 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm the owner, so I cannot just leave it behind unfortunately.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'm kind of in the same shoes, but probably a bit younger (I'm 30).
I've done my L1 course back in June, under the IASI system. Have done a few hours shadowing, and would imagine by the end of September/October I'll be finished on shadowing plus my first aid course which is mid September. My plan was to do level 2 this December but I won't have time to get the additional 70 hours shadowing in, plus we have 3 trips booked for next season already, so financially I'll be best waiting for Autumn/Winter 2022.
My plan is to do L1 and 2 without needing to do any seasons, I passed L1 comfortably and the trainer thinks I should be ok for L2 but can't say for definite as there's only so much you can tell inside a fridge. Beyond that, I might try and do some L3 exams whilst working but to get the teaching hours I'll need to do a season, which then brings the chicken and egg scenario. Obviously I can do hours in the UK, but it'll take along time while working full time.
My plan is to pick up short term accountancy work in the summer in the UK/remote working.
But the big problem with it all, is working/residency visas.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| telford_mike wrote: |
| greengriff wrote: |
| Looking at the BASI videos linked earlier, I'm some way from a level 4. |
You don’t need to be a level 4. Most people aren’t. |
What don’t you need to be a level 4 to do???
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| kitenski wrote: |
| telford_mike wrote: |
| greengriff wrote: |
| Looking at the BASI videos linked earlier, I'm some way from a level 4. |
You don’t need to be a level 4. Most people aren’t. |
What don’t you need to be a level 4 to do??? |
Weird question. In our village I only know 1 full time level 4 instructor. The vast majority are level 2 (really all you need) or level 3.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| greengriff wrote: |
| I'm the owner, so I cannot just leave it behind unfortunately. |
Are your staff motivated and dedicated enough to work without you around? Do you have a manager/business partner? Is working remotely a possibility (as owner I assume you don’t actually have to do all the ‘on the ground’ work yourself)?
I’ve just moved to Andorra (last week). I have a full time job that I’ve come out here for, but there are plenty that live here who run businesses elsewhere or who are ‘digital nomads’. Andorra isn’t in the EU, but it does still have quite tight residency rules - they are achievable though. They welcome people who earn their money elsewhere but want to spend it here!
Just an idea if you want to live in the mountains and ski more. I believe Andorra also has a 6 month tourism residency that would cover ski instructing, but you need to have been job offered a job before you can get residency. I would imagine there will be a fair few Brits applying for instructors roles here this winter!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Started late (level 2 at 32). Now level 4 (Snowboard) and living/working in France full time. Best job in the world. I work flat-out all through the winter, earn a lot of money and have a great time doing it. If I chose to, I could probably take the summer off and live off my winter earnings. Fortunately, my summer job is also the best job in the world (mountain bike guide).
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| swskier wrote: |
I'm kind of in the same shoes, but probably a bit younger (I'm 30).
I've done my L1 course back in June, under the IASI system. Have done a few hours shadowing, and would imagine by the end of September/October I'll be finished on shadowing plus my first aid course which is mid September. My plan was to do level 2 this December but I won't have time to get the additional 70 hours shadowing in, plus we have 3 trips booked for next season already, so financially I'll be best waiting for Autumn/Winter 2022.
My plan is to do L1 and 2 without needing to do any seasons, I passed L1 comfortably and the trainer thinks I should be ok for L2 but can't say for definite as there's only so much you can tell inside a fridge. Beyond that, I might try and do some L3 exams whilst working but to get the teaching hours I'll need to do a season, which then brings the chicken and egg scenario. Obviously I can do hours in the UK, but it'll take along time while working full time.
My plan is to pick up short term accountancy work in the summer in the UK/remote working.
But the big problem with it all, is working/residency visas. |
Cheers. That seems to be a much more sensible way to achieve level 2 that a £10k course.
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| hammerite wrote: |
| greengriff wrote: |
| I'm the owner, so I cannot just leave it behind unfortunately. |
Are your staff motivated and dedicated enough to work without you around? Do you have a manager/business partner? Is working remotely a possibility (as owner I assume you don’t actually have to do all the ‘on the ground’ work yourself)?
I’ve just moved to Andorra (last week). I have a full time job that I’ve come out here for, but there are plenty that live here who run businesses elsewhere or who are ‘digital nomads’. Andorra isn’t in the EU, but it does still have quite tight residency rules - they are achievable though. They welcome people who earn their money elsewhere but want to spend it here!
