Poster: A snowHead
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Today I tested the Brahma and Kendo back to back. I'm 65 (ish) kg, 175 tall and somewhere between 6 and 7 on the SH scale (maybe nearer 7 now). I ski 177 Soul Riders as my daily driver, and love them but they've taken a beating recently and I probably should be on something a bit stiffer now. The Brahma (173) took me for a ski, except for a few turns on a wide red where I managed to hook them up. The rest of the time, they just did nothing for me and as I got tired, things got worse. I swapped them for Kendos (173) and it was like night and day...I had control, the skis did what I asked and they're firmly on the shortlist.
It seems a bit bizarre that I've found two supposedly burly chargers so different. I don't usually ski really fast, and I'm not the strongest, so I wasn't surprised that the brahmas were too much. But the Kendos were a surprise. Any ideas why?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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My guess....I'm around 64kg and when I skied on Blizzard Quattros, I found them very stable and a bit planky. Maybe the Volkls are more reactive than the Brahmas.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Old Fartbag, you could be right. I didn't like Head iSupershape somethings a couple of years ago, found them too planky. Also didn't like Scott The Ski, but love Kneissl red stars. I'm just weird?!
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mgrolf wrote: |
@Old Fartbag, you could be right. I didn't like Head iSupershape somethings a couple of years ago, found them too planky. Also didn't like Scott The Ski, but love Kneissl red stars. I'm just weird?! |
I like both the Heads and the Scotts...and I'm only guessing with your question.
Some skis just "click" with the way that you ski (especially if you are light)...which is why testing is such a good idea.
I used to ski on Volkls many years ago...and they had a way of being stable, yet lively.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I love my Brahmas. Mine are the 16/17 version and the 17/18 season version is stiffer with more side cut. I tested them at the octobertest and have to say I prefer the older one.
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Ha! This is interesting, as @mgrolf will know, I think his Soulriders used to be mine till about 3 seasons ago! I loved them. Since I replaced them I’ve had some serious ski tuition, so I’m definitely a more technically competent skier now.
This season, I have a new pair of 16/17 Brahmas in 173 and I think they are my best skis yet! I’d tested them a few times on ski testing trips but couldn’t justify a purchase. Despite their behind sold as ”men’s” skis (), I am a middle aged female skier, 62kgs, 5ft 5, and probably and 8/9 on the inside out scale. I love their stiffness and the way they absolutely hold an edge, so I get to go fast.... . I think as others say, they just suit me. I even prefer them everyday to the full on piste skis (Rossi pursuit 700) that Father Christmas bought me.
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Perty wrote: |
probably an 8/9 on the inside out scale. I love their stiffness and the way they absolutely hold an edge, so I get to go fast. |
This is part of it, I think. I'm less technically competent, and I prefer to pick a careful line down a challenging slope. I rarely hit the afterburners, and usually I scare myself when I do so I slow down again. The only time I felt the brahmas work was when I was going fast (for me).
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@mgrolf, The new ones felt that way to me. The older version will charge if you want it to but is forgiving if you relax and take it easy. The 17/18 felt like I had less margin for error.
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I have a pair of Kendos. They ski much narrower than they look when on piste and much wider than they look when off piste. They are a really great ski and the only thing lacking is my ability to fully exploit them.
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@mgrolf, at 65kgs you're way too light to get the best out of the Brahmas. Even at the shorter 173 length the Brahmas will ski stiffer and less precise because you are too light to "drive" them.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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That bears out my experience, I rented 17/18 Brahmas and struggled ... too full on, then swapped to 16/17 Brahmas which I got on with. My conclusion was that Brahmas set the benchmark of being too stiff for me ... I am now thinking Nordica Navigator 85s or 90s or Salomon XDR 88s
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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The construction of the current/new 17/18 Brahma is unchanged from the previous couple of years (since they added the carbon tip'n'tail) meaning that the flex is unchanged too.
