Poster: A snowHead
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I love owning my own skis. Financially I don’t think it makes sense vs hiring for 1 or 2 weeks a year. I now do 3 and that probably in the limit.
However, for me that was never the reason. For me it was being able to step into the same pair and know exactly how they’ve been treated, waxed, edged etc. I’m an intermediate skier and having that comfort at my level is great. I also use kneebindings but they were an after thought.
I now have economies of scale (whole set for family) and last year took 4 sets away in one bag, bindings off in seperate luggage. Do my own servicing added an hanging burr, clicked what it was and resolved it.
Knowing about my skis, how to service them (and correct my mistakes) is a massive plus. Rather than getting rentals and going is it me, is it the skis, is it the length etc etc.
But, in hindsight, I bought my first pair too early. I bought them after 1 week and should have learnt more about skis first. I basically bought the red ones. Sold those. So for my friend who just started I’ve recommended waiting at least get to a comfortable level and then look.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@PeakyB, LH fly Birmingham to Munich
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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achilles wrote: |
I left my skis at Les Deux Alpes for a very reasonable fee and will leave them again once I have skied this year. Saves a lot of hassle - it it does kinda limit you to one resort! |
Alps2alps have just started to offer free ski storage at airport locations free if you use them for transfers, or 5E a month otherwise. So if you store at Geneva, for example, you'd have all the Geneva resorts to chose from.
https://www.alps2alps.com/ski-depot
I've not used the storage but I have used them for transfers for the last few years, so I am seriously considering it.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Themasterpiece wrote: |
The analogy to golf or other sports is interesting. ... . |
Surfing or windsurfing may be better analogies.
The best boards to learn to surf on are not what an expert would use.
If you buy something "too advanced" you'll struggle to catch any waves at all and may well give up.
However you don't want to buy a foam long-board because you will progress quickly on the right gear.
The best gear is that which is most fun.
djf wrote: |
...But, in hindsight, I bought my first pair too early. I bought them after 1 week and should have learnt more about skis first. I basically bought the red ones. Sold those. ... |
I suspect a majority of people do that. The trick, perhaps, is in how and when people address the problems that causes.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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philwig wrote: |
The best boards to learn to surf on are not what an expert would use.
If you buy something "too advanced" you'll struggle to catch any waves at all and may well give up.
However you don't want to buy a foam long-board because you will progress quickly on the right gear.
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Precisely. After one week snowboarding I went into a couple of shops and, being an experienced surfer, asked for a snowboard that would be great for carving. Result was that I bought a stiff mid-wide full camber board which I spent several years taming. Only last season, after spending 120+ days on easier boards, could I really use it like it was designed for.
The upshot is that I've "got away with" buying a new board every year for the last 4 or 5 years! So I buy a new board about every 50 days snowboarding and take 3 or 4 with me in the motorhome for our two month trip. Moving around in the motorhome every 4 or 5 days means that renting would be very inconvenient but I do rent on occassion if I find something that looks interesting to try. Most boards I spend £300-£360 on but the last was only £125.
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I would buy my own even for 2 weeks a year if I had some more disposable income.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I ski 3 weeks a year. 1 with the family, 1 with friends and 1 with work. Those 3 trips are often over a 6 week period
Over those three trips my ski could vary so much from shop to shop, why take the risk and ruin a holiday for the sake of £400 over say 5 years of the life of the ski.
I am also a massive dandy who needed matching skis to my boots etc
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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FoofyNoo wrote: |
Financial considerations are NEVER part of it .....
Very few things equate to the joy of purchasing a shiny new set of skis.
I have mine in my spare room with the door permanently open so every time I walk down the stairs on my way to work I can catch a glimpse of them. This gives me a warm fuzzy feeling and the thought that life really isn't that bad......
