 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi everyone,
thanks in advance to whom will stop by and drop their piece of advice. I'm looking for some words of wisdom on a pair of skis to use exclusively for slalom racing on a dry slope.
Just a bit about me, so you know the type of skier I am. I am getting close to my 50s (very close), small bloke (5' 4"). I consider myself a very good skier but not a good racer (below average!), I started only a couple of years ago but I'm getting quite into it and I personally think is a great thing to improve your general skiing skills.
I'm currently skiing a pair of ATOMIC S9 (Not the FIS version) 153cm long and I'm not 100% convinced about them. Surely it is due to my poor technique, but sometimes I think that something a bit (just a bit) stiffer and "heavier" would suit me better.
After this introduction, here are the two models I'm keeping an eye on at the moment:
1) DYNASTAR SPEED OMEGLASS MASTER SL R22-2021 - 158cm radius 11m
2) DYNASTAR SPEED WC SL PRE FIS - 150cm radius 11m
I know that some people think that on dry slope slalom the shorter the better, but I'm concerned about the stability of the option 2 and also about them being too soft.
As I said at the beginning, thanks in advance for your help and feel free to add any advice!
Stay safe!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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How heavy are you?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Jenx71, in theory the 'punter' 153 S9 should be ideal for the job at your stats. I guess you keep them sharp which is particularly important for dry slope training. You could also maybe tinker with the binding position (move forward 1 - 1.5cm) to see if that helps. Stiffness /length  is somewhat down to personal preference but I would stay in the 150-155 range. A lot of bigger skiers than you happily use 155s. I would get a coach to look at you to see if there are fundamental issues prior to changing skis.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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[quote]
I would get a coach to look at you to see if there are fundamental issues prior to changing skis.
/quote]
Of course, or ask in the ski shop specialising in racing such as Bartletts.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi guys! Thanks for your replies. To answer Spyderjon, I weigh 75 kg...no idea how many stones they are ! 
To Sledger: bit concerned about tinkering with binding position...but I could give it a go!
Let's see if someone has got any feedback about the skis I mentioned.
Cheers
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Have a word with Olly at ski race supplies, he will be able to give you more specifics about the skis you mentioned. And they have 20% sale on!
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| sledger wrote: |
| Have a word with Olly at ski race supplies, he will be able to give you more specifics about the skis you mentioned. And they have 20% sale on! |
Hi Sledger! Already had! He is the one who sugeested the two pairs of skis mentioned...and who sells them!
Olly has been great as usual, he suggested that the shorter option (150cm) would suit me better but in the end I'm the one that has to make the choice. I will try to get my coach advice.
Thanks again for your time!
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At 75kg in that length of ski you want the stiffer of the two which is the Speed WC. I've got a left over pair of brand new unmounted 150cm Stockli Laser WC FIS SL's
if your interested? The Dynastars are great skis but the Stockli's are in a different class.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
At 75kg in that length of ski you want the stiffer of the two which is the Speed WC. I've got a left over pair of brand new unmounted 150cm Stockli Laser WC FIS SL's
if your interested? The Dynastars are great skis but the Stockli's are in a different class. |
Thank you Spyderjon as usual!
Let me think about the Stockli, in case I'm intersted i will get in touch with you (I have your shop contact details and actually I need to pay you a visit very soon!)
Regards
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Would you really use a top end pair of skis on a dry slope, even for racing? Genuine question.
Skis are built for snow. Race skis are built for very hard and quite steep pitches where high edge angles are required and grip is at a premium. It's been a while since I raced dry slopes (Hill End - Late nineties) but steep and icy are not words which sprung to mind. The real clincher for success seemed to be a secret mixture of industrial floor polish and washing-up liquid applied at the last second, in liberal quantities, and an elaborate skating style around the gates which helped to generate additional speed and make up for the lack of grip.
I'd be interested to hear from people who race dry slopes to see if the clandestine arms race still goes on?! Or is it about spending big money on alpine kit? If I had a dry slope anywhere near me, I'd love to get back in to racing. It was enormous fun.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Klamm Franzer wrote: |
| Would you really use a top end pair of skis on a dry slope, even for racing? Genuine question. |
Hi Klamm!
Your question is mine as well!
Dry slope slalom racing is for me a way to improve my skiing. Other than being great fun, I find it challenging and therefore it pushes me to "polish" and improve my skiing technique. When I go on snow I feel that the work done on a dry slope is paying off.
The point I'm trying to make is that I'm not "obsessed" about the race result (even if I'm quite competitive) but more interested in skiing well and with a style similar to what would apply on snow.
For me, the point of having a top end pair of skis is not down to race performance but to the benefit I could have in my skiing progression.....if this makes sense!
For example, if stiffer skis were beneficial to my ski learning let's go for them. If, on the contrary, they were counterproductive ...stay away from them!
