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The Arlberg Snow Report 2019/2020 (MArch Weather -- Variable --Snow On and Off)

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@ulmerhutte, no doubt there has been and continues to be much development in St A. Perhaps I am wrong but most of it seems to be building apartment blocks. I suspect that there is a better return on investment from apartments. Again subjective but I suspect the traditional "Pension" has, unfortunately, had its day. It does not seem like younger folk want to run these sort of places, perhaps the work involved is not justified by the income received certainly in comparison with some of the other types of businesses are the area.

The subject of bed numbers has come up before, there is too much money to be made from visitors for any restrictions to be contemplated. It will be interesting to see if the pressure for the additional piste from St Christoph back to Moos from the tourist office / lift company / land owners will overcome the objections.
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@munich_irish, and apartments are possibly becoming more popular with customers versus pensions and perhaps even chalets, although I know of at least 2 new chalets built over last summer. Australian ski fields are seeing a similar trend - it’s all apartments now. Clubs and lodges still exist, but I cannot think of a new one built in the last 20+ years.

PS @7:20am: looking distinctly damp out on the deck. Not actually raining at present, more likely “mizzile”, that mixture of mist and drizzle that does result in visible rain drops, but you finish up just as wet.

Update @10:30am: back home. It is raining all the way to the top of the Galzig and probably beyond. The unconsolidated snow is sticky as all heck. The rest is like a semi-frozen slurpee.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Very quiet on Rendl this morning, great. Vis good as well.
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@ulmerhutte, @munich_irish, when you say apartments are you thinking individual places or 4*/5* hotels. Seems more the latter to me, but may well be mistaken. And at the same time independent bars/restaurants appear to be being squeezed out.
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Guy&Gals this is not a Horeca topic!! Shocked
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@nozawaonsen, from what I have seen it is more apartments than hotels (though some of those too) but it is a pretty subjective view.
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nozawaonsen wrote:
@ulmerhutte, @munich_irish, when you say apartments are you thinking individual places or 4*/5* hotels. Seems more the latter to me, but may well be mistaken. And at the same time independent bars/restaurants appear to be being squeezed out.


Hmmm... got me on that one. I would usually classify apartments as self-contained accommodation, ie bedrooms, kitchen, bathroom, etc, but with few or zero shared facilities. Hotel rooms/suite typically don’t have kitchens, but have shared eating spaces, bars, pools, gyms, etc. So, how would you classify Mountain Spa, which has both? Don’t know. I would call that place apartments, but that point could be argued. Suffice to say, pensions and similar cheaper accomm options appear to be losing favour with developers and guests (ie guests who can afford to pay).

Unrelated: 11pm and 8C outside. Does not bode well for tomorrow.
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https://www.vaildaily.com/entertainment/skiing-in-st-anton/
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@stanton, enjoyed the article. Amazingly, it seemed the author had actually been to the Arlberg.

Spring skiing this afternoon. Warm, very warm, very slushy bumps à la carte. Kind of fun to ski, but would have enjoyed a bit more of winter, given it is still supposedly February. Best snow: top of Mattunjoch, ie the shaded section.

Nowhere was particularly crowded. Maybe more than one person got soaked in the morning (it rained until late morning) and gave up.

Hearing much more Russian being spoken than Brit accents. Have the latter all gone to France? The “Drive Down” thread suggests that might have happened.


Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Mon 24-02-20 18:34; edited 1 time in total
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ulmerhutte wrote:
@stanton, enjoyed the article. Amazingly, it seemed the author had actually been to the Arlberg.

Spring skiing this afternoon. Warm, very warm, very slushy bumps à la carte. Kind of fun to ski, but would have enjoyed a bit more of winter, given it is still supposedly February. Best snow: top of Mattunjoch, ie the shaded section.

Nowhere was particularly crowded. Maybe more one person got soaked in the morning (it rained until late morning) and gave up.

Hearing much more Russian being spoken than Brit accents. Have the latter all gone to France? The “Drive Down” thread suggests that might have happened.


Yes it seems that way. I mentioned this on the last page, only saw a few British cars in and around St Anton last week when we were down. I heard quite a few British voices but fewer than normal. Most Brits that drive seem to go to France rather than Austria. Not sure why as it doesn't take much longer to get to Western Austria than the French Alps.

If you saw an old Silver Audi S4 with British plates in town last week, that was us Happy
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Hello I am a long time lurker on this thread mainly in anticipation of what has now become an annual girls' weekend to St A each January.

I am interested in the chat about driving to Western Austria. We are taking our kids by car to France at Easter this year. I have so far failed to persuade my OH that the Arlberg is do-able in terms of driving time, but it sounds from the posts above that it's not much longer.

So my question is what advice you would give on where to stay for a family ski holiday? Much as I love St A, I don't think it is ideal for children, (and I would feel a bit sad to be there an not be able to do the apres). We had a great holiday to Lech with the kids a few years ago and would love to go back but the £££s is an issue. Should I look at the other smaller options like Warth that I don't really know anything about?

