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Refunds and cancellations - who have been the good guys?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Dippy wrote:
Out of interest - has anyone achieved a refund from Skiworld for their Package holiday?


Or YSE???
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Pruman wrote:


As I have said a few times previously, this is exactly what is going on. Most UK tour ops have not had to pay anything for your cancelled accommodation, lift passes etc and any flights will have been refunded to them - they are sitting on your cash and using it to run the business, pay themselves etc. So, next step is to advise them of the Law as it existed when you contracted with them - it's OK for Grant Schnapps (sp) to move the goalposts now but, as far as I know, the law that applies is the law that existed when the deal was done. I love the way ABTA and co call them merely “rules” and that they can be “relaxed”. It’s the Law FFS. However, because The package Travel Regs are a Statutory Instrument, Mr Schnapps can amend them without an Act of Parliament but I doubt he can apply the changes retrospectively. Anyone know?

Tell them you are doing a charge-back (and, yes, you can also do that for debit cards these days and your bank should oblige) and if that fails for any reason there is always moneyclaimonline. As most people will take the line of least resistance and accept vouchers, it shouldn't be this difficult for you to get your cash back.


Thanks Pruman - I suspected my ski company were not telling the truth regarding them not having my money. Seeing I booked my trip with a VISA Debit card I have just submitted a Chargeback with my bank this afternoon. I should get a response on the return of funds within the next 2 weeks.

For those wanting more info on Chargeback, I found the info on MSE invaluable at https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/visa-mastercard-chargeback/
ski holidays
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@paul65, I spoke to Santander about trying to get a chargeback, they told me I need to contact Easyjet regularly over 2 weeks, keep a log of those contacts and submit it before they'll follow the claim up!
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kitenski wrote:
@paul65, I spoke to Santander about trying to get a chargeback, they told me I need to contact Easyjet regularly over 2 weeks, keep a log of those contacts and submit it before they'll follow the claim up!


Yes, good point Kitenski - I provided a raft of evidence and correspondence (as well as lack thereof from the ski company) with my Chargeback claim. I've all bases covered and it is now over to the card services team at my bank to investigate and get my money back.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Ryanair have today cancelled my flight, offered me alternatives or a refund. I`ve requested a refund which they say will be processed with 20 working days.
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@Sailbad the Sinner, Thanks for reply - got nowhere with them - was originally offered a credit but really of no use.
Have now filed a claim through insurance - although was informed will have to wait weeks to get a response from them, so still chasing Skiworld in the meantime.
And to add - its been over the 14 days recommended timeframe for refunds
ski holidays
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Just had my refund through from skiset Smile
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
CaravanSkier wrote:
Ryanair have today cancelled my flight, offered me alternatives or a refund. I`ve requested a refund which they say will be processed with 20 working days.


When was the flight scheduled for?

Got a Ryanair flight coming up 2nd May...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@Artois, @Cinsha, You think that I don't have to save for my holidays? I made a choice 30 years ago to never buy on credit for anything beyond a mortgage. EVERTHING I BUY is saved for and every holiday I take is saved and budgeted for out of a very 'blue collar' wage packet!
In any normal circumstance, the goal of obtaining a refund is all well and good but if your daily support in a situation we are currently experiencing for you and your family is inadequate because you made no preparations for a situation you had more than two decades of warning about . . . don't expect me to either hold back on my opinion of your insouciance or to call you out on your self-entitled selfishness.
With millions sick and tens of thousands dying beyond what our societies expect; A global economy that may well take decades if ever to recover and is almost certainly NOT going to be one we recognise . . . and that may be good for us plebs . . . or . . . an economic and physical genocide . . .

Then you think that getting a refund is important?

I sincerely hope that is as far as you have to worry about the future . . . no really . . . if what I have nightmares about, most of you will be dead through disease or agression. No, I'm not paranoid, but I am old enough to have seen history repeat itself and I have first hand experience on just how people can be aggressively, self entitled and selfish . . . as do you . . . brexit?

I have no problems with being offensive about this subject and I really don't give a fook if you feel offended if you can't understand that today is NOT the same as yesterday and NEVER WILL BE rolling eyes

Oh! and still incandecantly angry! There's a fookload more to do than whinge here . . . Have any of you volunteered to deliver foodstuffs or clean hospitals or carehomes etc?
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
TRITE! as much as it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a community to survive a pandemic as the first sign of civilisation is a 15,000 year old healed thigh bone . . . the last may be perfectly preserved botoxed mummy in a panic room rolling eyes
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
NickYoung wrote:
CaravanSkier wrote:
Ryanair have today cancelled my flight, offered me alternatives or a refund. I`ve requested a refund which they say will be processed with 20 working days.


