 Poster: A snowHead
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bedfordblue,
There allways a ratio problem of men to woman in ski resorts & St Anton is no exception however in recent years it is very noticable the increase the large groups of guys from the UK all on the wee wee & all out of there depth on this mountain. IMHO . Seefeld or Lermoos would be a more suitable ski mountain (hill) for them.
Most head to St Anton as there first Austrian ski (trip) destination but when they hear/find out that theres more apres & drinking to be had in Solden & Ischgl they disperse over there the following seasons.
Im also tired of the resort 15 years ago but not of the skiing 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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saikee, all the itineraries in St Anton are marked by a red diamond sign, however this doesn't mean that they are a "red run". If you can ski the number 3 route down the gondola then you could easily cope with any of the black runs.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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hayley t, take a look at http://www.ultimate-ski.com/uk/Ski_Resorts/Austria/St_Anton/index.html which has loads of info
1. yes
2. yes plenty and some good ones throughout arlberg - hospiz alm (st c), rodel hutte (st a), zenhutte (st a), monschein (stuben). rot wand (zug) and/or bar restauarant at top of the two man chair above zug, mohnenflu (high above oberlech), sun terrace at burgvital (oberlech)
3. yes 20 euro lunch possible throughout but more can easily be spent at some choice mountain restaurants
4. yes zenhutte (trad german apres ski), mooserwirt (st a), s'griabli (st a), krazy 'roo (st a but long past its best) all these close by on slopes in st a
5. yes from top schindler grat triple chair to st a is longest but before that from top same chair to rautz then continue to stuben is a long fun run
6. yes zurs and lech included on ski pass
Depending time of year / day you can expect encounter moguls on some runs, often avoidable, occassionally not e.g. first section top triple chair or black 2 on galzig in afternoon when churned up by the day's skiers
Easy blue run skiing on Rendl above st a
St A 4-star hotels e.g. Alte Post getting pricey, 3-star Hotel Sailor is great position and worth considering, Pension Haus Lina is excellent B&B and might try Hotel Anton or grab a late deal with Mark Warner Chalet Hotel Rosanna if you not too fussy about food
Have fun
DH
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Kramer,
| Quote: |
| If you can ski the number 3 route down the gondola then you could easily cope with any of the black runs. |
Couldn't agree more!
The red diamonds are ski routes according to the St Anton piste map. Those with black border round a red diamond are classified as "extreme". Run No. 3 belongs to the former.
It was the second most difficult run I encountered. The most difficult one on my book is the the No. 1 black run of Grands Montets. Not a mogual chaser myself.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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St Anton was noted for very tough blacks but have turned many of them into ski itineraries, presumably so they can be kept open all the time without risking litigation.
The off-piste at St Anton is tougher than at Lech. And there is a huge amount of it.
Graham Austick has a team of guides and normally guides the highest standard group. They may give some tips on skiing but I don't think they really give off piste lessons. (but I may be wrong - has anyone had any experience?)
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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snowball,
| Quote: |
| The off-piste at St Anton is tougher than at Lech. |
There is no comparision and hence the confusion we had.
We were a bit apprehensive of the White Ring initially as one section, from top of Madloch-Joch (2438) to Zug (1511), is ski itineraries all the way. I have reported the Run 48 on the opposite side of the Zug valley as being groomed-like and nicely prepared but used by very few skiers.
I would say the itineraries 33, 32, 33a and 48 in Lech have been groomed deliberately because they are almost mogul-free! The Run 48 was definitely full of groomed groove tracks.
Therefore it appears at Lech the itineraries are marketed differently than at At Anton.
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I don't agree. Graham kept us just ahead of the pack, always the first on a new slope for fresh tracks when it becomes safe from Avalanche (Hinter Rendel for example); climbing up a bit, quite often, to get an exciting slope I wouldn't have found otherwise. Or long descents after a 40 minute climb, above St Christoph, to a railway station many miles down the valley, some of it through nicely spaced woods.
Much of this we wouldn't have dared ski due to quite high avalanche danger, or just wouldn't have found.
