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Ski touring for wallies

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Ozboy wrote:
@BobinCH, Have you considered Faction Agents 2.0? Probably considered mid-weight at 1570g but versatile and solid for downhill. Probably quite ubiquitous in Verbier and easy to get hold of a demo from their office.

I have these waiting for me at SpyderJon’s which will be my all mountain rig and for first dabble into touring. Same geometry and specs as Agent but 300g heavier and less flex Can’t wait to try them.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4-YNxSlcE8/?igshid=1qf2d0p2eivyj


I rode the gondola yesterday with Josh, the product mgr from Faction and his son. He was suggesting the Agents. He was riding a 20/21 prototype Dictator 4.0. It was quite a look accompanying a 5 year old Very Happy
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
oui4ski wrote:
@BobinCH, I'm a big fan of the Zero G's (bought from No 1 two seasons ago) - the lighter weight uphill is great but they are also stiff enough for the downhill with Shifts on Mantra M5's (from SpyderJon). I deliberately suffer more weight on the uphill for downhill performance, but wouldn't do the PDG on my kit!


Yep the Zero G seems to be seriously stiff for its weight and good value. Very tempted by the additional soft snow performance of the Kastle’s though.

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/snow-sports/backcountry-skis/kastle-tx98

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/snow-sports/backcountry-skis/blizzard-zero-g-95


Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Mon 25-11-19 13:49; edited 1 time in total
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
BobinCH wrote:
oui4ski wrote:
@BobinCH, I'm a big fan of the Zero G's (bought from No 1 two seasons ago) - the lighter weight uphill is great but they are also stiff enough for the downhill with Shifts on Mantra M5's (from SpyderJon). I deliberately suffer more weight on the uphill for downhill performance, but wouldn't do the PDG on my kit!


Yep the Zero G seems to be seriously stiff for its weight and good value. Very tempted by the additional soft snow performance of the Kastle’s though.

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/snow-sports/backcountry-skis/kastle-tx98Thanks

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/snow-sports/backcountry-skis/blizzard-zero-g-95


nb that is the previous 0G 95 not the current model :

"These changes give the new Zero G 95 a slightly more forgiving personality both starting and finishing turns and provide a bit better soft snow performance without losing the character people loved in the original."

https://www.evo.com/skis/blizzard-zero-g-95#image=161214/639854/blizzard-zero-g-95-skis-2020-.jpg
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@BobinCH, can personally attest to the soft snow performance of the Kastle tx 98 , you should be able to get a deal on last years model and I think it’s only a top sheet up grade this year
The early rise is ample and they are more than capable in the steeps , with the xenon binding they would be light and fast for sure
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@Dabber, looking like approx £650 for TX98 + Xenic. Pretty reasonable I reckon
Zero G + Xenic is £500. What skins?
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@BobinCH, kastle do a cut to size ( might be good for you Toofy Grin ) mohair / nylon 65/35 skin that is compact and light, its laser cut so no issues , these have great glide and good grip and ive used them in all conditions , Ive used these for a couple of years and they are great , but not cheap , I got them in a bundle price so not to bad
G3 skins have a great range and are the easiest to self cut/fit , the new alpinist + range is great https://www.sport-conrad.com/en/products/g3/alpinist-glide-mix-130mm.html
the black diamond glidelite is a good choice too https://eu.blackdiamondequipment.com/en_GB/ski-skins/glidelite-mohair-mix-sts-skins-BD163715_cfg.html

I personally think a mohair mix is a good compromise for speed / weight / grip , and would be of use after your race
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Contour hybrid are a good all round skin.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Dabber, @gorilla, excelllent thanks. I used some Pomoca skins which stick to each other avoiding the need for skin covers and weren’t too sticky so easy for transitions? Do you know if these are a similar style to that?
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I have the contour hybrid that Black Crows rebrand as the Pellis (got a discount). They come with a cheat sheet for storage but you can stick them together while out on the hill. I find them easier to use than the glide lite STS I also have for my other skis.
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@gorilla, +1 for the Contour/ BC Pellis. Good glide, good glue, I like that you can stick them together on the hill as you say, and also they’re easy to wash to revitalise the glue - far better on all counts than my previous BD skins.
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Scratched Record Time

Be very careful of glueless skins, as has been mentioned on here before, and I have two sets.

