Very specific Covid question

A snowHead

I have trawled the interweb and emailed German Consular. No joy.

I had read initially that as a single jabbed 12-17 year old is fully vaccinated in the UK and the app will show this that this will count elsewhere.

Does anyone know if Germany recognises 12-17 year old single jabbed as fully vaccinated in terms of entry and could you post a link to this source please?

Would be a bummer if 2/3 of kids are taken into quarantine!

A snowHead

I’m interested in this for Austria and France as we’re in the same position. Actually he had Covid last month (on his birthday!!) so has yet to get the jab, but wants it. If quarantine is involved, skiing is off again for us this year. Nightmare.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@bambionskiis, that’s a slightly different question as a positive result changes the situation. The op, I can’t help with. You (your son) will be fine as that is a status recognised in both France and Austria.

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I don't think quarantine is necessary right now, but afaik, 2 jabs plus 14 days is what Germany deems as "fully jabbed" for all age bands from age 12+. Or proof of infection and recovery and 1 jab (+ 14 days).

I would expect it might become more of an issue entering establishments such as restaurants than entering the country, since there is a push to permit establishments to determine whether they want only fully jabbed (including proven recovered + 1 jab) or will allow PCR test (performed by a qualified nurse and processed in a licensed lab - none of that self test nonsense here). Might differ in different states of course, since state parliaments have many powers. And there's a Federal Election soon, so things may change again depending on who wins, and how much all the parties have had to lie to appeal to voters.

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Clear as mud on the German Embassy website - very un-Germanic! @andy, seem quarantine is happening right now:

Minor children of third-country nationals are allowed to enter Germany if they are fully vaccinated or if there is an urgent need to travel. They have to go into quarantine on arrival, but can end this early by presenting a vaccination/recovery certificate. Alternatively, quarantine can be ended early with a negative Covid-19 test on the fifth day after entry.
Children under the age of 12 (i.e. who are younger than 12) are allowed to enter the country if accompanied by a fully vaccinated parent. They are not obliged to provide any kind of evidence (no Covid test, etc.), but have to quarantine on arrival. For them, quarantine ends automatically 5 days after entry.
Important: Minors between the ages of 12-17 are only allowed to enter if they have an urgent need or if they have been fully vaccinated. Puzzled

DEFINE FULLY VACCINATED WHY IS IT SO DUCKING FIFFICULT?

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@Snowsartre, not easy to find an answer
Robert Koch Institute says

After all it is free

As I have said on another thread I would have thought the NHS app will show 1/1 so fully vaccinated.

Can’t help with the specific question, but it is true that 12-17 year olds will be considered fully vaccinated after one vaccine dose? Will that age range be issued with a NHS Vaccine Pass two or three weeks after their first jab?

I know at the moment the government’s Chief Medical Officers have recommended one dose of an mRNA vaccine for that age group, but as far as I’m aware they have not ruled out advising a second dose be administered after 8 or 12 weeks. I believe the CMOs stated they would continue to look at the safety data, particularly in respect of myocarditis side effects related to administration of the second dose. There’s not much data on the safety profile for this age group, so the science advisers seem to have said they will use what would be, in the UK, the normal gap between doses to consider the matter further, before deciding on whether a second dose is to be recommended or not.

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Bitten by curiosity - up to a point Toofy Grin

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/germany/entry-requirements#entry-rules-in-response-to-coronavirus-covid-19 seems to be quite clear that if as foreigners you aren't fully vaccinated then you can't enter and the only exemption is if you are under 12 years old.

There is a section "What counts as proof of vaccination?" on this page https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/EN/topics/civil-protection/coronavirus/coronavirus-faqs.html#doc13797140bodyText3 which says that you must have had all the doses required for full vaccination and at least 14 days have elapsed since. There is a link to the page which defines full vaccination but it doesn't mention age groups.

