 Poster: A snowHead
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Just wondering why there are no trees above say 2300 metres ? I love skiing on pistes that are tree lined.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 6-02-19 13:49; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Lack of O2?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Mosha Marc wrote: |
| Lack of O2? |
Why would lack of O2 be the factor. I recall learning that trees take in CO2 and expire O2. Isnt thats why everyone wants to plant them to offset out CO2 emissions?
Also if lack of O2 was an issue you might see a lot more skiers wearing breathing apparatus?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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There is a point at which the climate and/or soil, will not support trees, but the environment may support other plant growth, until you get to a point where not much survives at all.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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No soil on the tops of mountains so no support for tree growth.
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You will note the "?"
As Boris links to; it's lack of moisture and the cold.
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@kezzy19661, you need to ski in Austria. Most skiing is below 2,000m, lots of trees.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Go to North America. In Colorado, trees grow to much higher elevation, well above 3000 metre.
Even at the Alps, there will be trees above 2300 metre. Just takes time. With global warming, there will be more and more trees growing in higher and higher elevation.
For the same reason (length of growing season is inversely proportional to snow fall), there will be shorter and shorter ski season and more frequent lack of snow during the typical ski holidays (Christmas-new year).
Be careful what you wish. You may actually get it.
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In general increasing height means lower temperatures. Depending on the type of tree it will need a certain minimum temperature to grow, the typical mountain fir tree thrives in much lower temperatures than say an oak tree. However there will come a point (which varies from place to place) where the average temperature is too low for any trees to grow properly (the amount of precipitation is an issue too but less relevant here). For a rather more detailed explanation see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_line.
Very broadly, in the alps the tree line is higher in France and in western Italy and lower in Austria and the Dolomites. However the resorts and snow level are generally lower in Austria so there tends to be more skiing amongst the trees there, compare Tignes to Flachau for example. Of course plenty of skiing can be found amongst the trees in France and in open mountain bowls in Austria.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| queenie pretty please wrote: |
| @kezzy19661, you need to ski in Austria. Most skiing is below 2,000m, lots of trees. |
Good apres skiing in Austria and infrastructure but I find the sking all a bit too similar. I just love italy.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| abc wrote: |
Go to North America. In Colorado, trees grow to much higher elevation, well above 3000 metre.
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Interesting! So why is the tree line higher in North America? The tree line seems to be dicated by coldness and moisture, and sun exposure - is it not as cold at that elevation in Colorado?
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| Handy Turnip wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
Go to North America. In Colorado, trees grow to much higher elevation, well above 3000 metre.
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Interesting! So why is the tree line higher in North America? The tree line seems to be dicated by coldness and moisture, and sun exposure - is it not as cold at that elevation in Colorado? |
Differences between maritime and continental climates, prevailing winds, species. Colorado is generally much colder than the Alps at resort level, but it gets a hige number of sunny days.
Plus trees have some neat tricks to adapt to soil etc
This is Bryce so about 8900ft elevation Iirc but there are full forests on the plateau.
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Wed 6-02-19 14:37; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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The reasons for lack of trees vary. In many places where skiing takes place on pastures the forest would soon take over if farmers abandoned the pastures.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Cheers @Dave of the Marmottes, good explanation!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Colorado is on same latitude as Greece..
Its to do with warm & cold climates
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Boris wrote: |
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_line |
That's a great link Boris, thanks, one of those time when wikipedia really delivers.
I learned a new word - krummholtz - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krummholz .
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@stanton, it’s also to do with animals/ grazing as @pam w notes. eg, in Scotland, the tree line should be rather higher than it currently is, but overgrazing by sheep and red deer have historically kept it low. Areas like those in Cairngorms partnership and Coigach-Assynt living landscape projects are seeing tree line ascend, up to and beyond 550masl (which is closer to what it could be, were nature left to own devices, in arctic-alpine setting in our latitude).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| pam w wrote: |
| The reasons for lack of trees vary. In many places where skiing takes place on pastures the forest would soon take over if farmers abandoned the pastures. |
<cough> it'll be interesting to see how various bits of the UK fare, once agriculture is subject to market forces 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Several factors.
Temperature.
Wind.
Climate.
Atmosphere.
Air pressure.
Soil.
Nutrients.
Water.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Handy Turnip wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
Go to North America. In Colorado, trees grow to much higher elevation, well above 3000 metre.
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Interesting! So why is the tree line higher in North America? The tree line seems to be dicated by coldness and moisture, and sun exposure - is it not as cold at that elevation in Colorado? |
Differences between maritime and continental climates, prevailing winds, species. Colorado is generally much colder than the Alps at resort level, but it gets a hige number of sunny days.
Plus trees have some neat tricks to adapt to soil etc
This is Bryce so about 8900ft elevation Iirc but there are full forests on the plateau. |
Tree line in Åre, Sweden is about at the top of the VM8 lift which is 843m. But it’s only rocks above that.
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There are trees in Corrie Cas above 600m but they are less than a couple of feet high and 80 years old!
High winds and a short growing season dictates the tree line. Increasing wind speeds in the alps may counteract a rising tree line in the warming Alps.
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There are trees in Corrie Cas above 600m but they are less than a couple of feet high and 80 years old!
High winds and a short growing season dictates the tree line. Increasing wind speeds in the alps may counteract a rising tree line in the warming Alps.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Inboard, Colorado is upto 4000 metres.. Scotland is a much higher latitude and half the Mountain elevation
There are 3000 metre high Mountain in Rwanda and Indonesia with Trees and snow
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I recall sailing in the Hebrides with someone who knew the area well. He told us about a "flag tatter" test, used to determine whether it was worth planting trees in some locations or whether winds were too high. He also mentioned one island, which had a tree which became an important landmark, as in "Let's have a walk to the tree". There was just the one.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| abc wrote: |
| .....Go to North America. In Colorado, trees grow to much higher elevation, well above 3000 metre........ |
This did confuse me when I went to Crested Bute and had me googling as to reasons why, which I never really found out why.
Don't quite buy the "more sunny days" as here down Sarf in French Alps it's well known/recorded how many days of sunshine we (supposedly) have. Though I get the species thing possibly.
The Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_line correct me if I missed it still did not explain the difference between Colorado and French Alps?
I'm back out to Colorado in a couple of weeks and will take a closer look, and @Dave of the Marmottes, I might even take some video 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Wind is also a big factor.
Shetland is just above sea level and no trees. Too much wind for the saplings to survive
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