But they can be an issue in very cold (powder) conditions, especially if doing two ascents.

You might get away with it on the occasional sortie but if you tour on a regular basis you will get problems.

And that's not just from my own experience with them, but seeing others too, as KenX has too witnessed.

And then maybe this from people who you might give more credence to than me Laughing

From Skiing in Siberia Website

Skins. Glue should be in good condition, renew if necessary. Tail clips strongly recommended.
No glueless skins, please, it doesn't work with low temperatures

My Xenics 105 will be arriving mid-Dec, and I have up to then to work out what ski to put them on, subject to Black Friday deals Cool

I also did some interesting testing this last weekend in Val Thorens I'll stick that up in Equipment Reviews
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Weathercam wrote:

But they can be an issue in very cold (powder) conditions, especially if doing two ascents.


Not a problem for me - won’t be wasting time skinning if there’s powder to be had!

How do you know what is Glueless? Doesnt seem to mention this on the sites I’m looking at. Eg are the Pomoca ones Glueless ? Huge benefit that you can stick them to themselves but still peel them off easily and tip and tail attachments avoid them falling off. Will make transitions much faster

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/topics/snow-sports/best-climbing-skins
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I ve used
Colltex Whizz
Contour Hybrid
They are both pretty good.

Tried the Gecko glueluess ones found they were poor after when wet / cold ie as Weathercam says on a 2nd climb .

I m pretty sure the Colltex is the OEM for Völkl and Scott branded skins. Both the Colltex and Contour are this new glue that doesn’t need a cheat sheet but still sticks to the ski - the Gecko I had formed a vacuum between a silicon like rubber and the ski.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I think any skin that is marketed as can be stuck to the other skin could be classed as (clueless), that was my predicted text, where I meant gluless Laughing

I used mine the other day on a multi transition stashing them in my large mesh skin pocket in my jacket, and on the ensuing transition after a small traverse descent, the OH was stunned (she was not totally concentrating) when she saw I already had my skins on without taking my pack off and asked if I skied down with my skins on Laughing

I just think from my experience that cold -15 champagne powder multi transition touring you might have issues, and how many will be touring in those conditions, though more people are now touring in Japan etc
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Quote:

I just think from my experience that cold -15 champagne powder multi transition touring you might have issues, and how many will be touring in those conditions, though more people are now touring in Japan etc


Yeah - I'm not doing multiple laps in some Japanese forest. More's the pity.
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 Poster: A snowHead
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I’m halfway through a boot fitting (it’s lunch time) and the Zero-G looks like the one. Women’s model so 105 flex. Any opinions before I get back in there?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Scarlet, depends how aggressive you think you ski, will 105 be too soft for you?

What flex is your alpine boot ?

Take a look at the thread running in equipment & gear where boot fitting is now topical, just hope your legs have been measured Laughing
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Scarlet wrote:
I’m halfway through a boot fitting (it’s lunch time) and the Zero-G looks like the one. Women’s model so 105 flex. Any opinions before I get back in there?


At the end of the day it's what best fits your feet. I'm guessing the boot fitter can be a better judge of that than us 'weirdos on the internet' (esp. if we have never met you or seen you ski.)

….. but you need to look good out there so do make sure they match your ski outfit. wink
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gorilla wrote:
Quote:

I just think from my experience that cold -15 champagne powder multi transition touring you might have issues, and how many will be touring in those conditions, though more people are now touring in Japan etc


Yeah - I'm not doing multiple laps in some Japanese forest. More's the pity.