Any suggestions on self catering options?

We are a family of 5. Kids are 11, 9 and 5.

Thank you.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Kantha, Plenty of cheaper apartments in the satelite villages down valley...

Free Ski busses to St Anton

Kids always wilkommen Aprés Ski..

Driving from Amsterdam takes 8-10hrs (overnight and Sunday when no trucks on autobahn) so from Calais around the same i would say
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Kantha, must say I cant see the attraction of driving from the UK and back for a week, flying or train so much easier. However it really is not much further than say Val d'Isere and probably is an easier and cheaper drive (French road tolls being crazy expensive). Calais / Lille / Luxembourg (cheap petrol) / Stuttgart / Bregenz / Arlberg. Lech is expensive but some of the other smaller spots are cheaper (there are some more value for money places but they get booked up very quickly), Pettneu, Stuben etc. Warth might be good but it is a bit remote (long drive up small roads from either direction). I mostly stay in Pettneu these days, certainly quieter and cheaper than St A. plenty of ski buses (less than 10 minutes to Nasserein) plus there is a big swimming pool / wellness centre.

Have a look at the tourist office websites if you want an apartment, there are lots from reasonable to high end luxury.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Thanks for your suggestions.

I share some reservations about driving for a week. This Easter will be the first time. We have always flown in the past, but have decided not to take the eldest out of school in term time now he is at secondary. The cost of school holiday flights x 5 is quite pricey, hence switching. I know lots of people do drive, so am sure it will be fine.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@Kantha,

Easter is very late this year....

Many places (on mountain/town restaurants/bars etc) will already be closed for the season...

Your easily find a very cheap place to stay..


Better to tak a coiple days driving ...stopover somewhere nice in Germany.....

Just Ski 4 days

Less stress
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Snow tonight and tomorrow morning
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Kantha wrote:
Thanks for your suggestions.

I share some reservations about driving for a week. This Easter will be the first time. We have always flown in the past, but have decided not to take the eldest out of school in term time now he is at secondary. The cost of school holiday flights x 5 is quite pricey, hence switching. I know lots of people do drive, so am sure it will be fine.


Driving from the UK to the arlberg is simple as long as you don't mind driving for quite a long day. As a lot of the accomodation in high season is Sat-Sat we usually drive down on Friday from the UK and stop overnight in Friedrichhafen. The holiday inn express there is often quite cheap. If you get up early the next day you can be in St A at 9am and have a full days skiing before you even pay for a nights stay in the resort. Similarly on the way back you can pack the car first thing Saturday morning, ski all day, stay over night again at a convenient location and drive back Sunday. You get 2 extra days skiiing for a relatively small outlay and it cuts a couple of hours of the drive compared to doing it in one hit and you miss the worst of the traffic.

It is possible to drive from the UK to St A in a single day and back too, and we have done that but you lose the chance for a bit extra skiing in doing so.

Back in the 90's we used to book with a tour operator and do the plane/coach transfer, we have also used flights to Zurich, where you can either get the train or coach to St A, but I prefer to drive, you can just throw all you stuff in the car and set off, free from the restrictions of other transport methods.

There are various routes. The fastest is Calais-Reims-Metz-Strasbourg, then through Switzerland to Austria but it's the most expensive, you pay tolls in France, then a 1yr vignette for CH, then a 10 day vignette in Austria. You can also do Calais-Belgium-Germany-Austria. That's what we normally use, it's cheaper, but a bit longer. You can drive really fast on the German Autobahns though if that helps !

I don't remember exactly how many times I've driven from the UK, it's too many but at least 20 times. I'm usually the only driver - if you have another driver it's a lot easier still. The main traffic jam will be if you arrive on the S16 motorway coming up to St Anton on Saturday just about any time from 9am to 1pm. You need to be earlier (or later) if you don't want to queue up for miles. There are some side roads via Dalaas and Klosterle which help but now everyone can see them on Sat Nav even that isn't always clear.

If you take the car you can also visit Sonnenkopf (which is just off the S16 ) for the day. It's included in the Arlberg ski pass and is great when there is good snow(no snowmaking there).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Kantha, we drove from Leeds to Stuben a fair few times when we had kids, as you said with all the stuff you take it worked out cheaper. We varied between a 1-2 night stopover on the way down, trying to make the drive part of the holiday and stop off somewhere interesting and have a walk around a castle/village etc.

