 Poster: A snowHead
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Hello, we have just booked our third skiing holiday for the third year running. My wife and I were both novices three years ago. We’ve had lessons for the last two years. My wife is still very nervous and we have progressed at different levels. We usually end up splitting a three hour private lesson into an hour and a half each.
I think the lessons have been invaluable but wonder if we are at the point where our time would be better off just skiing and gaining experience. Or a couple of lessons at the beginning of the week.
Just wondered what everyone else thinks and what you have found valuable when you were at a similar level of experience.
If it makes any difference I’m 49 and my wife is 45. I can ski down just about any red in France or Italy that I have tried although most people seem to overtake me even though I think I’m hurtling along. I’ve skied a couple of black runs but been very selective which ones.
My wife is technically good but very nervous following an accident at an indoor ski centre in Milton Keynes prior to our first trip. She can she ski but slowly and doesn’t like it too steep.
Any advice appreciated please.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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My own opinion is that it depends. Yeah I know, not v helpful!
Everyone learns at different rates and different ways and for this holiday I'd say a mixture of lessons and skiing by yourselves. Because you're progressing at different rates skiing with a group can be good - there'll always be someone wanting to do what you want to do, and at your speed.
For future trips have a look at the Bashes:
https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=52715
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Have a couple at the beginning of the week, just to get your ski-legs, then enjoy yourselves.
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I know a couple who sound a little like your description, except that they have skied more. He"s reasonably fearless, fairly fit but not flexible, skis at speed, not always in control and with questionable technique. She's cautious but technically excellent. He gets fed up skiing with her due to her lack of speed, so often ends up sending her to ski school. Arguably he is the one who would benefit more from lessons. She would benefit more from skiing with people who do not pressurise her to ski faster.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The ideal, a while ago, might have been to go to a chalet with guided groups at different levels! But those scarcely exist now. The easy answer is that you both need lessons, but different ones. Nothing worse than skiing with someone who wants to go faster and makes you feel you're holding them up.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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FWIW. My advice:
- Check out the ski schools of the resort you are going to.
- Ask on here for recommendations for Ski Schools and Instructors.
- Find yourself a native English Speaking Instructor and book them well in advance
- Have a day to get your "Ski Legs".
- Book a morning or afternoon lesson for the second day
- Third day - to work on what you were told
- Take another lesson on the forth day
- Next 2 days working on that.
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If you want to progress quickly and ski with good technique then the lessons are worthwhile. You want a mixture of lessons and practice by yourselves so a few hours of lessons on each trip would be good.
If you are not too bothered about technique and just want to build confidence then you can just keep skiing by yourselves but, like all of us, you will develop “bad habits” that will be harder to correct later.
Almost all skiers would benefit from lessons but it depends what your goals are.
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I'd be tempted to say group ski school lessons might be a benefit. Sounds like your wife would benefit from skiing with some other people, which can often be a big boost to confidence.
Where have you booked to go?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| SnoodlesMcFlude wrote: |
I'd be tempted to say group ski school lessons might be a benefit. Sounds like your wife would benefit from skiing with some other people, which can often be a big boost to confidence.
Where have you booked to go? |
Group lessons can work, up to a certain level - if the classes are small and the groups are carefully chosen to be of a very similar standard.
But....not everybody gets on in a group. Lady F (who was also a nervous, but technically sound beginner), hated them and would never have learned, if it weren't for Private lessons.
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Queenie Pretty Please you’ve described me quite accurately. I like to go as fast as I can (which is quite slow compared to most people on the runs) but am barely in control quite often. I broke all the go pro mounts on my helmet the first year stacking it headfirst at 30kmph several times. I did think I was going really fast at one point but my wife pointed out I hadn’t turned my ski tracks off when I got in the car. The only difference is I do feel like a novice and really feel like I get a lot from lessons.
Snoodles McFlude (really wish that was your real name), we’re going to Cervinia. Supposed to be a good resort for beginners / intermediates and whilst we loved Alpe D’Huez last year we missed the bombardinos.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@IainMcT, to be honest, you sound like a bit of a liability and if I were your wife I'd not want you skiing behind me. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Don't share a lesson as you have different objectives. She needs to build on her solid technical foundation with praise and a chance to then explore further afield with a person who will give her the confidence to then try things by herself later. You need lessons with an instructor (maybe group) so it is not bravery and brute force that gets you down things, so you can keep it up as you age. If you search the threads you will see that your wife is no alone in being nervous and far more capable than she realises. @Old Fartbag, is right, once you have decide where you are going come back on and people will be able to help with suggestions on instructors in resort.
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"barely in control quite often"...more lessons for you then!
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You know it makes sense.
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The formula for ski lessons is N+1. Olympic skiers have coaches.
As @Tom Doc said, have a look at the Bashes. Would fit in with @queenie pretty please’s and @pam w’s comments. Lots of abilities, there is bound to be a group your wife would feel comfortable with. 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Can't really comment.
Possibly you need different types of instructors.
I'd be inclined to suggest an hour or two on day 1 or 2 and same again day 3 or 4 with lots of practice on non-challenging slopes in between.
