 Poster: A snowHead
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Sorry, one more post about tyres... I'm struggling to make a decision whether I invest on a full set of winter tyres or just an all-season tyre for a 3 months trip to Chamonix? I would love to think I will repeat this but there is a good chance that this is a one-off trip!
reading older posts seems that winter tyres were still a better option for long periods in the Alps but wonder if still consensus?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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If it was me, the answer would depend on where in Chamonix I'd be living. You don't want to have to put chains on frequently just to negotiate a steep access road.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I’ve done ten seasons in cham.
Winter tyres and steel rims would be my choice. If you’re venturing up to’ argentiere and valorcine (you will be) then go the whole hog. Its really only the rims that are extra and you can use them next winter in the uk. Sliding off the road or into another car is very expensive. There might still be the odd day when you might want leave the car at home.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Another vote for winter tyres.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| jbob wrote: |
I’ve done ten seasons in cham.
Winter tyres and steel rims would be my choice. If you’re venturing up to’ argentiere and valorcine (you will be) then go the whole hog. Its really only the rims that are extra and you can use them next winter in the uk. Sliding off the road or into another car is very expensive. There might still be the odd day when you might want leave the car at home. |
Definitely will be! Def don't want to have to worry to sliding anywhere. I've also thought of visiting some smaller areas in the St Gervais side, driving in summer looked quite steep, so looks like the full set is the way to go.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Winter tyres plus steels would be my choice. Relatively easy to re-sell wheels and tyres if its a popular size as well.
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What car do you have? If it's a mainstream, 'ordinary' car then steel wheels should be fine and you'll benefit a lot from having proper winters on. If it's a 340BHP BMW M240i Coupé, then I'd probably opt for lighter alloys, if possible.
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| LaForet wrote: |
| What car do you have? If it's a mainstream, 'ordinary' car then steel wheels should be fine and you'll benefit a lot from having proper winters on. If it's a 340BHP BMW M240i Coupé, then I'd probably opt for lighter alloys, if possible. |
Not such monster but Its an bmw x1 4x4, 185bhp
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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We have done the last three seasons in the Alps, and this season will be in Chamonix from the beginning of December until late April. We have absolutely no problems with our Kleber Quadraxer All-season tyres - they have the three peaks/snowflake symbol certifying them as bonafide winter tyres, I use them all year round and in winter find them just as good as any previous winter tyres I have had. Last season we ran a chalet in an out of the way village, with steep hairpins to get out and we had no issues, and never needed to use chains.
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| Gustavobs wrote: |
Not such monster but Its an bmw x1 4x4, 185bhp |
Check whether steel rims are even possible on that - my X3 specifically prohibits steel rims.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Alastair wrote: |
| Gustavobs wrote: |
Not such monster but Its an bmw x1 4x4, 185bhp |
Check whether steel rims are even possible on that - my X3 specifically prohibits steel rims. |
I see plenty options for the model e84 including genuine bmw rims so I assume it’s allowed
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| RobinS wrote: |
| We have done the last three seasons in the Alps, and this season will be in Chamonix from the beginning of December until late April. We have absolutely no problems with our Kleber Quadraxer All-season tyres - they have the three peaks/snowflake symbol certifying them as bonafide winter tyres, I use them all year round and in winter find them just as good as any previous winter tyres I have had. Last season we ran a chalet in an out of the way village, with steep hairpins to get out and we had no issues, and never needed to use chains. |
Yeah thanks. I’ve seen others also saying no issues with all season. Any special care with the alloy wheels for the winter though?
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@Gustavobs, fair enough but worth checking - on mine I think it's the optional MSport brakes I have that prevent use of steel wheels, but I'm not sure.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Alastair wrote: |
| @Gustavobs, fair enough but worth checking - on mine I think it's the optional MSport brakes I have that prevent use of steel wheels, but I'm not sure. |
definitely will double check cheers
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Gustavobs, No issues with the rims (and they are only cheapish Fiat ones), clean them in November and again when we get home, and they are pretty much unmarked. Only issue with alloys is if you need to use chains, depending on the type, some can chafe the rims (the Thule K-summit style that fix to wheelnut, and fit where your clearance is low are best - we had these when we had an Audi Allroad, though we never used them in anger).