When was the flight scheduled for?

Got a Ryanair flight coming up 2nd May...


Flight out last week April, flight back, first week May.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Masque wrote:
There's a fookload more to do than whinge here . . . Have any of you volunteered to deliver foodstuffs or clean hospitals or carehomes etc?




fcuking moron!


Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Wed 8-04-20 10:02; edited 1 time in total
ski holidays
 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I have posted this on the other thread specific to EasyJet but I’ll put it here too as an example of a cancellation which has worked how it should. EJ have been spot on for me personally so one of the good guys along with Alpinresorts ski hire, Bookings.com car hire, Airbnb and Jungfraubahn lift passes, all of whom have refunded me in full and in good time.

Booked return flights Bristol to Basel in December for travel out on Sunday 29 March returning Wednesday 1 April.

EasyJet cancelled all travel to Switzerland on March 16th. They emailed me to confirm the cancellation of my booking. I then checked in the EJ App bookings and my flights were still shown as valid. It was suggested to me to check the website rather the app which I duly did.

Within my booking on the website I had to select change flights and then there was a small button which said Refund. I selected refund as didn’t want a voucher due to the booking being for two different families.

I received automated response that my booking had been amended and that the refund was being processed. I have periodically checked it’s status and it has until yesterday remained the same “being processed”.

Yesterday received eight emails from EJ representing one for each passenger and leg of the return journey and a final email detailing the full breakdown of the refund. It stated refund to credit card used for payment dated 07/04/20.

If it hasn’t credited by tomorrow I’ll call my bank to see if it is pending but I’ve no reason to think it won’t credit.

That’s it. Simple and thankfully straightforward for me. No contact with customer services, messages etc etc just the above process.
ski holidays
 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@jirac18, they seem to have removed the refund button now.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
This morning's media on the unfolding refund story ... with some travel businesses continuing to drag their feet and muddy the waters ...

Which? (Rory Boland)
https://www.which.co.uk/news/2020/04/coronavirus-travel-agents-breaking-the-law-by-refusing-or-delaying-cancelled-package-holiday-refunds/

[quote]Coronavirus: Travel agents breaking the law by refusing or delaying cancelled package holiday refunds

The Sun (Kara Godfrey)
https://www.thesun.co.uk/travel/11348554/cancelled-holiday-coronavirus-refund-credit/

Quote:
Rory Boland, Editor of Which? Travel, explained: "It is not acceptable for operators to disregard the law and refuse to issue refunds for holidays costing thousands of pounds to customers who may desperately need the money themselves due to financial pressures caused by coronavirus."


The Independent (Simon Calder)
https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/coronavirus-cancelled-holiday-refund-delay-industry-kane-pirie-a9452151.html

Quote:
Kane Pirie, founder and managing director of Vivid Travel, said: “I don’t want the travel industry to be the next ‘bankers after the bail-out,’ where people don’t respect and trust us.

“We have to be serious businesspeople in a time of crisis – not panicking and saying, ‘Let’s change the law’.”
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
big_ben wrote:
Masque wrote:
There's a fookload more to do than whinge here . . . Have any of you volunteered to deliver foodstuffs or clean hospitals or carehomes etc?




fcuking moron!


@big_ben your response has made me chuckle this morning - my sentiments precisely tho I'd have been way less polite. Because we are looking to recover monies, does this make us incapable of becoming carers, volunteers or are indeed within the at risk groups ourselves? as you say fcuking moron Razz
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Davina Goldballs, Pretty clear then that many tour companies are breaking the law and public opinion is turning against them.

Masque wrote:
Beyond angry


Masque wrote:
Oh! and still incandecantly angry!


Are you Mr Angry from Purley? It sounds more like you’re angry at yourself.

I bet you were exceedingly angry at the casino bankers in 2008. So now take a look at the casino tour operators who appear to be using customer money to fund previous customers’ trips. As someone said above, it’s a giant ponzi scheme. There are similarities too in that they are all looking for a bail out (ie taxpayers money).

If you know any tour operators please just ask the simple question: Where is the money? Anyone who does a modicum of digging knows that they haven’t paid suppliers at the resort end, and they haven’t refunded customers either. So, where’s the money? People can take bad news if the other side is upfront and honest.

How dishonest are they? By now they know full well that most travel insurance does not cover these cancellations yet they continue to buy time by sending people off to make claims. Or they claim that they have already paid the resort suppliers when they haven’t, and that they can’t get it back. It’s all lies. Be angry at the liars, not at those lied to.


Masque wrote:
Then you think that getting a refund is important?


