 Poster: A snowHead
|
| Peter Stevens wrote: |
| Clearly, skiing is dog eat dog, just like so many other hobbies. |
Or dog tries to help other dog by lighting the path to zen enlightenment and is barked at in return 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Peter Stevens wrote: |
| Clearly, skiing is dog eat dog, just like so many other hobbies. |
One of the often used quotes is "there are no friends on a powder day" which ironically I think it is the opposite of the truth partly because of avalanche safety and partly because there is nothing better than reminiscing about epic days with your buddies.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
Well this thread has drifted into a limited gang of snowheads v Gerry. So, for what it is worth here is my perspective.
As many real life snowheads know I act as an unofficial facitator in Tignes for the SCGB, just general organising of meals and drinks and offering advice etc on appropriate levels of ILG and so on. To this end I am seen in a SCGB gilet on a Monday night. For this I receive absolutely nothing. Indeed, because of my contacts developed playing this role, Snowheads on the PSB have benefited from discounts etc as a side effect. I have also assisted the Glorious Leader  with a few things.
I also know Gerry (who joined snowheads before having a directorship with the SCGB.) As a rep in Tignes he was always surrounded by a group of members having a great time (and the odd glass of Guineas IIRC) having had a good days skiing. But he also worked the room as a Rep for the Club and acted as a positive force for it. His reviews on the Freshtracks side are pretty good too.
He is gregarious, good fun, robust in his views and does not suffer fools gladly. His on line persona is an exaggeration of these traits, which I suspect goes for a lot of his detractors on here, well I hope so! There seems to be quite a few on here who have an over inflated opinion of their own importance and skill set and think they have a snowheads given right to have their questions answered. Some are also highly intolerant of others opinions and are rude.
The SCGB has got itself into a mess and Gerry amongst others stood for election to Council and was duly elected in the face of opposition from the then CEO.
What the Council needed was a team to shake the cage vigorously, hopefully this is now happening. Clearly, strong personalities are involved and, inevitably, there has been a dust up. Only time will tell if they are successful, especially in regards to the legislation and protectionism over repping on snow. In the meantime the SCGB still works for me and I will do my bit, as I will for snowheads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| Pruman wrote: |
Well done pisteoff for speaking out. It isn’t the easy path. |
+1
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
| Peter Stevens wrote: |
| Clearly, skiing is dog eat dog, just like so many other hobbies. |
I don't understand what you mean by this. Could you elaborate?
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Tue 16-06-20 17:59; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
@ousekjarr, Hi- great posts- very clear and well thought out. Polite, constructive, factual, logical, offering solutions. THanks.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Must say, the scgb forum looks quite modern; quick too.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
| AL9000 wrote: |
| Must say, the scgb forum looks quite modern; quick too. |
I’m not currently a member so can no longer access the members only section, the other sections are very empty, is that why it’s fast? I hope there’s a similar level of candid and constructive debate on the clubs future on the members only section?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@On the rocks, I am a member, but can't access the members only stuff! It appears to operate on a different login.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
Can't say I've ever knowingly looked there but the place looks as much pining for the fjords as snow vole. That thread is a very curious monologue. Though no doubt the paywalled club thread has some robust exchange of views....
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
| AL9000 wrote: |
| Must say, the scgb forum looks quite modern; quick too. |
Well with the amount spent on web development (I see a figure of £417K was quoted earlier in this thread by Pruman!  ) I would certainly hope so (although as others have alluded to the lack of posts may have something to do with the speed).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
| Quote: |
Well this thread has drifted into a limited gang of snowheads v Gerry.
|
No, I don't think it has. See the bigger picture @chocksaway, . As a director of SCGB (2nd time on council? I could be wrong so apologies) he should be trying to engage and counter the criticisms from SnowHeads, many of whom are still or were once members of SCGB. Rather he is happy to chuck the odd one-liner in but when probed in more depth he resort to insults and dismissal of the queries raised. It's all fine being robust in your views if you're not challenged on them but once your are you have to counter that challenge intelligently.
