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What can be said about my skiing technique?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hey all,

So this is a long shot, but here is a video my mate took of me at the end of a green run last night. He wanted to video how I looked when I ski so I can see for myself.


Skiing at Cypress. Bad Technique from Devsi
See Here

Apologies, I keep skiing out of the shot, but you can make out the position of my arms and legs, and the rotation of my body which I hope is enough.

If possible could anybody be so kind as to give me some pointers that I can focus on the next time I get out on my skis?

My level of skiing is around the easier end of double black diamond. I don't look pretty, but I can get down it without taking a tumble.

I've never had a lesson, so really, I have no idea what I'm doing wrong!

If you're feeling charitable, I'd love to hear some of your thoughts. Smile

Thanks!


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 23-01-19 0:05; edited 4 times in total
snow conditions     
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
On the other hand, if it's just not possible to give any feedback from watching this, then I'll simply delete the post and take a better video during a day sometime!
ski holidays     
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@ceryski, not that I can offer anything helpful but couldn’t watch video as I need flash installed.
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I wondered about that. I was able to just enable it as it's installed in Chrome by default. Maybe I can find a better medium to upload to
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I'm running Chrome and I can't see it.
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Okay, I've used Vimeo. New URL updated.


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Wed 23-01-19 0:04; edited 1 time in total
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Your turns aren't very round, more a series of zig-zags, where you flick the skis sideways (using a lot of upper body rotation to help change direction) and then a bit of a straight line before flicking the skis sideways in the opposite direction. You can get away with that on easy terrain with nice snow but it's not a good foundation for developing your ability to ski anything more than that easy terrain.

I would have concluded that you'd not had (many, maybe any) ski lessons, and I think that's where you are going wrong. You need to work on your fundamental skiing skills, and probably the best way to do that is with an instructor. Clearly you are happy to travel at speed, and look like you're enjoying things, so with a good instructor you should make rapid progress. But at the moment if you cement the movements you are making now they are going to become bad habits quite quickly, which will be difficult to change later on.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
ceryski wrote:


My level of skiing is around the easier end of double black diamond. I don't look pretty, but I can get down it without taking a tumble....

I've never had a lesson..


Shocked
You've done well to get that far. I can't see the vid either. But imagine how well you'd ski after lessons!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
It looks as though you're really enjoying yourself, and judging by your speed have had a lot of practice at what you have learnt so far. You're definitely ready for more lessons. Maybe there's an instructor among us who will get into specifics in the forum, but you're probably best getting advice in person.
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Quote:

flicking the skis sideways in the opposite direction.


@rob@rar And that is how I manage to get down a double black Laughing That flick gets me down them as I'm not scared by the speed, but as you say it's not a good basis, and I get very tired very quick. I will take note of the quick turns, and try and round them out a bit more. I don't currently carve so I suspect thats the reason I'm flicking the ski's out. If I can round it out with skidded turns that'll be a start. A lesson in carving will be incredibly beneficial.

Lessons is going to happen. I'd like to work on it a bit before I have one however. (Mainly so I can save up a few bucks for it!)
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
ceryski wrote:
And that is how I manage to get down a double black Laughing
Just to highlight the obvious, there's getting down a double black diamond and skiing down a double black diamond. Two quite different things Happy

ceryski wrote:
That flick gets me down them as I'm not scared by the speed, but as you say it's not a good basis, and I get very tired very quick. I will take note of the quick turns, and try and round them out a bit more. I don't currently carve so I suspect thats the reason I'm flicking the ski's out. If I can round it out with skidded turns that'll be a start. A lesson in carving will be incredibly beneficial.
To be honest, you're a long way off carving. I think the priority for you would be smooth out the beginning of all your turns, replacing that flick with standing / balancing more effectively on your outside ski as the turn begins. If you do that the ski will start to turn you in a much smoother, rounder turn. At the moment you are turning by a quick pivot of the ski in to a different direction which means that for most of the change in direction you are getting almost no grip from the ski.

ceryski wrote:
Lessons is going to happen. I'd like to work on it a bit before I have one however. (Mainly so I can save up a few bucks for it!)
I appreciate that lessons are not cheap, but I think earlier lessons will be a better investment for you rather than waiting until some of your current bad habits get too ingrained and consequently take much longer to put right.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
rob@rar wrote:
I appreciate that lessons are not cheap, but I think earlier lessons will be a better investment for you rather than waiting until some of your current bad habits get too ingrained and consequently take much longer to put right.