Or perhaps I am just weird? |
Do you also polish the top sheets whenever you do the housework? Not that I do of course.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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djf wrote: |
But, in hindsight, I bought my first pair too early. I bought them after 1 week and should have learnt more about skis first. I basically bought the red ones. Sold those. So for my friend who just started I’ve recommended waiting at least get to a comfortable level and then look. |
Yeah this is definitely a problem. I think if you have skied less than 6 weeks or so you'll either buy the wrong ski and make yourself unhappy or you'll grow out of them too soon for it to be worthwhile. If you aren't thinking about doing blacks yet you probably aren't in a position to buy skis that will last you.
So definitely not economical at the beginning.
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Dmitri wrote: |
djf wrote: |
But, in hindsight, I bought my first pair too early. I bought them after 1 week and should have learnt more about skis first. I basically bought the red ones. Sold those. So for my friend who just started I’ve recommended waiting at least get to a comfortable level and then look. |
Yeah this is definitely a problem. I think if you have skied less than 6 weeks or so you'll either buy the wrong ski and make yourself unhappy or you'll grow out of them too soon for it to be worthwhile. If you aren't thinking about doing blacks yet you probably aren't in a position to buy skis that will last you.
So definitely not economical at the beginning. |
+1
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You know it makes sense.
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In my opinion you really don't buy skis for economic benefit. You buy them to have a nice piece of your own kit that feels trustworthy and you know how it will behave. It's also just nice to have some of your own!
(Also no more waiting in hire shop queues for hours after arriving in resort)
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I was just getting good at the rental side when I won a pair of skis in a competition. Apart from being very suspicious because I am fairly sure I didn't enter a competition, I became the proud owner of a pair of Head Rev 90s 6 years ago. That prompted me to buy my partner a pair, too, on eBay for £90. We find that the cost of carriage and the servicing is a bit less than rental, and with the very low capital cost it has been worth it.
One point of note is that Flybe insist on one pair per carriage hire and have checked.
And … I love my skis. I've skied in them, on piste and off, dryslope and snow, for six years and they are old friends. I store them in my study where I can look at them (and my helmet) every day. I know them really well. They tend to clatter on icy or corrugated snow and they are probably a bit short for me now (especially of piste) but they are my skis.
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Poster: A snowHead
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No one buya skis nowadaya..
Renting is back
Even the Germans rent
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@stanton, this is snowHeads. We don’t do what everyone else does. I have a cassette player.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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henzerani wrote: |
.. I can look at them (and my helmet) every day.. |
Kinky!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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stanton wrote: |
No one buya skis nowadaya..
Renting is back
Even the Germans rent |
Nobody buys skis nowadays.... Yeah okay, if you insist
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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waitrose wrote: |
How many weeks skiing a year do you need to do to justify buying your own skis from an economic point of view? |
As others have said the question is far from that simple. We'd need to know a lot more about you to advise.
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I've never paid for ski/board carriage. I've either taken my board bag as my one piece of luggage, or I've driven. So even on 1 week a year (though these days I typically do 2 weeks a year, each trip 7-8 days on the snow) my kit would have paid for itself. Servicing - even if you pay a shop to do it is probably a sixth of the cost of a weeks rental.
I can only assume people who find it more economical to rent (or of very little saving to buy) must typically always fly the Ryanair types or package holiday tour ops who tend to charge you ski carriage. Or maybe just heavy packers .
So the real answer is it depends how you holiday.
I bought my first board when I was typically going for one full week and one or two long weekends a year and it soon paid for itself.
Anyway over 10 years let's say I've done 20 weeks. Renting would have been at least £100 a week if not quite a bit more, so that's 2k. My board was 300 (cracking end of season sale) , bindings 150 (bought out of season so significant;y reduced too), boots 100, now on second pair of boots at 200. Spend 750. Add in 100 of servicing for the first few years plus about 200 on buying my own servicing kit and consumables since, that's just over 1k. So I'm 1k quids in. That ignores the extra weekends I've done and the extra days where I managed 8 days skiing instead of 6 which would have pushed up the rental. Similar profile on my wife's ski's, I think I spent about 400 on skis and bindings (end of season bargain again) plus 200 boots, 600, say an extra 100 of servicing consumables, so saved about £1300 there, and in her case using the same kit trip after trip has been a revelation to her confidence.