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Poster: A snowHead
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@Gustavbobs the BMW accessories pages let you put in your vehicle details and it will tell you what winter wheel/tyre size combinations are certified from BMW for retro-fitting: www.bmw.co.uk > Owners > Accessories > Wheels & Tyres > Accessories Configurator {Series - Bodystyle - Model - Colour}
And obviously, you can contact your BMW service dept, give them your VIN and they'll be able to tell you definitively.
As mentioned, if you have BMW M Performance brakes, these are larger than the standard calipers, and restrict the range of wheels you can fit. You can't tell from the 'J' (e.g. 7.5Jx17) or the tyre size if a particular wheel is OK with these. This applies to alloys as well as steels.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Why do you need new rims? Just get some decent winter tyres and have the garage swap them over on the existing Rims. I wouldn’t drive on snow over the mountain passes without winter tyres - it can be like an ice rink and it’s easy to spot the people who try without them. Save the money somewhere else with less risk!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@BobInCH is right. I'd assumed that your X1 wasn't able to take chains on it's standard wheels+tyres. And that's why you need a separate set of wheels. If that' not the case (i.e. your wheels can take chains) then , yes, just swap your summer tyres for winters and then back to summers next spring. No need for separate wheels. All you're paying for is the swap-over cost: when one set of tyres is on the car, the other set is lying unused, so the tyres aren't costing you any more overall.
Even if the fitted wheels can't take conventional chains, they can probably take front-fitting ones, like the Spike Spider Easy that I use. Although they're expensive (£300) they're not as expensive as a 2nd set of wheels.
So, basically, you have two further options: 1. Just swap your summer tyres for winter ones, or 2. if the wheels can't ake conventional chains, do [1] and carry front-fitting chains.
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With good winter tyres (and 4WD) I’ve never had to use chains in 10 yrs of Swiss winter driving. I don’t even carry chains in the car any more. I’m very careful going downhill around bends on snow - carry just a little too much speed and it’s easy to lose control!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Gustavbobs And my usual comment re traction control - check and practice what you need to do re your traction settings when you hit snow/slush and then back to tarmac. My 330d xDrive Touring and my current M235i Convertible have the car-with-wiggly-lines button: in effect, this could just be labelled with a snowflake (it isn't because it also applies when you're on sand or gravel, or have the chains fitted, or when you decide to turn off all the 'nannies' and Be One With Your Machine*).
You press it (for a few seconds) when you hit slush/snow, and 'TRACTION' comes up in front of you on the instrument display. When you get back onto tarmac, press it again for a few seconds, and 'TRACTION' will disappear, and you're back to normal. If you turn the engine off and you're still on snow, it'll go back to 'normal' - you'll need to repeat pressing the button and getting TRACTION displayed before moving off.
Give it a try at low speed on a straight road in the dry just as practice, until you see the TRACTION appear. Then repeat the button press and see the TRACTION disappear. You shouldn't notice any change to the handling.
Pressing the car-with-wiggly-lines button disables the DSC software and associated eDIFF functions and enables the DTC function (good luck trying to translate that from the French/German in a hire car manual). Basically, it turns off the 'nannies' that stop you spinning the car in the wet. The nanny software detects oversteer and applies individual brakes to slow-down the spinning wheels proportionately, and stop the slide. This is the Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) software. It's called a eDIFF because its electronics mimic the effect of a mechanical limited slip differential (LSD), which similarly prevents wheelspin when one wheel is on sold ground and the other loses traction.
All the DSC nannies are terribly useful in normal, everyday driving when you make a mistake, and would otherwise spin the car. Unfortunately, in snow, iall this fancy oversteer-correction turns out to be counterproductive. You want traction. That's why TRACTION comes up on the display. This shows you've enabled the Dynamic Traction Control (DTC) which assumes you're on snow, slush, sand or gravel, or have snow chains on and allows some wheelspin on the assumption this is actually desirable.
But once you're back on tarmac you really do want those nannies back, so remember to press again and make TRACTION disappear.