I'm not sure but I think This was a gentler part of a Hinter Rendel variant. (Graham's photo)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I was in St Anton the same time as Charlentec(Sp?) and had a great time. I would add to all the comments that it's a lot harder in grading than many other resorts but not totally way out, some of the black pistes seemed easier than the reds. We did the "White Ring" in Zurs/Zug/Lech without realising what we were doing. I must admit it was with some trepidation that we did the ski route from MadLoch-Joch to Zug as this was the first ski route in Zurs we had done as opposed to St Anton and it was just life a motorway piste in the main had a wail of a time. Also enjoyed a huge pizza at the top of the Zug chair lift - great views back to MadLoch-Joch. Stopped at the bottom of the Nasserain gondola and spent most evenings in the Fang bar ... don't look at the ceiling please.
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| snowball wrote: |
| Graham Austick has a team of guides and normally guides the highest standard group. They may give some tips on skiing but I don't think they really give off piste lessons. (but I may be wrong - has anyone had any experience?) |
Piste to Powder (Austicks company) offer off piste teaching on their web site. I'm seriously considering having a couple of days with them for me and my family, pretty much off piste beginners, so they better had. They certainly sounded convincing on the 'phone; start off the piste, see how good you are (or not), head for some off piste near the piste, take it from there, followed by beers and bandaging.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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snowball,
Graham kept us just ahead of the pack
I would expect that from a guide & I have no doubt about PtoP guides abilities. I was talking about the people behind them (not all) ?
FYI 60% of avalanches incidents in the Arlberg occur within the northern sector. This includes all slopes from NW-N-NE which is indeed is most of Rendl . Hinter Rendl can be skied safe by most people in fact it is a marked ski route. Many slides & fatalaties have occured in the Ro
I think you mean Stuben to Langen not St Christoph to Langen  Prbably either the Kaltenberhutte-Langen or Maroikopf-Langen routes both around 6.6.Kms the second route being the more difficult. Many avalanches & fatalties occur in the The Roßfall sector of Rendl.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Yes, I meant Stuben - an easy but delightful selection of routes. Everything on the holiday was lovely deep powder.
I don't think we did the main Hinter Rendel route either time, though I saw it. The entry at the top was 45º changing to 40º. Graham had to cut away a very small cornice to let us in.
What I was disputing was that one could do what Graham does without a guide. (Certainly there are some parts of it one could do, if very experienced in off-piste skiing and some snow-craft, and of course with a good 1:25,000 map (which I always buy anyway).
I should say that he said we (the others were Scandinavians) were the best standard group he had had for a long time, so we were able sometimes to ski things he didn't normally take clients on.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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DB,
yeah riight !
I done every route multiple times over 25yrs & never worn or taken n a transmitter , rucksak , probe etc . Its all the mind talk some real locals
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Poster: A snowHead
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| stevew wrote: |
| Stopped at the bottom of the Nasserain gondola and spent most evenings in the Fang bar ... don't look at the ceiling please. |
Thugs the lot of yers 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I should add that our landlady at the B&B was seriously worried for us, hearing what we were skiing at that avalanche danger level - even knowing we were with a guide.
Obviousl;y, stanton, you are exceptional and I accept you may be able to do what you do safely, but I don't think others reading this thread should imagine it applies to them.
Stuart and I did do a week of Heliskiing this year, on the Alaska - BC border. We were 2 groups of 5 with one helicopter. Luckily we skied with a group of 3 Frenchmen, one of whom had been a ski instructor, so we had a good time despite everything being breakable crust above the tree line.
By the way, next season we intend to go to St Anton again, skiing with Graham most of the days (I have only been twice before - a strange oversight). Perhaps if you are there we might ski together a couple of days.
(I should not, however, overstate our standard: we are, after all, middle aged, 3 week a year skiers, not people who have lived in the Alps).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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When I get some time (when the season is over) I will write up a piece on this forum listing all the well known Off-Piste routes in the Arlberg.
