 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi All
We are planning two ski trips in 2021/22 season (all being well with covid), one in mid Jan and the other at the beginning of March. We are looking at Saalbach/Hinterglemm for one trip and either the 3 Valleys or La Plagne for the other.
Does anyone have any advice on which way round I should do them in terms weather, ski conditions?
Thanks in advance for any help
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Personally I would go with S-H in mid January. You can get decent conditions early March but mid January is likely to be better. From my experience the lower Tirol / Salzburgerland areas are best from mid January to mid February but by early February the crowds are starting to arrive. The Tarantaise (though its a long time since I skied there) is more affected by mid winter storms with less shelter from trees so early March is often a good balance between longer days and decent snow.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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As above -- my mantra is "early = low ; late = high"
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@chrisbristol, welcome to Snowheads! I'd agree with the above - January weather is typically colder and more snowy than March, so having tree-lined skiing on almost all runs in S-H means you can still ski even if the conditions aren't quite the bluebird day you hoped for, while in 3V there's not a lot of cover or indeed anything else to provide contrast if the weather is not on your side.
January in S-H is my favourite time to be there - usually cold, good snow conditions, typically not busy, and has plenty of shelter and options if the weather isn't perfect. February is peak season but is still OK, while March and early April can be excellent, but can also feature tactical skiing where you choose your runs wisely to avoid the sun and stay higher where the conditions stay firmer for longer. Snowmaking is very good, but when the air temperature is 14C in March it's not much help, so you are at the mercy of the weather. Maybe 50% of the time it will be good.
One consideration for 3V is school holidays - according to https://publicholidays.fr/school-holidays/ Zone C (including Paris) is on holiday until 6th March 2022, so if you were hoping for that week you may be queueing with Parisians, and that's not recommended if you have high blood pressure.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I couldn’t agree more with what Munich Irish said.
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Thanks everyone for the advice, much appreciated. S-H in January it is then. Thanks for the tip on French school holidays Ousekjarr - If I go out on Sat 5th March will hopefully only have one day of overlap, or maybe leave it until following week.
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| ousekjarr wrote: |
@chrisbristol, welcome to Snowheads! I'd agree with the above - January weather is typically colder and more snowy than March, so having tree-lined skiing on almost all runs in S-H means you can still ski even if the conditions aren't quite the bluebird day you hoped for, while in 3V there's not a lot of cover or indeed anything else to provide contrast if the weather is not on your side.
January in S-H is my favourite time to be there - usually cold, good snow conditions, typically not busy, and has plenty of shelter and options if the weather isn't perfect. February is peak season but is still OK, while March and early April can be excellent, but can also feature tactical skiing where you choose your runs wisely to avoid the sun and stay higher where the conditions stay firmer for longer. Snowmaking is very good, but when the air temperature is 14C in March it's not much help, so you are at the mercy of the weather. Maybe 50% of the time it will be good.
One consideration for 3V is school holidays - according to https://publicholidays.fr/school-holidays/ Zone C (including Paris) is on holiday until 6th March 2022, so if you were hoping for that week you may be queueing with Parisians, and that's not recommended if you have high blood pressure. |
Though I would say that the 3 Vallees is so big that you can always find piste that is pretty quiet and short lift lines
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I'd go to Ischgl/Galtur.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@chrisbristol, The 3V resorts will be emptying on March 5th so the children can get back to school on the 7th. Unless you are planning to get to the resort early on the Saturday there will be no overlap. There will be no problems with queues and though the pistes may be a little worn the chances of fresh snow is high. This is peak season afterall for snow depths (they will continue to rise until the start of April). In the French Alps at least you tend to get more snow in March than January.
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| Bob wrote: |
| I'd go to Ischgl/Galtur. |
There's always another year waiting to arrive 
BTW Ischgl in the middle of winter is harsh with nowhere to hide.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@chrisbristol, above advice on S-H and 3V/La Plagne spot on.