I've no doubt he's a great bloke out in resort as are you and It'd be good to share a Guinness or two (I've never met either of you and am probably unlikely although I'd like to get out to VdI and Tignes again) and your individual efforts to be inclusive are surely to be welcomed but it's not necessarily about you as an in resort link or even Gerry as a Director. It's about SCGB as an organisation, what it offers and is it worth it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
@halfhand, I agree with everything but your 1st 2 sentences. I can assure you I can see the bigger picture but for me this thread was getting overly personal. Therefore, I expressed my opinion on a real life person. I just outlined my involvement and my knowledge of Gerry to give some basis of credence to my comments and to try and avoid calls of bias.
Like this thread, I have noticed a lot of Apres has become less tolerant of alternative opinions in the last 10 weeks. I'm lucky, I have lots to do outside, clearly some people are stuck on their screens all day and are losing sight of balance and tolerance.
If this 'discussion' was in a pub then it is likely that it would be less aggressive and more self regulating. Trouble with all forums and social media, I suppose.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| chocksaway wrote: |
| Well this thread has drifted into a limited gang of snowheads v Gerry. ... Clearly, strong personalities are involved and, inevitably, there has been a dust up. |
He built his opposition one insult at a time. These threads do not "drift", they are driven.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
@chocksaway, So you've missed the olive branches in this thread then and just read what you wanted to read?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
@chocksaway, thanks for the character reference - clearly Gerry is likeable enough in person to get elected (three times it seems), and there must be something he did in the first two terms that a few people remember as being effective in preventing bad changes or improving things for him to be elected again at a time of turbulence even if it is just to shake up the rotten ways in the hope that anything different will be better.
Which makes it all the more puzzling that his persona on here is so objectionable. In this thread he's mindful that he's appearing as a SCGB director and most of the time he's either defensively direct or mildly insulting. In other threads he's extremely insulting, and I just don't understand how he reconciles those two.
I'm often left wondering why I contribute to this thread, as it really shouldn't concern me. The answer I keep coming back to is that it annoys me that SCGB is so useless because actually I could have been a lifelong member if it had been able to offer me something, it annoys me that it seems to be so London-centric in its membership and France-centric in its outlook, it annoys me that the people who represent it come over so badly, and it annoys me intensely when someone who has clawed their way into a position of responsibility then rejects any and all feedback on the apparent basis that they know better. Which would be fine if the club was thriving and showing regular smallish profits indicative of sound financial management, plus a growing membership, but it isn't.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| chocksaway wrote: |
Like this thread, I have noticed a lot of Apres has become less tolerant of alternative opinions in the last 10 weeks. I'm lucky, I have lots to do outside, clearly some people are stuck on their screens all day and are losing sight of balance and tolerance.
|
More like five years since at least the Brexit vote
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
@Alastair Pink, £400k is peanuts for those chaps!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
@ousekjarr, I suspect there's a few people (maybe including you) who, like me, have very fond memories of good times with the SCGB and don't want that all to be lost. The SCGB got me skiing off-piste 30 years ago, so I have a lot of subsequent enjoyment to thank it for.
I can see an important role for a national body lobbying for/supporting recreational skiing - whether it be in complex issues like dealing (neutrally!) with the fallout from Brexit/EU transition period, or simpler ones like trying to stop dry slopes getting shut, or figuring out how we rebuild enthusiasm and inclusiveness at the youth level. Some of the activities where Snowheads filled a gap - ski testing (not that I've been to one, but the idea of having testing at snowdomes and a bunch of skis on bashes seems like a great idea to me), or member-coordinated skiing without leaders, could easily have been picked up and taken further by the SCGB.