Bear in mind, that if you are only doing a week a year... would you expect to play good tennis only playing a week a year?*
* easy & obvious answer...
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Poster: A snowHead
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@queenie pretty please, See so many couples like this, bloke is a out of control poor skier and the lady is better but nervous, my wife was nervous so I always skied behind her to give her confidence that if she fell I would be able to help she is now a very good skier but still likes me behind her ( to be fair the view is better for me) and by going slower myself it helped my technique a lot too instead of doing the male thing and charging down the slope at speed
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| IainMcT wrote: |
| If it makes any difference I’m 49 and my wife is 45. |
It makes a huge difference.
Young + fit = expert in <10 weeks.
Old + fat = expert in <10 years.
The best way for old people to conquer skiing is to take a long vacation.
Minimum, 2 weeks.
Ideally, 6 months.
The more continuous time you spend on snow, the better you get.
Old people lack fitness, flexibility, strength, burst, and their muscle-memory disappears in days.
Take 15 days of piste-time vacation, Sat to Sun, and split into 5 blocks.
Day 1 = lessons
Day 2 = ski
Day 3 = rest
Repeat twice per season.
The more you ski at once, the better you get.
Good luck.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| IainMcT wrote: |
We usually end up splitting a three hour private lesson into an hour and a half each.
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What exactly do you mean by that?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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He didn't say he was old, @Whitegold.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@abc, I think @IainMcT means they hire an instructor for 3 hours, partner one is coached for one and half hours partner two is coached for the second one and half hours. Simples.
Perhaps @IainMcT could confirm I’m reading it correctly.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@IainMcT, When we were at your level we would do a group course on a dry slope running up to the holiday to get our ski legs in and give us something to think about while we were away. Now you also have the option of snowcentres.
The most important lesson you can learn - is to not listen to @Whitegold.
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Yes, three hour lesson. My wife does an hour and a half then I do the other hour and a half.
I still play judo and just walked the Pennine Way in 15 days wild camping most of the way so I’m not that old but definitely not as fit as I was in my twenties.
We’re not trying to get to expert level, just enjoy our ski holidays (which we do anyway) and get good enough to explore the mountain a bit more.
Have to say we’d rather not ski in the Uk. It was the indoor place at Milton Keynes that caused my wife’s injury and accident in the first place. In my limited experience the standard of teaching is far better in ski resorts.
Think we will start off with some lessons and see how we get on. We basically have separate but private lessons anyway.
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| queenie pretty please wrote: |
| I know a couple who sound a little like your description, except that they have skied more. He"s reasonably fearless, fairly fit but not flexible, skis at speed, not always in control and with questionable technique. She's cautious but technically excellent. He gets fed up skiing with her due to her lack of speed, so often ends up sending her to ski school. Arguably he is the one who would benefit more from lessons. She would benefit more from skiing with people who do not pressurise her to ski faster. |
This could be any one of thousands of couples world wide. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Whitegold,
Lol. Again.
“Old” doesn’t always mean fat and unfit.
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@IainMcT, how many lessons have you had on each holiday? Has the instructor given you drills to work on between lessons, or are you just hooning around? It sounds to me as though you might benefit from the structure of some (good, small) group lessons. Being forced to ski at the pace the instructor sets, on slopes that are suitable for what you're trying to achieve, day after day, will probably help you - it is often harder to execute a skill well when you are going slowly. Speed masks many flaws, so if you just go fast you may not realise what's holding you back from improving more quickly.
For your wife, I'd saying depends on her learning style and preference. As @SnoodlesMcFlude suggests, if she's comfortable in a group it could well boost her confidence to see that she is technically strong. If she gets nervous when others watch, privates would be the way to continue.
Either way, you can both have lessons to suit you individually, and ski together the rest of the time.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Don't think you can ever get to a point where there's no need to have a lesson.
Even world cup ski racers have coaches all year round. Obviously, we're not all aiming to be that good, but, there's always something to learn, and bad habits to get rid of!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@IainMcT, short answer... As many as you can afford. Certainly more than 1x 1.5hr private lesson.
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Don't take offence at the question but does your wife really love skiing or is it something she does because you enjoy it? Or put it another way if you croaked tomorrow would she still crack on with booking ski hols etc.
The answer might influence your optimum approach. You seem pretty typical of many skiing couples though in that skiing as a couple all the time is a bit daft.
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You know it makes sense.
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| IainMcT wrote: |
... I still play judo and just walked the Pennine Way in 15 days wild camping most of the way so I’m not that old but definitely not as fit as I was in my twenties.
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Nice one. That's very good going!
It's fair to say that the better at skiing that you get that the more of the mountain becomes accessible, so it is in your interest to continue to improve, but the number one factor has to be your own enjoyment and it's a holiday more than anything else (rather than the obsession that it is for most of us on here).
If she's nervous, it might be that your wife would benefit from having more lessons than you.
I'd also recommend using an instructor who has English as a first language. Folk on here could give recommendations if you say where you are going.