It is, for some it really is. You appear not to be qualified to discuss anybody’s personal motives, preparedness for the zombie apocalypse or financial circumstances at this time.


Masque wrote:
I have first hand experience on just how people can be aggressively, self entitled and selfish . . . as do you . . . brexit?


Oh, of course, let’s play ridiculous conflation! Ask the Italians what they now think of the EU, having pleaded for assistance in early march and basically receiving grudging help and not much of it and far too late. Even Donald Tusk thinks that. 67% now want out of the EU. Meanwhile people are starving in southern Italy and back in the hands of the various Mafias. Brilliant.


Masque wrote:
Have any of you volunteered to deliver foodstuffs or clean hospitals or carehomes etc?


Yes, but that is totally irrelevant (again)



Masque wrote:
as much as it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a community to survive a pandemic


No, it takes a parent or two to raise a child and tour operators are part of the community as well so they need to do the honest thing.



Breaking news - I have just been told that the CEO of the Ski Club has parted company. Maybe a casualty of all this. at least they did the right thing and refunded people smartly.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Removed - my error


Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Wed 8-04-20 22:01; edited 1 time in total
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Swiss are refunding my cancelled flight without any quibble; Ski Zenit ski school in Saas Fee returned my lessons deposit within three days. Excellent service. Very Happy
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@LOTA
Can I please ask how you managed this refund from Swiss? I have flights for 11-18 April and am waiting to see if they are formally cancelled. Last Saturday's were although they are flying one daily LHR-Geneva flight during the week. I would prefer to use the £500 to rebook for next Easter but they are around £300 each one way so no thanks.

Cheers
ski holidays
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Pruman wrote:

Breaking news - I have just been told that the CEO of the Ski Club has parted company. Maybe a casualty of all this. at least they did the right thing and refunded people smartly.


Yes, I’ve just had an email confirming that he’s left.
ski holidays
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@r11s,

I'm another Ski Miguel customer awaiting a refund; if you have confirmed to them that your insurance company will not pay they should have emailed you a link with a claim form requesting either a refund or to receive a discount for rolling your booking to next year. I've got as far as requesting the refund and am awaiting their confirmation. The following information is still on their website:

A refund for the main holiday cost will be provided in the event that your insurance company does not honour your claim. Should you require Ski Miquel to provide a refund for the main holiday cost, please provide us with written confirmation of the rejection of your claim from your insurance company.
ski holidays
 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I’d have thought the travel insurers must have a pretty dim view of the legality of these conditional offers of refunds from travel operators. An insurance claim is supposed to be the last resort, not the first port of call.
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Removed owing to error


Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Wed 8-04-20 21:59; edited 1 time in total
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
DidierCouch wrote:
I’d have thought the travel insurers must have a pretty dim view of the legality of these conditional offers of refunds from travel operators. An insurance claim is supposed to be the last resort, not the first port of call.

That was my thought. My insurance requires me to make every reasonable effort to recover losses before rewiring to claiming.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Quote:

A refund for the main holiday cost will be provided in the event that your insurance company does not honour your claim. Should you require Ski Miquel to provide a refund for the main holiday cost, please provide us with written confirmation of the rejection of your claim from your insurance company.


That looks very much like insurance fraud and conspiracy to defraud.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Want to know why I’m so f’n angry about people wanting refunds?

Let’s for a moment put aside the concept that the ‘people’ (that is such an oxymoron ) who want us to get back to ‘normal’ are only interested in getting back to their economic normal . . . the model put us where we are now. ‘Us’ great unwashed being that micron thin latex film providing the supporting if unpredictable skin for that vast credit balloon we survive by; Making a very small part of our society very rich . . . that when it ‘pops’ . . . only ‘us’ gets fook’d in the bang . . . every 9 or 10 years or so and then WE rebuild their industry . . . again! Our economy is a 4 stroke engine!

We suck cheap fuel . . . till we overextend
And we get squeezed . . . by market manipulation, untill
An external source or situation ignites the bang
And we are the exhaust . . .

. . . repeat.

Here’s my anger!

I’m in my third week of running med supplies to the NW US. For all that I’ve never renewed them, my old security clearances are still valid and I can be admitted to federal storage facilities for loading etc. I don’t have or have access to any commercial PPE and even less any toilet paper. It’s only the kindness of the hospital receiving dock workers that I have a couple of face masks. One of which I gave to a colleague.