We stayed at a lovely family friendly hotel with an evening kids club, pool tables, swimming pool etc and the kids had a great time! Ask for their package pricing which includes a lift pass. We also had the kids in the same room which saved a fair bit as well. https://www.hubertushof-arlberg.at/en/

Some other friends have made a trip to the area even cheaper by renting something down the valley and driving up each day for a few days, then spent a few days at the Hubertushof.
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@Kantha, we drive regularly to Arlberg for trips of 10 days or more, and have done for last 25 years, but for a week I’d always suggest flying is easier (and cheaper). It’s a much easier drive than to French Alps (which we have done years ago and gave up due to the crazy busy roads into Savoie). The autobahns are great to drive but you have to pick your times, there are many pinch points mainly in southern Germany and timing is everything. In short - drive out at night not through the day, and on the way back make sure you are on the road early, 6am latest. We tend to leave after skiing on Saturday and get to Stuttgart before stopping over. On way out we hit it through the night 10 hours driving taking turns once off the tunnel, only stopping for comfort breaks and fuel....do not drive during the day on Saturdays at peak times it’s hard work and frequent huge tail backs. It used to be Ok 5 years ago but traffic is now very heavy. Hope that helps.....?

Oh and make sure your car is fully winterised, winter tyres, low temp screen wash, chains and shovel, plus high viz jackets for all passengers.


Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Tue 25-02-20 15:54; edited 3 times in total
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Winterised cat?
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@nozawaonsen, it needs a coat!
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@Markymark29, fair point.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Markymark29, family of 5 for a week would be cheaper to self drive vs fly I'd guess?
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@kitenski, book flights early not last minute would be my advice, and like I said above fly if going for a week - if not knowing much about it so close then I’d ask a few questions - do I know the route/ is it safe for a full car driving all that way/ 2 drivers happy to drive 2-3 hour stints at 130-140 kph potentially in bad weather and or through the night/ have they got the car set up for a long winter trip (winters required even though it’s Easter)/ one of the busiest weeks of the year? If the answer is yes to all and still cool then go for it, if not then safety (and I guess enjoyment as a minimum) could be compromised. It’s not all about cost is it, safety would be a key driver for me - it’s a long way.
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Re Driving long distances.

Dont forget the last part of your Journey you will be fatigued even if you do not think you are..
This is part of your trip is generally where you need to be extremely alert ...heavy traffic and at nightime often ice or black ice on the roads in Austria..
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Maybe 2 - 3cm of new snow on the deck this morning (6:30am).

Character-building day yesterday. The upper pistes were mostly slick ice. That, plus flat light in places, made for interesting skiing. At least the tucks out of Zürsertali and off the top of Valfagehrbahn produced decent speed and no need for skating.

Coming back into the village yesterday afternoon, the snow changed to something like gelato, not your usual warm-day slush. Unpleasant stuff to ski.

Apart from the Valfagehrbahn load, did not encounter any significant queues yesterday.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@ulmerhutte, if yesterday was character building, what do you want to call today?! Started off nice, fresh snow and blue skies. Started to cloud over and light went flat as the next front approached. Started to snow and the wind picked up. Got to about 12:15 and up the top of Gampen it started blowing an absolute howler, people being blown backwards, lifts stopped, snow being whipped up everywhere taking visibility down to pretty much nothing. Skiied down the red towards Taps, once you dropped low enough it wasn't too bad, in fact the wind had smoothed out some of the earlier bumps, but exposed the ice in other places. There were people on the top section just below the Gampen restaurant walking back up to shelter, others just sat down huddled to see it out, very easy to take a wrong turn if you didn't know where you are. One of the chairs got blown off Zammermoos, no idea if there were any injuries or if anybody was even on that chair, only seen a photo of it lying on the floor by one of the pylons.

Has since cleared up and there's sunshine and blue sky here in Pettneu. rolling eyes
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I love storm skiing. The true, hardy, die hard skiers are all you have for company. Bluebird days are over rated! wink
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Toadman wrote:
I love storm skiing. The true, hardy, die hard skiers are all you have for company. Bluebird days are over rated! wink


I can cope with a nice blend!! Off to airport. With luck they'll close the pass after we get there due ro Coronavirus and we'll be isolated in lech for 14 days Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley


Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Wed 26-02-20 17:48; edited 1 time in total
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@Sitter, were your kids ok (assuming you have had a group this week)?
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gortonator wrote:
and we'll be isolated in lech for 14 days Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley


Hope you got your credit card to pay the bill Very Happy Very Happy
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stanton wrote:
gortonator wrote:
and we'll be isolated in lech for 14 days Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley Madeye-Smiley


Hope you got your credit card to pay the bill Very Happy Very Happy


surely an insurance claim!!!???
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Super skiing after 3pm, sun and everybody had cleared off the mountain, off piste fun on Gampen!
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Forgot to post this earlier this week but he has it accurate so far .....


http://youtube.com/v/q0hupcyarNQ
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Hope nobody was injured...

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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@stanton, Morris is a much better source of forecasts than the ZAMG ones you persist in posting.
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@munich_irish, Begin of season I rely on the Cows …..and during the season (2-5days) on Herr Pichler as he is accurate.
Daily observation just on experience if your in St Anton just look up at the sky over Rendl and you can tell how the day/evening will pan out.

Flirsch we have other things to worry about..
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More on the Hotel Staff Room Fight early Monday morning (Sunday night)
Two young Hotel employees (27-22) in a dispute. The 22yr Brit was seriously injured.
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