I free skied for years but have recently returned to having regular lessons or going on courses and it has made the world of difference to my enjoyment. I probably should have done it sooner as I had some fairly deeply ingrained bad habits to lose, so you could continue to always have lessons, but - it all depends on how often you want to go and what you want to get out of it.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Last two holidays we have had half day private lessons every day. After a few days the instructor has split the lesson so we have a one on one lesson each for half the time each.
Yes, my wife does enjoy skiing and is frustrated that she cannot relax and get better. No idea what she would do if I died. Watch a lot more soap on TV than we do at the moment.
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Poster: A snowHead
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To help your wife relax I would recommend a vin chaud stop half way through the morning and skiing with music. Sounds like you've had quite a lot of good lessons. What do you think you are doing wrong, that you're still skiing out of control? Maybe too many vins chaud? There are loads of things you could do to improve your skiing while skiing more slowly with your wife. For example one ski exercises.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'd do a group lesson every ski trip until you are good enough to teach. Do one every day you ski if you enjoy them.
This is what I did and I was instructing 6 years after I started skiing at age 21.
I'd take more group lessons rather than fewer privates unless you have a specific issue that you need to address or a lot more money than I had while I was learning.
However, if you have the money, privates will advance you faster.
Also, if your group lessons cut lines, take one on crowded day so you can learn and ski more. I've done "expert" groups which were just excuses for all of us, including the instructor, to bomb the mountain.
Great fun with an instructor who acts as an expert guide.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
I still play judo and just walked the Pennine Way in 15 days wild camping most of the way so I’m not that old but definitely not as fit as I was in my twenties.
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I did that when I was 18. Back packed the whole way and thought I was very fit afterwards. When I got back I discovered I was actually very unfit. I lacked strength, flexibity and speed. All I could do was walk all day. To me fitness means only the ability to do what you want to do.
My suggestion is for both of you to simply enroll in group ski lessons every day.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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What are you hoping to achieve? You have to be realistic, skiing only 1 week a year you are not going to improve much, if at all. If you can ski safely (from your description this might not be the case), lessons are completely optional.
It does sound like your wife would improve from spending more time on skis, which would increqse confidence. However this is not mutually inexclusive with lessons. I don't think anyone will get more out of 2 hours skiing without a coach than 2 hours with a coach. Again though, with 1 week per year it's difficult to gain much confidence.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@IainMcT, have you heard of an American website called The Ski Diva? Your wife may enjoy it for exactly this sort of question. It’s a group of passionate and excellent female skiers, many of whom have had similar issues to yours. Discussing skiing with those women made a big difference to my wife’s comfort and her approach to skiing early on.
You’ve had some excellent advice in this thread. I can only add that, in my own experience, at this stage of your development perhaps you shouldn’t ski together that often. By all means take a lazy green or blue run together to a nice lunch, or to a bar at the end of the day. Just for fun. But do your ski training and hard skiing separately. This is why it’s ideal to go skiing with friends, you can split apart into smaller groups and reconvene throughout the day.
When you’re just starting out you will only frustrate each other with your differing approaches to the sport, and that’s neither fun nor good for your marriage!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Also, @pam w, brilliant idea to listen to music! I know that’s a bit controversial, but the first time my wife had music in her helmet it changed everything for her. All of the anxiety vanished, at least temporarily.
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Top suggestion may I recommend Napalm Death or if you want something mainstream Rage Against the Machine.
Only half joking worth keying up something that gets a bit more aggression going.
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Perhaps for a future trip you could look at something like inspired to ski courses. They run several levels each week, so you could each join an appropriate level for you. When I did one last year then we had a few couples like that. The groups were great and the instruction was top notch, better than most private lessons I've had and very different from your typical esf group.
I also sometimes ski with a friend who's much faster than me. The difference is that I've skied more weeks than him, so I know I'm technically better and indeed can ski steeper runs than him. What works for us is that I challenge him to stay behind me without stopping. He finds this really hard as he doesn't have the control to go slowly. On the other hand skiing with him has also pushed me to ski a bit faster and helped with my confidence.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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My husband had to go home at the beginning of one holiday (roof blew off our house, insurance paid). I stayed on and joined ESF group lessons other chalet guests were raving about. They were better than me. I said to the instructor I'd like to join "if I was fast enough". He said "if you're slow enough" and made me follow exactly in his tracks down a red run. I wasn't great, to put it mildly, compared to his beautifully fluid turns, but he let me join. One of my favourite tracks for skiing = Scissors Sisters "Take your Mamma". Also Phat Planet and the final chorus of Bach's Christmas Oratorio.
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For what it's worth, you sound like me and my husband - I'm the slow one. We now have a day to get legs back, then a private lesson, then another free day, then another private lesson. The best instructors we've had have concentrated on technical stuff rather than going fast which has made me more confident, and made my husband think about his skiing rather than hooning about without any control. So I'd say take your lessons together and learn from eachother!
Having been the person crying at the end of a day in a group because I felt like I was slowing others down, I'm not convinced by group lessons for confidence. Guess it depends on the group!
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FAQ