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Oh heck, this is a whole new travel issue I'd not even thought about. Our elder son turns 12 just 6 working days before our planned NY trip to Italy - is this vaccine passport thing going to kybosh that?? That's me sorted for the day, trying to answer that.

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https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/italy/entry-requirements. Phew, that was painless - under 18s clear in Italy if travelling with vaccinated parents.

@always29, They will need a PCR test ahead of travel though.

@rob@rar, That is the crux of the matter: will 'fully vaccinated' in the UK mean the same for German Border Control? I suspect not. And will add this to the list of gifts that Brexit keeps supplying.....

You know it makes sense.

This question is popping up across a number of the travel topics - perhaps worth renaming this thread title to make it easier for people to spot the discussion?

@always29, they won’t be quarantined to enter Italy, but won’t be able to access hotel restaurants etc as it stands - which would include those on the mountain presumably (also looking at a Xmas Dolomites holiday)

http://www.italia.it/en/useful-info/covid-19-updates-information-for-tourists.html

Edit: a closer read - it states that access to services requires an Italian Green Pass, or equivalent:

Access to these services and activities is allowed on presenting the EU Digital COVID Certificate or an equivalent certificate issued by the health authorities of Canada, Japan, Israel, the United Kingdom and the United States.

So it’s back to the crux of the matter - does a 12-17 year old have a valid cert from a single jab?

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@Snowsartre, oh joy, missed that bit in the excitement about no vaccines needed for the kids.

A snowHead

So I thought I’d see what my 17 year old/single jabbed son’s certificate shows, and we set up the NHS app on his phone. The ‘travel’ option required further identity checks, with passport page image etc, and will take up to seven days to come back. But we also see nothing trying to retrieve it on the ‘domestic’ option - it just lists the multiple ways you can be issued one e.g. by vaccination etc.

Not sure if this means he hasn’t been recorded properly, or everything is blocked until the identity check completes.

A snowHead

@Pejoli, good idea might do the same for mine. Thinking that we will fly to Switzerland and cut out Germany altogether- adds about another hour each way on transfer time but probably worth it to reduce stress levels.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

@Pejoli, UPDATE UPDATE so after a lot of beggaring about getting ID etc sorted 17 year old now has covid doc QR code in NHS app - it says 1 out of 2 vaccines which is not going to fly in Europe I imagine Skullie

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@Snowsartre, my son’s identity checks have also been approved on the NHS app, and we got the same result.

I went one step further and imported mine and his into the French TousAntiCovid app - his clearly states ‘vaccination 1 of 2’, while mine says 2 of 2.

So looks like no dice. At least he’s going to be 18 at the end of November, so can have his final jab in time for Xmas, but his 15/16 year old sister won’t be so lucky (and I’ve just clocked is also payed up for a school ski trip to Austria in Feb …)

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@Pejoli, bummer! I guess the school trip may not do much eating out in the evenings? Although will they be allowed in as not with vaccinated parents? Or will teachers have to claim large families? Toofy Grin

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But then the plot thickens … I tried the Italian VerificaC19 app, since that’s the plan for Xmas if we can figure all this out.

Presenting my 1/2 QR code got a big red ‘X’ and ‘Certification Not valid’. (Once I ran it through google translate - my Italian not being up to much).

No surprises there, and equally, using the 2/2 QR code got me a nice green ‘tick’ with ‘Valid certification in Italy and Europe’. Well at least I can go.

But then I tried my sons 1/2 - and that came back with a wholly unexpected *blue* tick - and ‘valid certification only in Italy’.

I will have to read on, but it would seem they will let him in with that, and presumably have access to all the services too?

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Following with interest as we have a 12yr old - getting him jabbed next week but is skiing off the cards for him with just the one jab - in France, no gondolas just chairs and button lifts ?
What about ski school? Really hoping will still be ok..

After all it is free

@Pejoli, nice! Sounds like strong grounds for cautious optimism.

Having now developed a rather unhealthy obsession, I will continue my COVID app road-trip report with Switzerland.