Just an idea if you want to live in the mountains and ski more. I believe Andorra also has a 6 month tourism residency that would cover ski instructing, but you need to have been job offered a job before you can get residency. I would imagine there will be a fair few Brits applying for instructors roles here this winter! |
That *might* be a possibility, but I have certain responsibilities as a director around money laundering and so on that make it preferable (to me at least) to be present. I'd like to have a clean break and leave it all behind ideally, but 'ideal' isn't always practical.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| stevomcd wrote: |
| Started late (level 2 at 32). Now level 4 (Snowboard) and living/working in France full time. Best job in the world. I work flat-out all through the winter, earn a lot of money and have a great time doing it. If I chose to, I could probably take the summer off and live off my winter earnings. Fortunately, my summer job is also the best job in the world (mountain bike guide). |
Very inspiring, thank you. I presume you speak fluent French?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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This from Jon West in Verbier
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Unfortunately we received an email yesterday from the Canton confirming to us again that for the coming winter anyone without an EU passport (including anyone with a student permit) will not be able to teach / do work experience (paid or unpaid) for a ski school this winter in Switzerland. (Unless you already have a permit! If anyone wishes to have more information on this I am happy to share any information we have). Its an extremely frustrating time for many ski instructors and we are sorry to have to pass on this recent update).
https://www.altitude-futures.com
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Guilty as charged
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| greengriff wrote: |
| Cheers. That seems to be a much more sensible way to achieve level 2 that a £10k course. |
For sure, you don't get the same level of tuition as a gap year type course, which is the real draw of those courses, but it'll get you to a position where you can teach abroad (if you can find somewhere you can work) and give you an idea whether you like it or not.
From there, companies like Warren Smith run seasonal training, for Levels 3 and 4.
https://www.warrensmith-skiacademy.com/shop/verbier-l3-4-instructor-training/
That training can then fit around working either in instructing, or possibly back in the UK in your own company and you could travel between the UK and Switzerland, or just skiing all year with no work to just work on your own skiing/ taking exams.
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You know it makes sense.
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| greengriff wrote: |
| stevomcd wrote: |
| Started late (level 2 at 32). Now level 4 (Snowboard) and living/working in France full time. Best job in the world. I work flat-out all through the winter, earn a lot of money and have a great time doing it. If I chose to, I could probably take the summer off and live off my winter earnings. Fortunately, my summer job is also the best job in the world (mountain bike guide). |
Very inspiring, thank you. I presume you speak fluent French? |
I am lucky enough to speak fluent French (my Dad is a retired French teacher, so I've been learning all my life) but it's certainly not a requirement. I have plenty of friends who work at least as much as I do and only have pretty basic French.
Speaking good French does get me extra work to some extent - I am in the great position of running my own snowboard courses during low season (mostly off-piste snowboarding) and freelancing for ski schools / other independent instructors during the peak weeks. This means I work all winter while only having to worry about sales/marketing for my own courses. The ski school I do the most freelance work for is a French school with about a 50/50 mix of French and international clients. I wouldn't get work from them if I didn't speak very good French. I probably teach in French for about 15-20% of the season. The rest is in English with either Brits / Anlgophones or international clients with English as a second language.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@stevomcd, when you say you work flatout during winter, how does that look?
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Poster: A snowHead
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@swskier, basically I work as many days as I want to. Usually 6 days a week, with Saturdays (changeover day) off. During peak season, I could easily work most Saturdays as well if I wanted to.
There's a limit though, beyond which you get very tired and it stops becoming enjoyable. Gets hard to turn down a full day's work, but I've done it a few times when I've already done 2 or 3 weeks of working all day, every day and I start valuing a lie-in more than another day's work!
When I'm running courses, those are usually 5 days, Mon-Fri. I often end up teaching or private guiding on the Sundays and try to keep Saturdays free.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Incidentally, I don't know any top-level instructors who have done a gap-type course, certainly not in Snowboard world. I'm sure there are a few out there, but everyone I know (and I know a whole lot of instructors) has done it via one-off L1, L2 courses, then going it alone or picking up training as required for L3/L4.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@stevomcd, that's a good point, in alpine I can't think of anyone I trained Eurotest with that had done the gap year thing. Im sure there are some but never really thought about it from that angle..
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Very interesting. Thank you.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I’ve mused on this as well, I actually did 2 years teaching and enjoyed it to a point. I did ISIA quals in Nz after my BASI 1 in UK, this was a long time ago. When I really thought about it I’d like to ski better but can’t be gassed teaching as it really frayed by the end. So I think you have to be very into the teaching part and the upside you are teaching people to ski .
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@greengriff, Have you thought about selling the business or your share, (granted it may not make as much at this time) and buying something else that is easier to manage?
The new venture may be cheaper to buy at this time.
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| GlasgowCyclops wrote: |
Have you thought about selling the business or your share, (granted it may not make as much at this time) and buying something else that is easier to manage?
The new venture may be cheaper to buy at this time. |
There is a snowhead (or ex snowhead) Gareth who quit being a ML to become an estate agent, so going in the other direction. Maybe estate agency is a good plan after all?