Unfortunately, it's sad to watch it sabotage itself - it feels like some of the senior people acted badly (but maybe communicated well) and some others may be acting very well but communicating badly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| snowdave wrote: |
| ... or simpler ones like trying to stop dry slopes getting shut, or figuring out how we rebuild enthusiasm and inclusiveness at the youth level. |
Those are in the remit of the home nations governing bodies. Snowsport England has funding from Sport England to work on them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@rjs, partly, at a "sport" level, but I'm trying to distinguish a "recreational" role, although I accept that might not be a strong distinction.
I've seen the SCGB engage historically with kids and provide them a different social and skiing experience on snow - this was far outside anything I've seen Snowsport England do with our local slope & race club.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
@snowdave, Snowsport England has funding to work on developing recreational skiing, I'm fairly sure that Scotland and Wales do too. There may be gaps in what they do that SCGB could fill, I asked Gerry several pages back what he was proposing in this area but he didn't answer.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@snowdave, doesn’t Snowsport England run things like that month where total beginners can get cheap intro lessons at dry slopes (maybe even at some of the snow domes)?
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
| snowdave wrote: |
@On the rocks, I am a member, but can't access the members only stuff! It appears to operate  on a different login. |
Yes, this is a problem I encountered too. I found that I had to login twice to access the members only stuff. Very few members post there, which is why I like the opportunity that Snowheads provides.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
@ster, they may well do, but I've never seen any sign of it. Nor have I ever seen or heard of anyone trying to engage any of the local schools near our slope. We as a race club did a (very small!) bit of outreach, but I'm not aware of anything else ever happening in 10+ years.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@snowdave, out of interest, what was the result of the outreach programme?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
@Richard_Sideways, we only spoke to a handful of schools. In the end, we only had any decent traction/interest where we already had racers at my son's school and one other, and thus these schools had a core to build a bit of activity around.
However, to be clear, this was our race club trying to get schools into racing - it wasn't an attempt to get them into recreational skiing, and wasn't really aimed at beginners. We were really trying to build our pool of racers to expand the sport, rather than expand the activity generally, and the latter is where I see no activity, and maybe an SCGB opportunity. To be fair, at least locally I don't see much of the former either, and I'm not aware that any schools around here have been approached by SSE to draw their attention to the opportunities from the slope nearby.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
So to summarize, excluding all the stuff you can get elsewhere and possibly at better value, the SCGB unique proposition currently is
1. In certain resorts you get to have a pint with a bloke in a hotel bar
2. erm, that's it?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| davidof wrote: |
| chocksaway wrote: |
Like this thread, I have noticed a lot of Apres has become less tolerant of alternative opinions in the last 10 weeks. I'm lucky, I have lots to do outside, clearly some people are stuck on their screens all day and are losing sight of balance and tolerance.
|
More like five years since at least the Brexit vote |
To be fair Gerry has done more than his fair share of whipping up intolerance with his frequent repetitive puerile abuse. Any humour in it went long ago.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Rabbie wrote: |
| davidof wrote: |
| chocksaway wrote: |
Like this thread, I have noticed a lot of Apres has become less tolerant of alternative opinions in the last 10 weeks. I'm lucky, I have lots to do outside, clearly some people are stuck on their screens all day and are losing sight of balance and tolerance.
|
More like five years since at least the Brexit vote |
To be fair Gerry has done more than his fair share of whipping up intolerance with his frequent repetitive puerile abuse. Any humour in it went long ago. |
it is not just Gerry
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| AL9000 wrote: |
| @Alastair Pink, £400k is peanuts for those chaps! |
SuperChapsGoingBroke?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| davidof wrote: |
So to summarize, excluding all the stuff you can get elsewhere and possibly at better value, the SCGB unique proposition currently is
1. In certain resorts you get to have a pint with a bloke in a hotel bar
2. erm, that's it? |
Well as I’ve posted before Freshtracks seems successful and good enough value to attract a lot of customers. But the previous justification of Reps leading skiers on and off piste is all but null and void.