I guess that the real question could be....What is the best pair of skis to help me to improve my technique? Is there such as pair of skis?
I asked my coach and I'm waiting for an answer.....that I reckon will be something like "stop being obsessed by the skis and focus on your technique!!!"
Lets' see!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
sts: 264
Would you really use a top end pair of skis on a dry slope, even for racing? Genuine question.
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Parent of teen-racer here (almost ex-racer actually)
Yes, unfortunately so. Getting through 3 /4 pairs a year is not uncommon with regular training and race weekends. And then snow skis . The secret concoction of sprays, polishes and lubricants is still a thing!
Of course occasional club races would require less usage - but a short radius turney-ski is needed so.....slalom ski it is.
Another shout for Ski Race Supplies, super helpful.
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As someone who dabbles is a bit of dry slope racing and a fair bit of snow skiing perhaps I should offer some comments.
First of all to answer Klamm Franzer’s “Would you really use a top end pair of skis on a dry slope, even for racing?” the answer is a definite yes, but they would be top end dry slope racing skis rather than top end all mountain skis. For most men these will be 155cm slalom skis and most women 150s. Having said that I don’t even know what “top end” is. I use the skis that I get on with best and I notice most of the men in my age category (ie old) use Salomon or their Atomic equivalent (Atomic Race D2 SL), which are pretty cheap. Having said that some of the younger racers get through a couple pairs of expensive skis a season, often having one pair for training and one pair for the actual race.
I’ve noticed that the weird practices of base preparation seem to be in decline, partially due, I suspect, to some slopes banning some preparations such as blue wire drawing fluid. I tried to persuade some of our racers to actually carry out some test to see what worked best but they weren’t interested, merely saying Fred does this and wins therefore it is the best thing to do. Mind you almost every racer sharpens their skis between runs, often with electric sharpeners.
The race scene is as competitive as you want it to be, but it is also a lot of fun, even if, like me you count your positions from last rather than first.
@Jenx71, I take dry slope racing and snow skiing a bit like the relationship between trad rock climbing and climbing on an indoor wall; related to each other but not equivalent. I do both and enjoy both for what they are. It is the same for me with dryslope racing and snow skiing. I have known very good dry slope racers who have never skied on snow, others who ski very well on hard packed smooth pistes and some who cannot deal with bumps or uneven snow at all. One dry slope coach told be he could tell the difference between those who ski mainly on snow and those who ski mainly on dry slopes simply by watching the flex in the ankles. My advice is to take up dryslope racing and enjoy it for what it is. It is fun.
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You know it makes sense.
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I often volunteer as starter for various of our regional races. In my experience there is very little correlation between quality of kit, mysteriousness of gunk applied at start, and winner.
One of the regular winners rarely bothered with gunk, had old skis with bits of edge missing, and still came out seconds ahead of most of the field.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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The other thing to bear in mind is that it would be beneficial to have 2 sets of skis one for warm ups etc and one so you could keep edges in better condition for race runs. Ideally this would be 2 sets of the same skis but in your case you could keep the atomics and add the dynastar 150's (or @spyderjon, Stocklis if you would consider using them on a dry mat).
All the skis we are talking about are relatively stiff, the most important consideration for getting performance out of them (and you) on the dry slope is keeping the edges sharp otherwise you will lose grip and struggle to maximise the performance of the ski. Ultimately having 2 pairs allows you to manage the condition of the skis more easily and is the way to go - sorry!
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
I’ve noticed that the weird practices of base preparation seem to be in decline, partially due, I suspect, to some slopes banning some preparations such as blue wire drawing fluid. I tried to persuade some of our racers to actually carry out some test to see what worked best but they weren’t interested, merely saying Fred does this and wins therefore it is the best thing to do. Mind you almost every racer sharpens their skis between runs, often with electric sharpeners.
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| Quote: |
I often volunteer as starter for various of our regional races. In my experience there is very little correlation between quality of kit, mysteriousness of gunk applied at start, and winner.
One of the regular winners rarely bothered with gunk, had old skis with bits of edge missing, and still came out seconds ahead of most of the field.
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The very best and most successful dry slope racer I know doesn't bug about with her skis between races, doesn't apply anything to the bases other than wax, doesn't carry her race skis to the top of the slope etc. etc. etc.
She just skis and wins.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I agree that you shouldn't be over obsessive about sharpening and I think sometimes some racers are over dependent on having ultra sharp edges for every run. I think your approach is reasonable
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keep them in good shape but I try to be gentle and preserve them
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I was trying to make the point that without a reasonable amount of grip the skis, regardless of make/model, will not function as intended so looking to change skis may not have the benefits you are looking for. So over a 2 hour session most racers at our club would either change or sharpen skis after about an hour or so and this seems to strike a reasonable balance.
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FAQ
