Ski Club 2.0 Home
Snow Reports
FAQFAQ

Mail for help.Help!!

Log in to snowHeads to make it MUCH better! Registration's totally free, of course, and makes snowHeads easier to use and to understand, gives better searching, filtering etc. as well as access to 'members only' forums, discounts and deals that U don't even know exist as a 'guest' user. (btw. 50,000+ snowHeads already know all this, making snowHeads the biggest, most active community of snow-heads in the UK, so you'll be in good company)..... When you register, you get our free weekly(-ish) snow report by email. It's rather good and not made up by tourist offices (or people that love the tourist office and want to marry it either)... We don't share your email address with anyone and we never send out any of those cheesy 'message from our partners' emails either. Anyway, snowHeads really is MUCH better when you're logged in - not least because you get to post your own messages complaining about things that annoy you like perhaps this banner which, incidentally, disappears when you log in :-)
Username:-
 Password:
Remember me:
durr, I forgot...
Or: Register
(to be a proper snow-head, all official-like!)

Serviced skis feel different /trying to kill me

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hey snowheads, I'm a newbie here, and have a newbie prob Sad

Looking for a trusted ski technician in Formigal/Panticosa area, or a suggestion how to deal with freshly 'serviced' skis.

I'm having the poopiest day in 7 seasons of skiing as a 30+yo adult - wracking my head why I had a really shitty run, read a lot of forum posts, and realize I've been rather ignorant re: what to do and not with my own equipment. Amazing that I have managed not kill myself thus far.

Last night, like a true ignoranus, and blindly following advice to make best of one sunny day with packed and icy snow, I agreed to have my skis taken to be 'sharpened' at Intersport. On return had been told they were also waxed. At that point I'm thinking (in my head, not out loud) ok, that must be a good thing - they probably decided it was needed, you're (the 'advice-giver) and these guys are pros....

First run downhill today after the service, and I feel like overnight I either lost skill, or the skis are trying to kill me - they're slippery and wobbly, especially the tails in turns. Rght ski more than left, which caught me off guard because that's my stronger leg. They also feel like skates in parallel position, which was scary.

I know the resort well, this was the warm up I do every day, so pretty sure it wasn't my technique set back few years.

The skis are 1 yr old, barely used (had 7 half days on smooth blues and cautious skiing on reds, with grace and no injury) Dynastar Glory 74 (sidecuts 118-74-99 radius 12m).

Have 1,5 days of hol left and if possible I'd prefer to salvage my own skis (and learn) instead of renting.
(I rented from various places here 5 yrs/hols (formigal) and never came across a tech which was helpful - sometimes the ppl were so lazy they set different din in both skis rolling eyes )

ANY tips on what I should check / look for / change would be very welcome.
Also, if anyone knows a trusted specialist in or near Madrid, that would be super useful too.


Thank you in advance!
ski holidays
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
A "Wax and edge" is the standard basic service....it should be done in my opinion every 7-10 days on the hill depending on conditions, light fluffy power = less servicing, hard pack ice = more servicing.

If you look at the bottom of the skis they should be smooth and clean like a black worktop and nice and shiny. as the skis get used the bases will become dull and turn a bit of a dark grey colour, this is because they are drying out. A dry ski will not slide aswell as a freshly waxed ski.

as for edges they should be clean and free from any small dents and if you run the top of your fingernail across the ski it should shave a tiny amount of nail off.

if sounds to me that you have either not been used to freshly waxed skis .....or if the ski is picking up very quickly at the start of the turn and throwing your out at the end the tip and tails have not been "dulled" down. This is the process of after sharpening the edges you actually blunt the tip and tail to make the turn initiation more steady and gradual.
snow report
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@enduroaid, “dulling” edges is no longer typical.

Could be however that they’ve left a hanging burr or otherwise fecked up.

Freshly serviced skis should just feel fresher and nicer.

Not waxing the skis is a bit like not pressing a dry cleaned suit.
ski holidays
 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
@AGest, I had my skis serviced by a local shop here and ended up with a similar situation to yours. In effect the skis were constantly catching an edge and were barely skiable. Dulling the edges at the tips helped somewhat, but in the end I took them to the guy that services the Starnberg ski club. Much tutting, raising of eyebrows and sighing later he told me that the skis had had the base scraped wrongly, so they were essentially no longer plane with the edges. He fixed it and all is now good again. My advice, go to someone who knows how to service a ski!
ski holidays
 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Check to see if the bases are flat, or have become concave or convex.
latest report
 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
@AGest, Welcome to SnowHeads snowHead

I suggest you go back to service shop,and explain the issue. If they are any good they will resolve to it for free. As others have mentioned, they service hundreds of pairs a week, and are bound to make the occasional mistake due to human error.

I hand the very same experience years ago, where my Sister and I found ourselves unable to ski on the first day due to the skis (serviced in the UK). A quick trip to local shop quickly sorted the edges and we could ski again.
ski holidays
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Sounds like they may have fecked up the base angle i.e. perhaps made the edges completely parallel to the base rather than at a very slight angle away from it. Typically the base angle should be 0.5 to 1 deg, so you have to tip the ski slightly before the edges start to bite. If there is no base angle the edges can bite with the ski totally flat and feel very nervous and over-sensitive - more or less as you describe. Maybe the base angle is inconsistent along the edge too.

I would go back to the shop and ask what base and side edge angles they have tuned them to. 1 deg on both is a good start for general use. The higher you go on the side edge, the sharper they become but also more prone to damage. The higher you go on the base edge, the more you need to tip the ski to get the edges to bite. For example racers may have 0.5 deg or less on the base and 4+ deg on the side edge for a razor sharp setup that bites instantly.