[*If you put your car into SPORT mode and press the car-with-wiggly-lines button for longer than a few seconds, this sends the car into SPORT+ mode. This turns off absolutely all the nannies. It's like going back 30 years in terms of safety software i.e. none. In the wet the effect is dramatic. I've done this on driver training on a wet training track and spent the first five minutes literally spinning the car. Track drivers do this because they don't want the software and eDIFF interfering with their handling at key moments. Which is fine on a track. Not so much on public roads]
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| BobinCH wrote: |
| Why do you need new rims? Just get some decent winter tyres and have the garage swap them over on the existing Rims. I wouldn’t drive on snow over the mountain passes without winter tyres - it can be like an ice rink and it’s easy to spot the people who try without them. Save the money somewhere else with less risk! |
the profile is quite low, I heard could damage the alloy with the chains and/or because of the winter itself, apparently, the cold, snow, salt and dirty is very aggressive on it and I did not want to damage mine since they are quite nice
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| LaForet wrote: |
@Gustavbobs And my usual comment re traction control - check and practice what you need to do re your traction settings when you hit snow/slush and then back to tarmac. My 330d xDrive Touring and my current M235i Convertible have the car-with-wiggly-lines button: in effect, this could just be labelled with a snowflake (it isn't because it also applies when you're on sand or gravel, or have the chains fitted, or when you decide to turn off all the 'nannies' and Be One With Your Machine*).
You press it (for a few seconds) when you hit slush/snow, and 'TRACTION' comes up in front of you on the instrument display. When you get back onto tarmac, press it again for a few seconds, and 'TRACTION' will disappear, and you're back to normal. If you turn the engine off and you're still on snow, it'll go back to 'normal' - you'll need to repeat pressing the button and getting TRACTION displayed before moving off.
Give it a try at low speed on a straight road in the dry just as practice, until you see the TRACTION appear. Then repeat the button press and see the TRACTION disappear. You shouldn't notice any change to the handling.
Pressing the car-with-wiggly-lines button disables the DSC software and associated eDIFF functions and enables the DTC function (good luck trying to translate that from the French/German in a hire car manual). Basically, it turns off the 'nannies' that stop you spinning the car in the wet. The nanny software detects oversteer and applies individual brakes to slow-down the spinning wheels proportionately, and stop the slide. This is the Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) software. It's called a eDIFF because its electronics mimic the effect of a mechanical limited slip differential (LSD), which similarly prevents wheelspin when one wheel is on sold ground and the other loses traction.
All the DSC nannies are terribly useful in normal, everyday driving when you make a mistake, and would otherwise spin the car. Unfortunately, in snow, iall this fancy oversteer-correction turns out to be counterproductive. You want traction. That's why TRACTION comes up on the display. This shows you've enabled the Dynamic Traction Control (DTC) which assumes you're on snow, slush, sand or gravel, or have snow chains on and allows some wheelspin on the assumption this is actually desirable.
But once you're back on tarmac you really do want those nannies back, so remember to press again and make TRACTION disappear.
[*If you put your car into SPORT mode and press the car-with-wiggly-lines button for longer than a few seconds, this sends the car into SPORT+ mode. This turns off absolutely all the nannies. It's like going back 30 years in terms of safety software i.e. none. In the wet the effect is dramatic. I've done this on driver training on a wet training track and spent the first five minutes literally spinning the car. Track drivers do this because they don't want the software and eDIFF interfering with their handling at key moments. Which is fine on a track. Not so much on public roads] |
great advice, I will give a here in the UK, thanks. Do you also happen to use downhill assist in the steep descents?
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@Gustavobs,
Bookmark is page.
https://www.chamonix.com/road-conditions,10,en.html
It will reliably let you know conditions road closures etc. In real time.
Cham is slightly unusual. There’s a motorway to the town and apart from the odd day the motorway is clear. Around town usually ok if you’re not up a hill. Brevent usually not too bad. Argentiere/le tour often needs snow tyres in jan feb. Col montets more often. Courmayeur snow tyres mandatory oct onwards but not often needed!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I have downhill assist but have rarely used it.
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@jbob, thanks
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FAQ