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There are a lot of factors to consider - for example. I ski a lot at Plagne and leave my skis there, so it's a no brainer for me, but if you're paying ski carriage , servicing, and then lug them around buses and airports it could be different.
Buy your own boots before thinking about buying skis.
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It has nothing to do with economics. Unless you're driving, or live in resort, the cost is about the same (I am attributing a financial cost to the hell of lugging a very heavy pair of skis through the transport system).
If you need to calculate it accurately, to within the nearest £30 maybe, then you can't afford to go skiing.
If you want to buy the kit, because you like buying kit, then buy it. It will be "obsolete" in three years' time anyway, so you'll be buying new again then.
And if you are asking this question you're probably not that good a skier anyway, so won't have skied enough to get an idea of how different skis perform on your feet (to turn Admin's point that by buying you take a variable out of the equation completely on its head).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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James the Last wrote: |
It has nothing to do with economics. Unless you're driving, or live in resort, the cost is about the same (I am attributing a financial cost to the hell of lugging a very heavy pair of skis through the transport system). |
Given all the variations already discussed I am not sure how you came to the conclusion costs will always be "about the same".
James the Last wrote: |
If you want to buy the kit, because you like buying kit, then buy it. It will be "obsolete" in three years' time anyway, so you'll be buying new again then. |
Don't agree with this either. There have been a couple of big shifts in tech but your three year time span seems aribitary - certainly not "obsolete".
James the Last wrote: |
And if you are asking this question you're probably not that good a skier anyway, so won't have skied enough to get an idea of how different skis perform on your feet |
There's certainly some truth in that. There is a temptation to want the kit - even if you've no real idea of what you want/need and the benefits it will give you.
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I've done 0 weeks on a 'real' mountain but have bought my own skis. All my skiing is in a fridge, at the moment.
The boost to my skiing confidence has been immense, compared with the fridge's own rentals. I no longer fear the ice as my own skis will grip that ice rather than skid down it like the rentals.
When I do make it to an actual outdoor snowy hill, I'll take my own skis and I'll know how they perform rather than wondering what I'll get in a rental shop.
All that said, I'm glad I didn't buy a few months ago, you'll quickly outgrow a set of Intermidiot skis. I was tempted by the Rossi P200 skis earlier in the year, but I'm rather enjoying my P700s now which should be good for me whenever I'm piste skiing.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@slopemad, skis they hire for use in a fridge are hopeless in my experience.
Those supplied by decent rental shops out in the mountains are of much higher standard and likely to be maintained much better.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Layne wrote: |
James the Last wrote: |
If you want to buy the kit, because you like buying kit, then buy it. It will be "obsolete" in three years' time anyway, so you'll be buying new again then. |
Don't agree with this either. There have been a couple of big shifts in tech but your three year time span seems aribitary - certainly not "obsolete".
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Yeah that's twaddle - even for modern shapes there are plenty of examples of designs dating back to 2010 or older. New Graphic/Name Technology =/= New technonology.
And if you go too much for Emperor's new clothes you can always end up looking like a fool on your Salomon BBRs.
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@James the Last, I'm interested in what you think is the innovation of the last 3 years that has made all skis pre 2016 obsolete ?
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You know it makes sense.
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In the past 3 years, I've bought my son 6 pairs (age 8,) my daughter 5 pairs (age 6,) my wife 2 pairs and myself 2 pairs of skis. I've sold one of mine, so I think I must be due a new set. Can't wait for ski testing an Avoriaz in mid December. It's got nothing to do with economics, just like buying kit when the need arises.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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doddsie wrote: |
In the past 3 years, I've bought my son 6 pairs (age 8,) my daughter 5 pairs (age 6,) my wife 2 pairs and myself 2 pairs of skis. |
You must be loaded.