As mentioned, no real need to de-tune tips and tails on modern piste skis. The typical slight rise on tips and tails prevents them from grabbing too much anyway. I just keep my edges sharp along the full edge and don't have any issues.
snow report
 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I puzzled for years as a beginning skier (still am some would say Toofy Grin ) as to why a new pair of skis would frequently feel different (i.e. not as good) after their first "edge and wax" service. I came to the conclusion that it was most probably a change of edge, or possibly base, angle. Now I do my own.
latest report
 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
In some snow conditions a freshly waxed ski can feel dramatically quicker than a ski that's not been waxed for weeks. That can be disconcerting but if the skis are in good condition then you soon get used to the different performance. A hanging burr on a ski can really ruin the performance - the ski keeps gripping when you don't want or expect it to. Worth swapping the skis over and seeing if the problem changes side. Also worth taking a paper tissue or bit of kitchen roll and gently dragging it along the edges. If it snags then there are burrs and they could easily be removed with a quick rub with a gummi stone.
ski holidays
 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
This has happened to me a couple of times with shop tunes and hire skis and I suspect it is more or less what @uktrailmonster, describes ie the service has removed the base edge bevel to some extent. This has been discussed a few times on snowheads and I think the spyderjon provides a good description of the issue if you do a forum search you should be able to find it.
latest report
 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
A hanging burr is also very likely on a machine tuned ski if the tech can't be bothered to run a stone over it afterwards. As with too little base angle, hanging burrs can make the ski very grabby and inconsistent. Packed icy snow is probably the worst condition for a badly tuned ski too. In softer snow you might not notice much difference.
snow conditions
 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
A couple of weeks ago, I hired a pair of skis for a test that felt the same. I put it down to a lack of base bevel and skied back to the shop to return them. I was pleased to get back on my own skis.
ski holidays
 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
As @rob@rar says you need to check whether the bases are acceptably flat. Concave skis will want to run straight and not turn. Convex skis will feel loose underfoot and will not want to find the edge/initiate turns cleanly. Either is a pain to ski.

Have a look at the photos in the second post on this thread: https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/255457-Convex-bases .

Other culprits could be too much bevel on the base edge or failure to remove a hanging burr. The former will make the ski feel like a convex base and the latter will make the ski feel grabby and unpredictable.

Without looking at the ski, it is hard to tell but from what you describe, base convexity or too much base bevel feels likely. Have a look yourself with something that has a straight edge while holding them up to the light. Then go to a different shop.
ski holidays
 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I have had this jittery feeling when I have waxed and edged my skis (I do my own) and simply skied through it. I also get the same feeling on my ice skates when I first get on the ice and I am both an experienced skier and skater. In my case I think it is purely getting used to how my skis and skates behave.
ski holidays
 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Probably a hanging burr, an over bevelled base edge and/or excessively dull tips/tails.

If you only had them edged and waxed, then the problem shouldn’t be a lack of base bevel because the bases wouldn’t have been ground and there should have already been sufficient base bevel set, meaning that they skied nicely before.

Only the side edge should have been cut to the desired angle on the service that you’ve described. If the base edge angle is now more like two or three degrees (instead of about one) then they will lack bite and feel slow to engage into a turn.

If the tips and tails are completely blunt then this would also explain why they now ‘skate around’ and/or have a bit of a mind of their own. It’d also be useful if you could find out what angle they set the side edge to.
latest report
 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
enduroaid wrote:
If you look at the bottom of the skis they should be smooth and clean like a black worktop and nice and shiny.

The bases shouldn't be smooth or particularly shiny. They should have a visible structure of very fine grooves running parallel to the skis.

I find my skis a little "exciting" when just waxed, as they are very slidy. I quickly get used to them again.
snow conditions
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@sugarmoma666, running parallel? I think they should have a sort of rather complex hexagonal-ish structure to them...
snow report
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
crosshatch wrote:
Probably a hanging burr, an over bevelled base edge and/or excessively dull tips/tails.

If you only had them edged and waxed, then the problem shouldn’t be a lack of base bevel because the bases wouldn’t have been ground and there should have already been sufficient base bevel set, meaning that they skied nicely before.


Agreed. Re-reading the OPs comments, it does sound more like too much base bevel rather than too little.
snow report
 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
But a shop like Intersport would have put them through the machine - the bases probably would have been ground.


uktrailmonster wrote:
crosshatch wrote:
Probably a hanging burr, an over bevelled base edge and/or excessively dull tips/tails.

If you only had them edged and waxed, then the problem shouldn’t be a lack of base bevel because the bases wouldn’t have been ground and there should have already been sufficient base bevel set, meaning that they skied nicely before.


Agreed. Re-reading the OPs comments, it does sound more like too much base bevel rather than too little.
latest report
 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
You can often feel a hanging burr with the end of your fingernail. Also see if your edge scrapes a little spiral from the top of your nail from the bottom and from the side. They should feel the same.
snow report
 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
[quote="Kelskii"]But a shop like Intersport would have put them through the machine - the bases probably would have been ground.

If the skis were dropped in for an edge and wax, there’s no reason why the bases would have been ground. Even the most sophisticated automated machines are easily programmable to do the job required. Obviously it also depends who the operator was and whether or not they were hungover. Superb results are achievable on the machines of today; it is 2018 and not 1990, afterall.
latest report



Terms and conditions  Privacy Policy