID's which I have taken for 25 years, I have taken Glucosamine / Chondroitin for a year or so and I'm convinced they have helped with both ease of movement and pain reduction. No empirical proof, of course - there rarely is - but I'm convinced.
As an aside, an aunt of mine has severe osteoarthritis but is unable to take the usually-prescribed anti-inflammatories / painkillers  She has recently been on a clinical trial of a new drug derived from rosehips and reports excellent pain-relief results.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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http://www.kneeguru.co.uk/ & another. I'm sure the way forward is building up quads & hamstrings.
fatbob, good luck - be interested to hear how it goes.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Martin Nicholas,
Reading the article the Comment section suggests better resulst with a "Rotta preparation glucosamine" do you know what they mean by that?
Anecdotally a couple of years ago I had bad ankle pain, both ankles which was worse after exercise - particularly hill walking. I started taking cod liver oil and glucosamine + chondroitin. Left ankle is now pain free, right ankle I occasionally get pain in the top of the foot and the joint clicks when rotating the foot at the ankle joint, but it nows happens much less frequently. Unfortunatley  at the same time I also started taking a lot more exercise and dropped 10kg in weight so the improvement in my ankles may be down to the exercise and weight loss (86kg to 76kg 5ft 10 tall) not the supplements. I almost never take NSAIDs (or other pain relief).
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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ben wright, Try telemarking instead... 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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geri, Interesting site - but it doesn't look particularly patient friendly, mind you the pictures on Sportsinjury.com are a bit to graphic for some!
Rotta is a company name David
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easiski,
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It seems you have to pay to read what's on the link, sorry, I didn't.
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The problem is you are presumably logging in from france - I've just checked the website and it is free from England
<quote>
Free access to CE has been made available for healthcare professionals and the general public by the NLH in England, HOWIS in Wales and NHS Scotland e-Library in Scotland. You can browse the content freely if you are accessing it from England, the HOWIS website in Wales or the e-Library website in Scotland.
Access in the UK (except N.Ireland) is unrestricted provided that your Internet Service Provider (ISP) is based in the UK. If you are accessing the site from England, Scotland or Wales but are prompted for a username and password, please check that your ISP server is based in the UK
</Quote>
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Dave Horsley, thanks for the clarification - that must be it.
fatbob, I had arthroscopy for "floaters" in my knee and it was a doddle. Make sure they tell you how to increase the exercise (aparently I was just supposed to know - long time ago though), and it's no sweat. Mine was around 20 years ago, and I had no trouble at all. I'm sure the op is better and more successful now, although the docs are probably more nanny-like! The knee still protests every now and then, but on the whole a resounding success. I wear a brace if I'm doing bumps or La Grave or heavy deep snow, otherwise nothing.
This thread does seem to be a resounding endorsement of Glucosamine and chondroitine 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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fatbob, pretty sure a friend of mine cycled home after an arthroscopy. I'm sure it depends on the severity of the damage to the cartillage, but I don't think they're too much of a big deal these days. Make sure you get some physio after (and before if you can) and do the exercises they tell you to
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Depends on the arthoscopy. Some quite serious stuff can be done by keyhole. Friend of mine had his joint surfaces made bleed so that the bled areas would scar over and make the surfaces flat again. he was VERY sore afterwards.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Frosty the Snowman, Yuk. But fortunately fatbob, is only having his cartilidge shaved by the sound of it. Shave it off and suck it out I think is what they do..
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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My mother controls her quite severe arthritis solely by natural means - daily dose of cod liver oil & glucosamine tablets & no wheat, caffeine or alcohol in her diet. When she follows this strictly her arthritis is fine - as soon as she starts to cheat on the food intake her arthritis is bad. She's a firm believer in you are what you eat. She does like a drink so it is tricky but she gets round the wheat & caffeine OK.
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Thanks for the encouragement - actually waiting to speak to the consultant post MRI scan to confirm exact nature of the tear. By the fact that I'm not immobilised he seemed to think it might not be too bad following physical inspection only.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Red Leon wrote: |
For my sins, I have (a fortunately very mild dose of) a joint disease called 'ankylosing spondylitis' which, whilst not Osteoarthritis, gives similar symptoms in a range of joints. In addition to NSAID's which I have taken for 25 years, I have taken Glucosamine / Chondroitin for a year or so and I'm convinced they have helped with both ease of movement and pain reduction. No empirical proof, of course - there rarely is - but I'm convinced.
As an aside, an aunt of mine has severe osteoarthritis but is unable to take the usually-prescribed anti-inflammatories / painkillers She has recently been on a clinical trial of a new drug derived from rosehips and reports excellent pain-relief results. |
yeah I'm trying to get a patient with shelfish allergy to try the rosehip out.... could be worth a try I reckon...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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a friend of mine cycled home after an arthroscopy
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So he was the Swedish cliff jumper? If you are having cutting or drilling done it will be sore so get a lift there and back (You aren't legally able to drive for 24 hours after an anaesthetic). If its a hoover out job like easiski, the you should be up and going quite quickly
More info on Rosehip here
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Poster: A snowHead
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Martin Nicholas, Does the 24 hour driving rule include locals? I actually drove to get a local and drove home, but they did tell me to get a lift - nannies to the fore I thought!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Given how I've been feeling, I may just have to call in at the pharmacie on the way home...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Does the 24 hour driving rule include locals
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No, just general anesthetics or sedation
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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easiski,
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Does the 24 hour driving rule include locals?
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I think it is mainly tourists actually
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