The difference between the 17/18 and the previous versions are a slightly flatter nose shape, a whisker more camber, a slightly shorter/lower tip rocker profile (which is hard to spot) and the reduction in radius from 19m to 17m (180cm length).
I don't know whether the sidecut reduction makes the ski feel more aggressive to some but the new version is definately not stiffer. It's basically just the same ski but it's now has just a bit more hard snow emphasis.
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@skimastaaah, that's pretty much what I was expecting, but you never know till you try. I was surprised by the kendo, as I thought it was pretty much as stiff.
@DavidYacht, I set out looking for the Navigator but none of the shops here had Nordica skis so I'll have to look elsewhere.
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You know it makes sense.
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Quote: |
The construction of the current/new 17/18 Brahma is unchanged from the previous couple of years (since they added the carbon tip'n'tail) meaning that the flex is unchanged too.
The difference between the 17/18 and the previous versions are a slightly flatter nose shape, a whisker more camber, a slightly shorter/lower tip rocker profile (which is hard to spot) and the reduction in radius from 19m to 17m (180cm length).
I don't know whether the sidecut reduction makes the ski feel more aggressive to some but the new version is definately not stiffer. It's basically just the same ski but it's now has just a bit more hard snow emphasis.
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Without doubt there was a noticeable difference, and the change was on the advice of the ski technician at the hire shop (Freeski in Meribel).
I should point out that I don’t blame the ski, it is more of a reflection of my own inabilities, I am not overly heavy and I am probably too far back on my skis.
Having looked at the Blizzard Ski catalogue, I note that they do a range of Brahmas in a hire spec, and I wonder if there is any difference in stiffness compared with the retail versions.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I'm about 90kg in ski gear and having skied Brahma's twice (2 weeks total) found them to be excellent. I would guess I'm about the right weight to extract the best from them though.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@mgrolf, you need to assert your authority!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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mgrolf wrote: |
It seems a bit bizarre that I've found two supposedly burly chargers so different. I don't usually ski really fast, and I'm not the strongest, so I wasn't surprised that the brahmas were too much. But the Kendos were a surprise. Any ideas why? |
It might have been the bindings (different delta angles).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@DB, both were marker demos.
@Grandma Sunshine, maybe. Or perhaps I'm just not good enough!
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I organise the PROSKILAB ski reviews and have tested both. These two skis are among the very best you can find in this "narrow" all-mountain segment that we call "all mountain 70/30" in France, "All-mountain front" or "All-mountain east" in the US. I would add the Stormrider 88 by Stöckli, maybe slightly more versatile, but also more expensive.
The Kendo is slightly stiffer and have a larger turn radius than the Brahma. All three are excellent skis, efficient on-piste and quite able in off-piste.
Hervé
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I thought the Kendo was stiffer than the Brahma but then reading up it looks like I mixed the Kendo up with the Katana.
As far as I can see the Kendo has one sheet of metal while the Brahma has 2.5 making the Brahma much stiffer.
With only 65 kg a stiff ski will be hard work and will wear you out.
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Kendo and Brahma were compared in the PROSKILAB 2017 ski reviews. That means that they were tested by the same (professional) testers in the same snow conditions... Kendo was described as a stiffer and more performance oriented model.
I tested both skis at this time and fully agree. I retested the 2019 Kendo one month ago. I haven't retested the Brahma but have nor heard of any change.
Nothing to do with the Katana which is a much larger ski, and from what I heard, indeed very stiff.
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@proskilab,
How many sheets of metal does the Kendo have and have they made it stiffer recently by changing the construction? (e.g. adding a metal layer)
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As ski reviewers, we are very careful not to take into account construction or marketing data from brands. Metal layers may make the difference... or not, depending on many factors. In fact we do not want to know how many layers of metal a ski has.
We solely evaluate skis based on their behavior on the snow and do not want testers to be influenced by marketing speeches.