Very Happy

Anyone tried pure Mohair skins? sport Conrad recommended these ones:
https://www.sport-conrad.com/en/products/kohla/alpinist-mohair-130mm-elastic-k-clip.html

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In my experience 100% mohair glides a little better but provides a little less traction. Have had two pairs of Kohla skins (mix, normal glue) and was happy with them.

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/topics/snow-sports/best-climbing-skins?specs=n&n=0&sort_field=#compare
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Weathercam wrote:
........My Xenics 105 will be arriving mid-Dec, and I have up to then to work out what ski to put them on, subject to Black Friday deals Cool.......


Trigger pulled on some 18/19 183 Scott Super Guides 105's for circa £330 and the good news is I can cut down my surplus Scott Cascade 108 skins (lost one ski when caught in a slide in a forest and we never found it after four attempts in the summer) as length/clips should fit.

The bad news is that the skins are glueless Laughing

Now have some Scott Powdairs 183 100 wide with Vipecs skins and my old 27.5 S/LAB boots I'll let go for a song only trouble is that they are in Serre Che
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@BobinCH, my only experience of Kohla skins has not been good , lots of snow creep , great to not have to faff with skin savers , but to be fair I don't ever use them when touring , only for off season storage . full mohair is undoubtedly faster but the lack of traction can defiantly slow you down on steeper icy terrain , think a mix is the best around compromise Smile
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@Weathercam, @DB, too late, my phone ran out of power and I bought them anyway Toofy Grin

20% off though paid for new foot beds so I don’t feel too badly stung. The flex was extensively discussed as I had the same query – my alpine boots are 90 flex, so all things being unequal between brands, they reckoned they were about the same. I was briefly looking at the more freeride type boots, but they weigh as much as the alpines. I’m pretty small and don’t weigh much, so we decided that the touring boot would be ok for me, but I guess I’ll find out. I’m keeping the alpine boots for piste skiing anyway.

Nothing else seemed to fit as well either. So far I’ve only had a small tweak to the liners at the toes, but I’m prepared to go back if necessary. I was a little disappointed in the colour, mostly as my other boots are also white so I’ll have to think harder before throwing them in the car. I didn’t really feel I could complain about that though Laughing

I’ll try and get out for a half day tour this week maybe, though I’m still on frame bindings for now.
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Well the thread title still feels appropriate after this morning's escapade. I decided to have a little walk up the piste at Axamer Lizum before the weather turned and the lifts open, so 1580m to 2340m (760hm) in 2.5hrs. I reckon I could've knocked half an hour off that if it wasn't for faff stops to try and find my gear happy place, and that I spent 35min going the wrong way rolling eyes

It was the right direction, but I later found out that I could've avoided a steep section near the bottom by going around the corner, rather than falling over and sliding down twice on hard uneven snow that wasn't very grippy Confused I guess it's good to know the limits of yourself and your gear though, and I did get up it in the end, it just took a lot longer.

It looks like it's snowing up there now.

I should probably say something about the new boots. It was considerably easier than walking up in alpine boots, partly due to the 500g per foot weight reduction, but also because the extra movement meant that I didn't feel like I was constantly fighting against the boots. They're a tighter fit, too. I had cramp in my right calf for the first hour, but it went off so I'm not sure if that's going to need a modification or not. They felt ok on the way down, but the snow was pretty rattly so not a great test if I'm honest.
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@Scarlet, re the cramp in your calf, you probably need to experiment with buckles/power straps when going up, plus make sure you're in climbing mode, sometimes I have mine so lose it's ridiculous and having done only one climb in my new boots I have yet to find the right setting.
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@Scarlet, I have found with the Zero G boots uphill is best with the power strap completely undone and the top buckles fully open.

Smashing boots. One little glitch to watch out for is the 4 screws (2 at the top, 2 at the bottom) that hold the ski/walk mode fastener in place. On 3 occasions I have lost one or more while in action. When descending it can and does cause the boot to go into walk mode. Shook me up on the top turns of a steep gully.