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Obviousl;y, stanton, you are exceptional and I accept you may be able to do what you do safely
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Thanks I follow some basic rules but I personally never ski above Level 2
I never ski runs that are obviously dangerous or to steep
Begin of every run scoop down and check for loose/granular (weak layer) snow between last dump & new dump.
A Level 2 I dont ski slopes above 39degrees
A Level 3 nothing above 34 degrees
A Level 4 nothing above 30
If im in any doubt I dont ski it.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| stanton wrote: |
When I get some time (when the season is over) I will write up a piece on this forum listing all the well known Off-Piste routes in the Arlberg.
| Quote: |
Obviousl;y, stanton, you are exceptional and I accept you may be able to do what you do safely
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Thanks I follow some basic rules but I personally never ski above Level 2
I never ski runs that are obviously dangerous or to steep
Begin of every run scoop down and check for loose/granular (weak layer) snow between last dump & new dump.
A Level 2 I dont ski slopes above 39degrees
A Level 3 nothing above 34 degrees
A Level 4 nothing above 30
If im in any doubt I dont ski it. |
Those are interesting guidelines. How widely shared do you think those are among experienced off-piste skiers?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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If your guide doesnt dig a hole at the top of everyrun to check the snow, I wouldnt ski with them 
Experienced high alpine tourers would observe these,thjats why they survive. I doubt many recreational off-piste skier/boarders do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| stanton wrote: |
If your guide doesnt dig a hole at the top of everyrun to check the snow, I wouldnt ski with them
Experienced high alpine tourers would observe these,thjats why they survive. I doubt many recreational off-piste skier/boarders do. |
Having skied for many years with many qualified mountain guides I have never known one to do this except when teaching on a snow-craft course or 2 or 3 times to demonstrate to us something he already knew.
For ordinary punters like us, of course, it is a different matter.
Given the slope pitch limitations you give yourself then clearly you do not, as you stated, ski some of the slopes Graham might take you on, even on low avalanche-danger days.
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| snowball wrote: |
| stanton wrote: |
If your guide doesnt dig a hole at the top of everyrun to check the snow, I wouldnt ski with them
Experienced high alpine tourers would observe these,thjats why they survive. I doubt many recreational off-piste skier/boarders do. |
Having skied for many years with many qualified mountain guides I have never known one to do this except when teaching on a snow-craft course or 2 or 3 times to demonstrate to us something he already knew.
For ordinary punters like us, of course, it is a different matter.
Given the slope pitch limitations you give yourself then clearly you do not, as you stated, ski some of the slopes Graham might take you on, even on low avalanche-danger days. |
I totally agree with snowball regarding his comments about digging snow profiles. I have skied with many mountain guides as well and they just do not do it when leading clients, other than occasionally for educational purposes.
The safety of a slope can vary all the way down. Digging a hole at the top of a slope can help tell you how safe it is at that point, but what about 400 metres further down, or 800 metres or 1200 metres? What about when the slope changes steepness, or the contour changes, or it narrows etc.? Think of any reasonably long off piste decent you have ever done and think of how many times you normally stop on the way to catch your breath, regroup and take a look at the next pitch. If digging snow holes is of any real value then you should be digging them at regular intervals throughout the descent and nobody does that.
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thread Hi-jack?? ... pissing competition anyone?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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No not a hijacked thread, just a thread that has wandered off into a discussion which some might find useful.
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hayleyt, can't really see you traversing off piste, digging holes and caning it down 45 - 50 degree back country or have I seriously under-estimated your prowess???
richjp, I'm sure some do find it interesting, but I'm certain more would if it was being discussed in a thread with a title to suggest the same! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Adamski, seriously underestimated! Didn't you listen to a word I said in Saalbach!
That said I have been known to occasionally traverse off-piste - both intentionally and unintentionally and I tend to wane down 45-50 deg slopes rather than cane!
Fortunately, my questions were answered earlier on in this thread. But I may take a shovel to St Anton just in case!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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See the resort report for our experience with Piste to Powder (it was excellent), if you're interested.
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Good report richmond, had me laughing 
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FAQ
I guess its a business and its just money in the bank at the end of the season 