I didn't see any noticeable difference in the 2019 Kendo, but the real test in march will give us some more information.
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@proskilab out of interest have you ever tested the Nordica Navigator 85 or 90, the Salomon XDR 88 or the Brahma CA; all of these skis have had good reviews over the pond, as slightly less stiff 85 to 90 all mountain carvers, but do not appear in the Proskilab reviews.
Is this because the manufacturers don’t want to play?
Also, there is much emphasis on professional reviewers, so how do they relate to mere mortals?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@DB, Sadly the ski reviewer is lacking in real-skier-insight with the Brahma. Shoot him!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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DB wrote: |
Opinion seems to be mixed on which are the stiffer skis. |
Which brings us right back to the original premise...and I'm still no clearer on whether or not I should be surprised that I liked one but not the other. Only 1 solution, more testing
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You know it makes sense.
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@mgrolf, we tested various skis at the start of last season all with similar geometries.
Very surprising the differences (all on Marker Squires I think so no delta issues).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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[quote="mgrolf"]
DB wrote: |
Opinion seems to be mixed on which are the stiffer skis. |
YIKES>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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Poster: A snowHead
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The one thing no one has mentioned here is weight. Jeez, my Kendos weigh a ton!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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bar shaker wrote: |
The one thing no one has mentioned here is weight. Jeez, my Kendos weigh a ton!! |
My 17/18 180cm Brahmas are 1991g & 2007g so pretty much bang on 2kg average. I've just mounted a new pair 17/18 177cm Kendos in my shop and they averaged out at 1930g so length for length they're nigh on identical.
I've skied both 17/18 skis back to back and, apart from the sidecut, they feel very similar to me and any differences in flex is probably more to do with the snow conditions than anything else.
For a prospective buyer I'd say the choice between is really down to sidecut preference (17m for the Brahma & 21m for the Kendo).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Following this thread avidly!
I’m 6’3 95kg have 2010 volkl mantras 184cm and looking now to replace-Love the mantras even in bumps they are just a bit difficult on hard pack/shorter turns. Looking at the brahmas just a bit concerned that I will miss my mantras off piste/ chalky bumps Are the Brahmas the right replacement ? Or do I buy new mantras?
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mgrolf wrote: |
DB wrote: |
Opinion seems to be mixed on which are the stiffer skis. |
Which brings us right back to the original premise...and I'm still no clearer on whether or not I should be surprised that I liked one but not the other. Only 1 solution, more testing |
Was it a recent model Kendo? - older reviews talk about one sheet of metal, newer reviews of 2 sheets.
Maybe the binding was mounted further back - I have an old pair of skis with a binding that can be moved forward for piste skiing and back for offpiste.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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retsil wrote: |
Following this thread avidly!
I’m 6’3 95kg have 2010 volkl mantras 184cm and looking now to replace-Love the mantras even in bumps they are just a bit difficult on hard pack/shorter turns. Looking at the brahmas just a bit concerned that I will miss my mantras off piste/ chalky bumps Are the Brahmas the right replacement ? Or do I buy new mantras? |
The Mantra equivalent from Blizzard is the Bonafide at 98mm underfoot, not the 88mm Brahma.
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As @spyderjon, says.
Next year’s Mantra M5 getting marmite review. Sounds a little easier, softer, but needing of a testing...
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DB, sorry should have been clearer. Thinking may go narrower for next set for the on piste performance . Would prefer to be off piste all the time but inevitably 50/50. Find the Mantras generally great but most limited on hardpack and varying turn shape in these conditions is an effort. Hoping brahmas/ kendos may suit in this respect but wondering how comparable in bumps, crud, chopped up powder etc. I suppose really need to try them !
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I m thinking of upgrading from AC80's to the kendo too,
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@retsil, you just need to edge/work the Mantras more on hardpack. And keep the edges sharp.
Why do you need to replace them? Our 2010s did ~300 days...
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