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| davidof wrote: |
... There is a snowhead (or ex snowhead) Gareth who quit being a ML to become an estate agent, so going in the other direction.
Maybe estate agency is a good plan after all? |
<cough> I think you'll find that there are a few ex professionals/ racers who now sell ski real estate.
In ski resorts, if you have the people skills, it's good business, as you're selling to people with whom you share an interest in the sport.
They get your autograph, you get a percentage. Here's my Whistler Real Estate dealer (orange jacket) enjoying a powder day.
(Ask me for his details or look him up in the hall of fame if you're interested in Whistler real estate.)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Brexit has created a real catch 22 for those who aspire to be ski instructors.
To reach L3/L4 requires time on snow.
So how do you get the experience required when most of the traditional paths (... chalet work, season in CH, Italy or Austria with L2) are now closed ?
In addition : most EU nations don't have a shortage of ski instructors making ski-instructor specific visas, even for fully qualified, unlikely.
For most Brit's the *only* realistic option to get a foreign-visa is likely to be a university degree in a profession (IT, medicine, finance, engineering etc) plus relevant work experience. Once you get to that level, and achieve residency, then teaching skiing likely to be less financially appealing ?
Reality of brexit rather depressing for young person aspiring to be a snow sport instructor. The real paradox is it's good news for those already qualified and resident - as they will face less competition from newly qualified Brits.
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I'm told we have vacancies in fruit picking, truck driving, and pig slaughtering at least. So it's all good, then?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Haggis_Trap wrote: |
For most Brit's the *only* realistic option to get a foreign-visa is likely to be a university degree in a profession (IT, medicine, finance, engineering etc) plus relevant work experience. . |
I would have thought Medicine is now more difficult as there is no longer mutual recognition of qualifications. Anyone heard anything?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Haggis_Trap, from what I've seen, Andorra and Spain both offer seasonal work visas, so that's the route I'll have to try and go down if things don't change, but realistically i'm probably looking at 2023 at the earliest for me on that front.
Fingers crossed something changes, but i'm not holding my hopes high.
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| GlasgowCyclops wrote: |
@greengriff, Have you thought about selling the business or your share, (granted it may not make as much at this time) and buying something else that is easier to manage?
The new venture may be cheaper to buy at this time. |
Yes that had crossed my mind. Although - as per this thread - if there's little realistic chance of getting qualified and getting work then that kind of nixes the whole thing. Having sat on my back bottom in an office in the UK for the last 20 years I've no desire to sit on same said back bottom in another country for the next 20. I want to be up on my feet and moving about!
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You know it makes sense.
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| greengriff wrote: |
| GlasgowCyclops wrote: |
@greengriff, Have you thought about selling the business or your share, (granted it may not make as much at this time) and buying something else that is easier to manage?
The new venture may be cheaper to buy at this time. |
Yes that had crossed my mind. Although - as per this thread - if there's little realistic chance of getting qualified and getting work then that kind of nixes the whole thing. Having sat on my back bottom in an office in the UK for the last 20 years I've no desire to sit on same said back bottom in another country for the next 20. I want to be up on my feet and moving about! |
But what if sitting on that back bottom in another country means that you can ski 2-3, maybe more days a week?
I’ve got a job in Andorra, doing exactly what I did in the U.K. which will means I should be able to ski 2-3 days a week through the winter. The rest of the year I get to enjoy living in the mountains.
A word of warning though, there are tons of estate agents here! Most of them seem pretty ineffective, but for a Brit to do well at it out here, you’d probably need to be able to speak Catalan or Spanish.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@hammerite, i concur. There is alot to be said for a decent job in a beautiful country! We moved 7 years ago. I kept my job from the UK just moved location, husband retrained completely (twice now). I never wanted a ‘ski life’ I just wanted to ski more. That evolved into - I want to be outside more all seasons (summers here are epic) and finally I don't want to be in a resort where most things close (yep even Morzine) so we moved to Switzerland. We are normal people - no specialist degrees etc. we didn't have a load of €£$ behind us, we just worked out how to get here and gave it a go. Oh and we have young kids!
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Tue 7-09-21 10:50; edited 1 time in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Nadenoodlee wrote: |
| @hammerite, i concur. There is alot to be said for a decent job in a beautiful country! We moved 7 years ago. I kept my job from the UK just moved location, husband retrained completely (twice now). I never wanted a ‘ski life’ I just wanted to ski more. That evolved into - I want to be outside more all seasons (summers here are epic) and finally I don't want to be in a resort where most things close (yep even Morzine) so we moved to Switzerland. We are normal people - no specialist degrees etc. we didn't have a load of €£$ behind us, we just worked out how to get here and gave it a go. |
That's quite inspiring to hear.
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