If you can leave the March one until 12/13th departure it’s usually significantly quieter and a bit cheaper than the week before.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Agreed with most folk here: S-H in Jan and 3 valleys in March. Although for various logistical reasons, every year, for the past 6 years (except 2020/21 due to COVID) I have done exactly the opposite: Val Thorens (part of the 3 valleys) in early Jan, and Saalbach in mid-Feb!
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This will be our third ski trip (very nearly fourth having been repatriated from France last year) so we are just learning about such things - thanks again everyone for the help!
I have some resort related questions which I would appreciate some advice on but I will start a separate post.
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You know it makes sense.
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@chrisbristol, for Saalbach, send a private message to @tatmanstours with your email address, and he can send you a guide - he lives there now
Last edited by You know it makes sense. on Fri 16-07-21 20:05; edited 1 time in total
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Always happy to help. This last season March was very snowy in Saalbach, but I have no quibble with the advice given. As ever it’s the luck of the draw. Mid-January and mid-March are generally pretty good in Saalbach.
Happy to send my comprehensive guide, and also the help with accommodation if I can.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Thanks tatmanstours, I am going to do a separate post about S-H accommodation and lessons, so would be grateful for your input there. A copy of your guide would be great.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@chrisbristol, PM me your email address. My social circle here in Saalbach includes many British apartment owners (who let their apartments), and great ski instructors.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Definitely agree with the above, better to visit S-H during mid-Winter (Jan/Feb). Many of Saalbach’s routes are covered by snow cannons, but reliability of snow cover isn’t a strong point, and the south-facing slopes do suffer from slush during the afternoons, especially during late season.
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| Quote: |
reliability of snow cover isn’t a strong point, and the south-facing slopes do suffer from slush during the afternoons, especially during late season.
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When the resort closes around the second week of April, it is never through lack of snow. The resort does not generally have a problem with the “reliability of snow cover”; in fact it is well known that the slopes are grassy, rather than rocky, and therefore skiable with minimal snow cover.
Also the snow making in early season is first-class and has extended the season significantly. It is now realistic for the resort to open in early December and close in mid-April.
With regard to the comment about slush on south-facing slopes in late season afternoons, how many ski resorts are similarly affected? And is it better to visit a resort with say 75km (50%) of north/west facing slopes, or one with say 100km (33%) of such slopes?
Even in late March and early April, when the weather is sunny and warm, there is excellent spring skiing to be had on the south-facing slopes until lunchtime. It’s just a question of getting out reasonably early, and also planning itineraries to take advantage of the more sheltered slopes (of which there are plenty) in the afternoons). But that applies to virtually all ski resorts in late season.
Late season can, and invariably does, also bring cold weather and fresh snow. Conversely it isn’t unusual to experience springlike conditions in January and February.
In the last few seasons, the best time to ski in Saalbach has been the middle of January and the middle of March. Last season the snowiest conditions were during the second half of March.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yep, no good reason to discount Austrian in March or later. I think most people are thinking along the lines of that’s when 3V will be at its best.
Another way of looking at this is if you did both trips to Saalbach / Austria you would almost be at the point of making a season pass worthwhile which then opens the possibilities of a third trip for not a lot more cash.
You may also like the idea of having a trip booked for 2 countries given that the last 16 months has reminded us we can take nothing for granted.
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@tatmanstours fair points, the sheer range of Skicircus certainly benefits it here, and you can venture to Fieberbrunn and Leogang in the afternoon where most slopes are north-facing. My point wasn't to downplay the quality of S-H conditions, but given the choice of 3V or S-H in later season, my inclination would be 3V. Either way, I'm very jealous of these holiday plans!!
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| drporat wrote: |
| Bob wrote: |
| I'd go to Ischgl/Galtur. |
There's always another year waiting to arrive
BTW Ischgl in the middle of winter is harsh with nowhere to hide. |
The top of the ridges can be very cold. Had -25°C one January, and the wind across those ridges..., but have been twice in January and the snow is excellent.