It’s time for the club to recognise it’s now nothing more than a holiday club for keen skiers who value guiding and coaching with a good level of disposable income and ditch the pretence and overheads of trying to be much more than that
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
@snowdave, its interesting. I went through a similar experience with the motor club I belong to as an attempt to get new people into the club. We approached several colleges and schools running motorsport qualifications, offering a guide through how clubman and highet level events are operated. We had some uptake, but ultimately few carried it forwards.
Its an echo for many traditional clubs. Aging membership, falling numbers, lower engagement with club activities. Its a mindset issue, IMO. People in the club compare today with what they remember, but the nature of it has fundamentally changed.
I used to be on the committee for my motor club, but my involvement with it has dwindled over the past 10 or so years as I don't have the time to commit to the club and the only thing I really need is my membership card as that's what I need to have my license to compete.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| davidof wrote: |
So to summarize, excluding all the stuff you can get elsewhere and possibly at better value, the SCGB unique proposition currently is
1. In certain resorts you get to have a pint with a bloke in a hotel bar
2. erm, that's it? |
Yes, that's about it. But it still needs 30 full time staff to organise that, which in no way contributes to £2.5M losses, definitely not.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| davidof wrote: |
| Rabbie wrote: |
| davidof wrote: |
| chocksaway wrote: |
Like this thread, I have noticed a lot of Apres has become less tolerant of alternative opinions in the last 10 weeks. I'm lucky, I have lots to do outside, clearly some people are stuck on their screens all day and are losing sight of balance and tolerance.
|
More like five years since at least the Brexit vote |
To be fair Gerry has done more than his fair share of whipping up intolerance with his frequent repetitive puerile abuse. Any humour in it went long ago. |
it is not just Gerry |
AFAIK Gerry is the only one with a senior position in SCGB. He may be moderating his tone in this thread but he is still churning out the same puerile abuse on other threads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| eblunt wrote: |
| davidof wrote: |
So to summarize, excluding all the stuff you can get elsewhere and possibly at better value, the SCGB unique proposition currently is
1. In certain resorts you get to have a pint with a bloke in a hotel bar
2. erm, that's it? |
Yes, that's about it. But it still needs 30 full time staff to organise that, which in no way contributes to £2.5M losses, definitely not. |
That buys about half a million pints
But that does neatly sum up the current offering. You also get a website that doesn't work properly and is rarely updated, a chat room with no chat, special deals that aren't special, insurance they all moan about, and the stigma of possibly being a bit Tim-nice-but-dim. In short, nobody loves it, nobody cares and I bet that's especially true of the office staff who must yearn to be part of something successful they can be proud of.
I think its all over bar the moaning. The steep trend of losses won't suddenly be arrested and directed upwards into profit (or 'not for profit' as they like to say) because that's not how it works in business, the steady membership decline was marked even in the good times and that graph is going nowhere but down right now, and the club's main USP has gone. I'm sure Gerry is an OK bloke when you meet him in the flesh and at least he appears to care, likewise Pisteoff, but there aren't enough who do care enough.
The Chairman would do well to read this entire thread if he hasn't already, as it is free consultancy from the kind of people he should want to attract as members. I'm still looking forward to the 'pull no punches' report but I also think it'll just reinforce the dysfunctional image and put people off. Reinventing this thing will take time and money and I don't think there is enough of either.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
Well as I’ve posted before Freshtracks seems successful and good enough value to attract a lot of customers. But the previous justification of Reps leading skiers on and off piste is all but null and void.
It’s time for the club to recognise it’s now nothing more than a holiday club for keen skiers who value guiding and coaching with a good level of disposable income and ditch the pretence and overheads of trying to be much more than that[/quote]
I agree. I remain a member only for Freshtracks off-piste holidays.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Pruman "The Chairman would do well to read this entire thread if he hasn't already"
You must be kidding, some people won't even read more than 2 lines of some of the posts !!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