Pozidrive 2 seemed to work well, you might want to treat them with threadlock or the like. I always carry a spare screw now just in case.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Weathercam, @HammondR, Yep, they were in walk mode and fully undone at the top with the powerstaps loosened. I think there was some pressure from buckle 2 which was causing the cramp, and I had a fiddle with it but am not entirely happy yet.

Thanks for the tip on the screws. I’ve got some Vibratite knocking about for coating QK screws, so that’ll do for it. I carry a penknife but not a posidrive usually. I’ll have to check if it fits.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
HammondR wrote:
@Scarlet, I have found with the Zero G boots uphill is best with the power strap completely undone and the top buckles fully open.

Smashing boots. One little glitch to watch out for is the 4 screws (2 at the top, 2 at the bottom) that hold the ski/walk mode fastener in place. On 3 occasions I have lost one or more while in action. When descending it can and does cause the boot to go into walk mode. Shook me up on the top turns of a steep gully.

Pozidrive 2 seemed to work well, you might want to treat them with threadlock or the like. I always carry a spare screw now just in case.

Had you previously undone the screws to make an adjustment, or did they just come loose through use? All the screws on my Zero G Pro's appear to be really tight, but I haven't skied them yet. Maybe I'll go with a preemptive thread lock as I don't plan to adjust the forward lean.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@HammondR, I’ve just had a look at the walk mode lever, and as far as I can see, there are no exposed screw heads. Everything is rounded off or riveted. Do you have an older model? Maybe this was a known issue that’s now been fixed.
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@Scarlet, brand new last December, the green scout. From the sounds of@PowderAdict, who's boots are like mine, I wonder if yours are the old version? I recall them being as you describe.

@PowderAdict, never touched them before the first instance. I then nipped everything up to prevent it happening again then a couple of days later, boink!
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@HammondR, mine are these https://www.tecnicasports.com/products/women/zero-g-tour-w/ maybe it’s different on the women’s model.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Scarlet, are your boots white or turquoise?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Oops, crossed in the post!

Maybe they have changed.
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@HammondR, Mine are the latest 19/20 model.

@Scarlet, The screws are behind the walk mode lever. You can see 2 of them in this picture, the other 2 are below them. The bottom 2 are designed to be loosened to adjust the forward lean angle.
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@PowderAdict, Gotcha. I was looking at the pivots. Dunno how I missed those, but it was quite late rolling eyes
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An amusing story from today, I was skining up the piste though in powder and there was someone ahead of me with a dog, the track had been made by a couple of people and was very steep with not too much in the way of zig-zags, and I could not catch the person ahead, though I was not going into the red zone.

Did have me thinking about the weight as I was carrying a fair amount of snow on my skis, in that narrower shorter skis would not have so much snow on them.

First hour and I did 560m and completed the 735m climb 1hr 25

As I was nearing the final 100m the skier ahead of me came back down, and to my surprise twas a lady of mature years, circa my age, obviously likes her uphill speed given the pace and track she was going at, and travelling light with a SkiMo pack.

Just goes to show Very Happy

https://www.strava.com/activities/2899258099
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Wally alert! No more excuses...
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!

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I've got a yellow sofa too. I'm not sure what that confirms about me Confused
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Just found this thread now....but I definitely qualify as a tour wally. Only done 5 proper trips so far this season, and by proper I mean 300m of vertical, on largely blue slopes, in well under an hour.

Of the 5 I've managed to find a way to reduce weight by just forgetting stuff.
On the 2 really sunny days I didn't have sunglasses.
On the snowy day I didn't bother to pack goggles.
The trip around Flaine I left the water bottle in the car.
And my most recent effort I forgot to pack ski pants. Didn't stop me hiking up in the 'high tech' tracksuit though.

One little thing I've found useful for splitboarding at least is to bring a small cloth / towel to clean snow from edges, pucks, clips etc
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