Here’s his story. He’s late 20’s with a new wife and a couple of very young kids (yes they got it bass akward) at home in Detroit. He’s behind me pulling a ‘reefer’. It’s his first run up here and his instructions are to just deliver and drop the refrigerated trailer with the temp set at 33°f to the hospital at my/our first stop. We get there and he’s asked to dock first. I give him a hand to reverse in, open the doors, get on the dock to set the plate and I'm greeted by two guys in just one step below full hazmat who tell me get back in my truck as they start to roll 3 tier shelving units with plastic body wraps, duct taped to the units to stop them rolling off into the reefer. My colleague is told that once loaded he has to drop the trailer at the other side of the hospital . . he freeks!

It takes 2 hours to wind him down from quiting and he takes the rest of my load on to the next stop and I have to sign the paper trail for 87 bodies and lock/seal the trailer before moving it to a secured site. I have 87 souls in my charge that died without family or friends there to love them and I can barely even begin to type this through my tears.

I am so angry and so tired of anyone thinking that a f’k’n refund has any importance in the world we are living in. I’ve not met any first responder that thinks about anything beyond the care and love of the people they’re trying to save.

F’K any and all of you who think that getting a refund for a holiday that has been cancelled because thousands of people are dying alone and afraid has less importance than your f’n pocketbook!

John
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Pruman, you're just a dick

edit: a short, flacid and spotted dick without any concept beyond pretending he's a sad shallow dick taking sceen grabs to use as instagram dick pics in the hope that someone . . . anyone . . . will be impressed rolling eyes

edit again: and thank you for the, if brief, moment of distraction of today.


Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much on Thu 9-04-20 6:01; edited 3 times in total
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I hope you have a better day today, masque.
ski holidays
 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Ah, so the fact that this virus kills folk is the only story ? Yeah it’s proper bad for the victims and everyone involved . Yes we should all be going what we can to help and help stop the spread by following guidelines, continuing essential work, helping family and community. Everyone feels for the victims and appreciates the continuing work of everyone working with and through this. Still life goes on for the vast majority and just as I expect to be paid for my essential work I expect to be refunded what is owed to me. It’s not the focus of my life but it's not unreasonable not to write off a couple of grand . If this upsets anyone then, hey.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I don’t think this thread is doing Masque any good. May be wish to leave it alone for a while. Take care
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Following a phone call yesterday Ski Miguel have made a full refund.
They’re a small company doing their best, hopefully they’ll survive this . I’ll be supporting them next season if it happens
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
This company made it to the BBC, that's not going to do them any favours.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52206832
ski holidays
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@Masque, nothing to add to that and you do put it into perspective. Take care of yourself.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
always29 wrote:
This company made it to the BBC, that's not going to do them any favours.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52206832


Quote:
Hampshire-based firm Chardons Ltd, which operates the Chalet Chardons brand.


Worth giving them a miss next time.
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always29 wrote:
This company made it to the BBC, that's not going to do them any favours.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52206832
I disagree. It explains that some situations are not just companies being selfish or awkward. Some would like to do the "right" thing for their customers but are unable to do so. The fact that they are required to keep the accommodation "open" may mean that they are still having to employ and pay local staff, taxes, expenses etc. Plus they can still pay their own staff. So the only unexpected profit the company is making is the cost of a week's food. (Plus a few other bits, like laundry)


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Thu 9-04-20 8:01; edited 1 time in total
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Phoned Swiss this morning-got through straight away to their UK service centre. Agreed a refund without any trouble, not least because I could only rebook for before December 2020 rather than April 2021 for some reason, and I'm not going anywhere before then.
Said I'd get a confirmation email confirming this later today and I would be in a queue for an automatic refund to my card. Let's see if that email comes through....
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
ecureuil wrote:
The fact that they are required to keep the accommodation "open"


That sounded more than a bit weasely to me - surely they could technically stay "open" if it were to be a legal requirement which in itself sounds weird and yet still refund guests. And the article uses the word "may" stay open not "must". I can understand a requirement to not just shut unilaterally while you have guests and boot them onto the street but...


And @Masque. I realise you are going through some poo-poo but none of that is the fault or responsibility of anyone on this thread. And banning all other forms of dialogue that aren't serious enough because some grim poo-poo is happening isn't good for anyone's mental health. Hang in there.
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Timc wrote:
Quote:

A refund for the main holiday cost will be provided in the event that your insurance company does not honour your claim. Should you require Ski Miquel to provide a refund for the main holiday cost, please provide us with written confirmation of the rejection of your claim from your insurance company.


That looks very much like insurance fraud and conspiracy to defraud.


+ shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how insurance is supposed to operate. I'm losing my respect for most travel companies over their willingness to break the law and encourage their customers to.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Back to the good guys (I am still on a thread about who are the good guys?).......EasyJet full refund received and credited to my account this morning.
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