The COVID certificate app reports both mine and my son’s 1/2 as ‘vaccination incomplete’, and my 2/2 gets a red ‘certificate with Invalid signature’ !

Sadly, I haven’t figured out how to download the German app - I think it’s only available in the German app stores, so will have to leave that to someone with local access to try.

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@Rookiescot, I've looked at a few resorts (3 valleys, Tignes, Chamonix, Deux Alpes) and all have been clear that there's no need for the health pass in order to use ski lifts, irrespective of lift type.

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Thanks… think there have been mutterings on the French press about this, possibly some kind of decision due next week.

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French Gvt meeting tomorrow to discuss.

@Pejoli, I have managed to get my covid certificate into the green pass Italia app but not the Swiss covid check app. Have downloaded the Austrian green pass app - possibly not the official one - as the grauner app is not able to be downloaded in my region (UK).

It’s conceivable that Austria and Germany will accept the green pass Italia on the standard basis of EU reciprocity. However, there is an exemption for following EU law where health is concerned, or at least there was a few years’ back.

Who knows?

Certainly won’t be telling Madame that we might be forced to self-cater!!

You know it makes sense.

@Snowsartre, I saw on the CH travel thread that they are changing the rules tomorrow (20th) to accept NHS certs as valid - I’ll try the app again then, and see if it gives a different response.

Still very intrigued by the Italian ‘blue’ pass response I got for my sons single vaccination from the Italian app - I’ve found no reference to it anywhere online.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

@Pejoli, weird one - my 16 yr old green on one jab

A snowHead

@Snowsartre, which app were you using for that - I used VerificaC19, which I believe is the official one? There’s another called Green Pass Italia, but I’m not sure of its provenance.

A snowHead

Ok, so from what I’ve managed to understand, it appears the Italian Green Pass (the ‘blue’ pass I see on the app for my son) is different and less restrictive than the full EU one - it is valid 15 days after the *first* jab.

It’s this that is now being made mandatory in Italy to access services such as dining etc.

If that’s the case, then it’s good news for those 12+ (Who’ve been jabbed in sufficient time). If I understand it right, adults will still need the full EU green pass (ie be double jabbed + 15 days) to enter the country and avoid quarantine, but the under 18s that accompany them won’t, and as long as they’ve been single jabbed they can go in restaurants etc and not need to keep getting a test every 48 hours.

So if I have this right:

Over 18:
- Enter the country without quarantine: 2 jabs + 15 days + PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant: covered by above

Under 18: if travelling with the above,

12-17:
- Enter the country without quarantine: PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant : 1 jab + 15 days, or a PCR test within 48 hours

6 - 11:
- Enter the country without quarantine: PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant : <none>

Under 6:
- <none>

As I say, *if* I understand it correctly ….

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Sorry to point this out. This will change very shortly to 3 jabs, then 4 etc. I've got three trips planned, all of them from last year (including a bash) and I doubt any of them will happen.

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I think once they start rolling the boosters out, each country will go to an expiry date approach (e.g the 270 days rule they have in Austria already).

I also suspect that Italy will at some point switch their one jab green pass to the EU standard of 2 jabs - I think they are already at 70% double jabbed for over 12s, so once they’ve got people used to the current green pass, they’d have no reason not to switch to encourage everyone to have their second jab. This would only have an impact on our 12-17 year though (until we start double jabbing them ).

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@Pejoli, Austria is 360 days now not 270.

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@Chris_n, thanks for correction - I looked it up quickly, and misread it - it’s 270 days for vaccines that only require one jab.

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Just scanned my 12yr olds single vaccine QR code into the TAC Verif app and got a big red non valide.

After all it is free

@Rookiescot, and your own double jabbed code was accepté?

Yes my second qr code works fine.

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Interestingly there is a space left on my sons’s vaccine certificate for a second dose. Perhaps this is planned?
Just hoping that it won’t be too difficult for our single jabbed teens to access ski lifts etc this season.

Help!!

Very specific Covid question

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