I was there when it shut in March 2020 - am I allowed to mention that...?!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hi, sorry to jump in on this thread.
Considering a week in Saalbach early December 5th > 12th, from what I gather there will at least be some snowmaking to open runs, and hopefully some snow by then?
For various reasons I am kind of stuck with that week, also considering Zermatt.
Also anyone got any self-catering recommendations? Cheers all
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@doynie, got your message. Always happy to help.
Cheers @Bob,
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@doynie, you might be lucky and get good conditions, there have been years when there has been decent snow from mid November but more common is little or no snow before Christmas. S-H does have good snow making (so do most places) and they will try to open if they possibly can. However skiing on white strips amongst green hill sides is never ideal no matter how good the apres  .
If you want Austria early to mid December then consider Ischgl or Obergurgl. Personally not a great fan of the glacier areas as they are generally small and can be very bleak in mid winter, something that can be relevant with Zermatt too.
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| tatmanstours wrote: |
@doynie, got your message. Always happy to help.
Cheers @Bob, |
Richard, your link to budgettravel points to a page "Sorry, we can’t find that page. But here are some trending travel stories..."
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You know it makes sense.
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| tatmanstours wrote: |
| Quote: |
reliability of snow cover isn’t a strong point, and the south-facing slopes do suffer from slush during the afternoons, especially during late season.
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Conversely it isn’t unusual to experience springlike conditions in January and February |
Have only been twice to Saalbach at Feb half term and twice has been spring like. Seek out the runs away from the south facing side of the main valley - plenty of them, many towards Leogang or over in Fieberbrunn with little queuing
The remarkable thing about Feb half term is that the queues are generally non existent or short. Worst was the Schoneleitenbahn as in the morning up Schattberg lift, quick blast down 2a (by far the best time to ski it) and the Schoneleitenbahn is the quickest way to get to the Leogang area, especially from the lower part of the village. Apparently there's a queue dodge involving the lift...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@tatmanstours, thanks for the info!
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Poster: A snowHead
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@buchanan101,
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Richard, your link to budgettravel points to a page "Sorry, we can’t find that page. But here are some trending travel stories..."
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Is this what you’re looking for? (getting a bit out of date now!)
https://www.budgettravel.com/article/0411_SkiVillage_32
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the Schoneleitenbahn is the quickest way to get to the Leogang area, especially from the lower part of the village.
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I always recommend people to stay if possible in the upper part of the village, near the Kohlmaisbahn or the Bernkogelbahn - easier and pleasanter for getting around, especially over to Leogang and Fieberbrunn. There is also now a new piste connecting the Bernkogel to the Schattberg Xpress, which virtually eliminates any need to walk through the village for anyone staying near one of the above-mentioned lift stations.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@tatmanstours
2005 - certainly a bit old but interesting how the articles goes on about Swiss engineering for the lift system when it’s vastly inferior to S-H which alongside possibly Ischgl must be the best in the world?
The two times I stayed was at the Ski Miguel chalet so easiest was leaving boots and skis at the Schattberg lift. Sometimes took the walk up. They need a lift up through the village…
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
The two times I stayed was at the Ski Miguel chalet so easiest was leaving boots and skis at the Schattberg lift. Sometimes took the walk up. They need a lift up through the village…
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@buchanan101, without wishing to knock Ski Miquel’s operation in Saalbach, which is now pretty unique in offering a traditional catered chalet, I’ve always considered its location to be a weakness. Saalbach is certainly no exception to the general rule that location is all-important.
We are very fortunate in being located directly opposite the Kohlmaisbahn, and I would hate to be down by the main road and the Schattberg Xpress (“the dark side”, as the locals call it, as it spends so much of the winter months in the shade of Schattberg - which translates as “Shadow Mountain”).