This. A few lessons to get the basic movements right now will be far more effective than trying to fix things yourself based on Internet analysis. Then you can practice, practice, practice to ingrain the right technique. The longer you leave it, the harder (and more expensive) it will be to fix.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Quote:

there's getting down a double black diamond and skiing down a double black diamond


@rob@rar, I agree. I guess a more accurate description would be to say I can ski blues very comfortably, I can ski a black diamond without much trouble, I can "get down" a double black. It's not like I take it slowly and edge down them, I can turn, but it looks much like what you see in the video, just 100x exaggerated. On that note I am very aware that I don't improve by taking those lines. I just enjoy the thrill of the harder runs regardless of how good/bad I am!

I am prepared to take some steps back as the snow fall is bad this year and even some of the blue runs are closed.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I'd not offer anything that @rob@rar, has not already said, as he's a real instructor, and I'm not. But echo the advice to get correcting it now to set all your efforts in a productive direction.

It looks like you've easily got the ability to get on the right track, given good guidance for you to work on.

One of the People in our ski group has effectively set himself like that and been doing it so long he's probably never going to change. We even call him "twitch and slide" after that technique! First the shoulders twitch in the direction you wish, then the skis and lower body align, then just sliiiiiiiide, until another twitch is instigated.

Just watch your shoulders in the video as they move first of all and shouldn't Very Happy
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I'm afraid, all you are doing is ingraining bad habits, that will likely be more difficult and thus more time consuming for an instructor to correct....which will ultimately end up being more expensive.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@ski3, twitch and slide! Laughing . There's a reason to get tuition right there! I checked the video, you're absolutely right. My shoulders are turning first. I'll be aware of that when I go out this weekend. I'll try and line up a lesson for the beginning of Feb.

I have a trip to Revelstoke upcoming so its already a little expensive this month but I'll see what I can fork out. Lessons at Cypress are like CAD $350+tax for 3 hours. Not particularly cheap. But as @Old_Fartbag and a few others have said now, it'll be worth getting it done sooner in the long run.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Full points for posting a video, and glad that Cypress has a decent amount.

It's great to have enthusiasm, but I think it's important not to waste it becoming "an expert beginner".

It is possible to teach oneself without instructors - I did it for both skiing and snowboarding. However almost no one ever makes it. Mostly people fall into the "expert beginner" hole and never get out of it. Skiing like that on double-black diamonds...

I was in that place with swimming years ago - I was better than most people, but I couldn't get beyond a certain speed/ duration. I swam with someone who told me the harsh truth: I needed to slow down, perfect my technique, then I would be able to speed up. I didn't take lessons, I just followed that advice and I dug myself out of the "expert beginner" trap. My advice then is, lessons or otherwise, if you want to improve, forget about the steep and deep and get your basic technique sorted out on the easiest terrain first.

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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@philwig, Nothing really wrong with that until boredom sets in, challenges await and you want to improve. Exactly the same with golf. Decades wasted hacking around. Best money I spent was on lessons for both.

Although $100+ ph is a feckin rip off, unless it's lesson n lunch with Ms Schiffrin!
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@philwig, that link is perfectly applicable to me. I am a software developer too. I like that you open the opportunity to dig yourself out without the need for tuition, however i'll need constant peer review, and I don't have enough ski buddies to video me and criticize my technique regularly! That said, slow down and work on technique is what I am doing now the conditions aren't so great. A terrain park competent snowboarding friend of mine is giving me tips for take off and landing on 10ft kickers that are on the side of a blue that I enjoy doing. It's near the top, which gives me the rest of the blue run to take it slow and practice. Most likely where i'll be spending the rest of the season! Smile


Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Tue 22-01-19 23:31; edited 1 time in total
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@AL9000 Hah! I'd pay double that for lessons n lunch with Ms Shiffrin.
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ceryski wrote:
@philwig, A terrain park competent snowboarding friend of mine is giving me tips for take off and landing on 10ft kickers that are on the side of a blue that I enjoy doing. It's near the top, which gives me the rest of the blue run to take it slow and practice. Most likely where i'll be spending the rest of the season! Smile

If this were a Canadian based forum I'd excuse myself to get some popcorn right about now.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
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ceryski wrote:
..snowboarding friend of mine is giving me tips for take off and landing on 10ft kickers..