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Poster: A snowHead
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You can pick up a pair of say Rossignol Experience 84 skis with bindings and shipping for €469, or about £415.
You can hire a pair of Rossignol Experience 84 skis for a week in Avoriaz online for €185.60, or about £165.
Fly EasyJet and a ski bag will cost you £37 (one way but using that to average against Swiss, etc flights where it's free).
If you pay a shop a basic service here in the UK is about £22.
So:
Week | Hire | Buy
1 | £165 | £474
2 | £330 | £533
3 | £495 | £592
4 | £660 | £651
5 | £825 | £710
6 | £990 | £769
Or to put it another way, if you ski just 2 weeks/year for 3 years you actually make £74/year by buying skis!
And if you go 3 weeks/year you make even more, £110.50/year, so it actually makes sense to go on an extra week!
Or so you tell yourself when you buy skis.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Skis are a very personal thing.
I've owned skis for the past 35 years and now reckon that relatively skis cost a fraction of what they used to. For example in 1980 a pair of Dynastar Omesoft skis cost £179, my income was about £5000. In 1984 the Dynastar Course SL (Dore) was £220, my income around £10000. Now I can buy over the internet similar standard skis (Nordica Dobermann Spitfire, Blizzard Bonafide) for under £300, and I now earn well above £50k. Bindings add cost so put another £100 - £150 on those prices. The BIG difference now is that I can sell my 2-3 year old skis for about 50% of their original cost (Ebay, Snowheads), years ago you maybe could only sell in the local ski club.
Over the past 15 years I doubt my ski-cost have been more than £40 per ski week and the skis tend to be top-end (Premium Standard).
My advice ….. don't buy in a ski shop, they want to make money out of you so sell their skis at "RRP". Don't be afraid to buy over the internet from Euro-land. (Tend to sell more stock and want to ship out dead stock end of season). Sell your skis every 2 - 3 seasons whilst they still have plenty of life left in them and they don't become "old skis" that nobody wants.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@skimastaaah, it takes me so long and so much testing to find skis I really like that I will run them into the ground.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@under a new name, Agreed, I do tend to keep one or two specific pairs longer in my quiver, and I rotate others quicker usually due to disappointment.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Mjit, very useful cost analysis and a good guide.
Is your cost for renting skis the best value available at £165 per week?
I can see premium grade piste, freeride or all mountain skis for about £110 in late January, for example, also in Avoriaz.
That would change the comparative costs between buy and rent significantly.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Also agree that cost isn't the only factor. Confidence and peace of mind is also important. I wrecked my knee with a fall off the last rental skis I used more than ten years go. I know its subjective but that binding, IMV, should have released and didn't. So from then on only on my own serviced and tested skis and bindings. Quality skis and the best bindings every time. Risk of injury cannot be eliminated in a sport like ours but I want to minimise the possibilities as much as possible.
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Also agree that cost isn't the only factor. Confidence and peace of mind is also important. I wrecked my knee with a fall off the last rental skis I used more than ten years go. I know its subjective but that binding, IMV, should have released and didn't. So from then on only on my own serviced and tested skis and bindings. Quality skis and the best bindings every time. Risk of injury cannot be eliminated in a sport like ours but I want to minimise the possibilities as much as possible.
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@robboj, have you looked at kneebindings thread?
I originally thought like yourself about my fall when the one ski didn’t release and hence didn’t ruptured my ACL. Then reading up on kneebindings highlighted another reason
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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At one week per year I would rent.
At 3 weeks per year I reckon buying wins on both economics and satisfaction.Even if they are separate weeks.
At 2 weeks pa I think I would still buy.
But if you buy you have to accept the risk of major or minor damage on your own shoulders. Tho perhaps rental companies also need paying if you break a ski ?
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Kit!
Everyone needs more kit!
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