As I have said repeatedly in various discussions, staying in the upper part of the village (where there is plenty of good accommodation) is likely to give you a very different perspective on the “ski convenience” of the village, and a much more enjoyable holiday, than staying in “the dark side”.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| tatmanstours wrote: |
| Quote: |
The two times I stayed was at the Ski Miguel chalet so easiest was leaving boots and skis at the Schattberg lift. Sometimes took the walk up. They need a lift up through the village…
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@buchanan101, without wishing to knock Ski Miquel’s operation in Saalbach, which is now pretty unique in offering a traditional catered chalet, I’ve always considered its location to be a weakness. Saalbach is certainly no exception to the general rule that location is all-important.
We are very fortunate in being located directly opposite the Kohlmaisbahn, and I would hate to be down by the main road and the Schattberg Xpress (“the dark side”, as the locals call it, as it spends so much of the winter months in the shade of Schattberg - which translates as “Shadow Mountain”).
As I have said repeatedly in various discussions, staying in the upper part of the village (where there is plenty of good accommodation) is likely to give you a very different perspective on the “ski convenience” of the village, and a much more enjoyable holiday, than staying in “the dark side”. |
Not sure that it matters too much being in the "dark side" when on holiday as I'm out skiing during daylight hours.
The Ski Miquel location is slightly inconvenient but it's not that bad - I've had much worse - a 5 min walk to pick up boots and skis at the Schattberg lift (which unless I have - or almost have - ski in ski out access is what I do anyway), and you are able to access the region reasonably well from there apart from going to Fieberbrunn via the Bernkogel. And it has good bus access...
I wouldn't stay there as a couple, but instead I find good hotels with better location as you suggest (I've booked ski in ski out access in Zell am See for Feb at the AlpinSport), but the two trips we took to Saalbach (and one to Lauterbrunnen) were with an extended family group and Ski Miquel prices are pretty reasonable and their chalets are good for such groupings
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@buchanan101,
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Not sure that it matters too much being in the "dark side" when on holiday as I'm out skiing during daylight hours.
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Yes, my reference to accommodation in the lower part of the village being “in the dark side” was in passing, rather than germane to the important issue of skiing convenience.
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The Ski Miquel location is slightly inconvenient but it's not that bad - I've had much worse - a 5 min walk to pick up boots and skis at the Schattberg lift (which unless I have - or almost have - ski in ski out access is what I do anyway), and you are able to access the region reasonably well from there apart from going to Fieberbrunn via the Bernkogel. And it has good bus access...
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Yes, it’s of course relative. The location in question is better than many places I’ve stayed in, but worse than any of the ski-in ski-out locations than I’m now spoilt enough to expect. When I think back over the years, the best skiing holidays were always in ski-in ski-out accommodation. Some people may not mind walking and catching buses, especially if it’s what they are used to and have come to expect. I would agree that anywhere in central Saalbach or Hinterglemm is acceptable, and probably better than being in hundreds of other resorts. However for those who want to optimise the convenience factor and avoid any walking or reliance on buses and taxis, there is plenty of good accommodation to be found in ski-in ski-out, piste-side locations in the upper part of the village.
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and Ski Miquel prices are pretty reasonable and their chalets are good for such groupings
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I agree, and that is why, in my days of organising chalet parties, I booked with them and stayed in their chalets in Baqueira, Serre Chevalier/Monetier, and Badgastein. I’m not however aware of any particularly conveniently-located accommodation that they offer. From the point of view of convenience (and ignoring Saalbach-Hinterglemm for a moment), the most conveniently located chalets that I ever stayed in were in Leogang, St Martin de Belleville, Les Menuires, Vallandry, and Arcs 2000.
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I wouldn’t dispute @tatmanstours comments about the top of the village being preferable (certainly if you like apres) and by choice I would certainly stay at Hotel Kohlmais or Art Kristiania, however availability and the cost has at times taken me to the ‘ dark side ‘ even as far out on the main road at Hotel Sonne (lovely hotel and food ) I found it no issue walking up to the Schattberg in the morning (or taking their free mini bus to any lift) and walking home after apres ( never early enough for the last free mini bus home !) Don’t rule out the dark side
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