Your shoulder turn will be useful if you ever graduate to spins wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Your permissions on Vimeo are set to prevent embedding of the video you tried to display here.
This caused a problem with the page so I've removed the Vimeo links.
Please set your permissions to allow this before replacing the links.
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I was firmly in the expert beginner category, no lessons I just went skiing. I could fly around whole resorts inc blacks at great speed but to be honest not in great control I used a "hockey stop" to slow down and get back control. I found it hard to ski slow. I could never ski past lunch time (my quads had given up). Only way for me was to get past this stage was lessons, it's still working progress!

If your in Vancouver area (reference to cypress ski) you could do a lot worse than look at max4 at whistler. If you go at end of feb (low season) think it's less than $400 for 3 full days in a group of no more than 4. I think it would be perfect for you.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
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ceryski wrote:
@AL9000 Hah! I'd pay double that for lessons n lunch with Ms Shiffrin.


Here you go ... get these drills right and you'll do well...


http://youtube.com/v/wNbEp1SRVag
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@admin, I wondered why that error was appearing on the page. Fixed Smile

@AL9000, Haha, I don't think I'll be graduating any further than flailing arms and a somewhat solid landing. Its helping a lot with my general balance and confidence when I hit a bump or roller at speed however. And it's very fun! Not a priority though. Wink

@WASHOUT, I think you used to sound like me right now. "Hockey stop" is exactly it. I point down until I get scared or lose control, then hockey stop. I enjoy the moguls because i'm constantly keeping my speed down, and it feels cool. I'll check out max4! I'm Vancouver based as you say. I might find it hard to get the time/rides/accommodation for 3 days, but I'll definitely investigate.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
If your on a tight budget that new pangea hotel/hostel looks pretty sweet. Excellent location and $3.50 a beer, also follow them on Facebook they often stick up discount codes. Unfortunately can't help on lift pass they are expensive, there used to be BC residents rate maybe worth looking into it.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Day passes are $169CAD if you buy at the window, $155 online. It makes me angry. I have a Cypress season pass but even they have put their rates up for day passes from $65 to $79+tax. Grim.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Well youth and balance + confidence clearly go quite a long way. You'll probably be a pretty decent skier once you slow it down, learn to really turn your skis and then build it up.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Crazy, only sensible priced whistler ticket is the season pass (epic) $900 usd but can only buy it until start of season. Tbh the epic pass is very good value as we can use it over here in Europe aswell!
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
WASHOUT wrote:
Crazy, only sensible priced whistler ticket is the season pass (epic) $900 usd but can only buy it until start of season. Tbh the epic pass is very good value as we can use it over here in Europe aswell!


.....aaaaand here is why I am willing to fly from the US to Europe to go skiing. When you factor in a family of 4 with private lessons to work on technique, its a wash and I prefer skiing in the Alps (and the food!)
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
My main piece of advice would be get your friend to hold the phone in landscape orientation, then you won't ski out the frame so much!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
So here is another video, even harder to see this time because I'm further away. I spent a few hours out last night trying to round out my turns. I began to feel the edges catch and it took a while to work out the balance point, but when they caught I could feel them really pick up speed and then when I flattened out the ski's my legs would pull back. A strange sensation, and unsure if it was right. However have it!


Working on the technique. from Devsi
Rounder turns!
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@ceryski, much better. Try balancing against the outside ski at the start of the turn a little bit more, perhaps extending your leg to do so. Then work for a little more grip as you go around the turn.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
The more I watch this, the more I realize I need to buy my girlfriend a go-pro and gimbal stick. Shocked
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ceryski wrote:
The more I watch this, the more I realize I need to buy my girlfriend a go-pro and gimbal stick. Shocked
Bonus points for romantic gifts.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
rob@rar thanks!

Would I be right in thinking I should be leaning forward in to my boots to stop my ski's from pulling out when the edge grips? It seems unless I make a concerted effort to push my weight forward, I fall over. My ski's will whip out from beneath me as the edge grips and my body gets left in the back seat.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
ceryski wrote:
rob@rar thanks!

Would I be right in thinking I should be leaning forward in to my boots to stop my ski's from pulling out when the edge grips?
No, don't try to lean too far forward. The sweet spot is to be balanced approximately on the middle of your foot and to treat that as your 'neutral stance'.
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