 Poster: A snowHead
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So a few days into a week away I start to notice the base of my board drying out along the edges... And I just got to wondering - would occasional applications of rub-on wax in these areas prevent this? It'd not replace my pre-trip proper repair/wax/edge session, but if spending a few quid on a bar of the rub on stuff would help keep those edges of the base nicely lubed up, it seems like a good idea.
Thoughts anyone?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I like the Swix F4 Universal stuff, that you can apply....but I think that Fluoride is becoming increasingly frowned upon, due to being environmentally unfriendly.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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^I should've mentioned i already use notwax, i like the extra glide on the flats (particularly in spring snow) but my base edges still end up looking a bit dry half way through the week:)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Old Fartbag, That Swix F4 Universal stuff, there seems to be many versions - which one would you recommend? does it nicely extend the lifespan of a proper hot wax?
The stuff I've seen available cheap is datawax, regular wax that can be rubbed on as well as melted on. Seems like it might fare better than the liquid/paste stuff at extending the life of a hot wax in key high wear areas?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Old Fartbag, I'll have a peek at that stuff, ta.
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@jjams82, sounds to me like there's any issue with your pre-trip waxing if it's only last a few weeks when you're using Zardoz as well. Possible causes:
- wax not durable enough
- wax doesn't have a wide enough snow temp operating range
- too little absorption (not getting the base warm enough)
- too little absorption (base contaminated so hot scrape clean)
- too little absorption (over use of fluoro wax so hot scrape clean)
Other suggestions:
- use a base prep wax
- do additional wax cycle (s)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@spyderjon, They're some interesting thoughts... One thing I'm perhaps overcautious of is getting the base too warm which makes me wonder. I've already waxed ready for the birthday bash so i think I'll do it once more, warming the base a little more and see if it helps. I'm also using a new wax (previous was butta all temp, new is datawax universal HP) for these waxes so perhaps that'll make some difference?
Will give the above a try before anything else.
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@spyderjon, do you just apply the Notwax once the skis are waxed?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| sugarmoma666 wrote: |
| @spyderjon, do you just apply the Notwax once the skis are waxed? |
Zardoz can be used as a wax substitute but it's performance is pretty limited. It's far better as a wax enhancer.
I apply it on top of my wax after brushing (as I on all my customers skis) & I use it on spring days after lunch if there's been a big increase in temperature etc. For most Euro conditions a decent hydrocarbon wax with a wide snow temperature operating range (0 to -12C) will do the job, especially if you do 2/3 applications etc.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Following the links OFB posted, I found this site
http://swixschool.com/
Contains lots of Videos of ski preparation -- Using Swix products of course.....
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@sugarmoma666 it's just a 'top up' really, it's not a substitute for wax.
If you are on the mountain and notice that your skis are being a bit sticky (particularly spring skiing where the snow gets wet in the afternoon), a quick once over with the notwax can really help out.
The other great use for notwax is for people who use rental skis, as obviously doing a proper hot wax treatment to rental skis is less practical!
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You know it makes sense.
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So I re-waxed the board last night, getting the base warmer than I previously have. On the thin tip and tail sections I could feel very slight warmth on the opposite (top) side of the board, and once the wax had hardened enough to touch could feel some warmth remaining on the base. I know it's a very vague description, but does this sound like it's in the ballpark as far as warming the base for wax absorption goes?
@spyderjon, while the rest of your post is all very clear in my mind, I couldn't help wondering about "over use of fluoro wax" causing reduced absorption of wax.
While this probably isn't the case with the board I'm currently messing with (only one week of use so far) I experience the same premature dry base edges with my other much older board, so I'm keen to understand the concept a little better if you wouldn't mind giving me a (very) brief rundown on what it's all about?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@jjams82, Repeated use of flouro waxes actually dries out the bases. The chemistry/maths behind it is beyond my pay grade but my friends son finished his Chemistry PHd last year and ski wax was his dissertation subject when he did his Masters so he knows his stuff. He's also confirmed to me the accuracy of the technical/educational papers published on the Dominator Wax website.
Flourocarbon content waxes are fine for racers as they regularly hot scrape clean as they want a clean/clear base to prep for the likely conditions of their next race so they avoid the drying element but most recreational waxers never hot scrape clean. A high quality hydrocarbon wax is deared to make than a cheap hydrocarbon with a low grade flouro additive, which is what most flouro waxes are. The average consumer thinks that if it's got "flouro" on the label its got to be good, which is often not the case. When you're waxing for unknown conditions (as most UK skiers/riders do) then the snow temperature operating range is the key but most brands don't quote it. If you can find the spec sheet of the universal wax (which is a hydrocarbon with a flouro additive) offered by a very well known brand (it's buried deep in their website) you'll see that it's from -5 to -8C which is not that universal!
The other issue with flourocarbon is the health aspect. If you burn a hydrocarbon wax (ie a smoking iron base) then the fumes have a minimal adverse effect on your lungs and even extensive exposure is corrected by a good walk in the fresh air. If hyrocarbon wax is not burning (no smoke) then there's effectively no vapour issue. However flourocarbons are nasty things and give off an invisible, odourless and harmful fume before they burn/smoke, so you don't know it's there. Home waxing does not come under any H&S regs as it's really just occasional use and the retail packaging doesn't have to carry any warnings but those doing a lot of waxing (like in a shop) should be aware of the issues, as should their employer. My shop does over 750 services a season and all the waxing is done by hand with an iron and I only use a quality hydrocarbon wax and the ventilation is good. And if I do use specialist flouro waxes (by request) then I wear a commercial grade respirator that has a class 2 rating for both particles and vapour.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| jjams82 wrote: |
| So I re-waxed the board last night, getting the base warmer than I previously have. On the thin tip and tail sections I could feel very slight warmth on the opposite (top) side of the board, and once the wax had hardened enough to touch could feel some warmth remaining on the base....... |
That doesn't sound warm enough to me. You want the underside (ie the top sheet) to be warm but not hot. The problem with a board is that it's so big that if you try and get it all warm at once you'll likely overheat some areas so you should iron in the wax in sections. When I'm waxing a board this is my procdeure:
- brass brush tip to tail to clean out the structure
- crayon on the wax, again tip to tail
- using the iron apply sufficient 'drips' to the complete base
- then I iron it in in sections, usually quarters/fifths of the length at a time, regularly checking the temperature by touching the top sheet.
Note that's important that the binding screws are removed to avoid any air expansion in the void which can easiliy bubble the base - I seen people do that a few times.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@spyderjon, Excellent pair of replies there, completely removing all doubt from my mind. I'll rewax it before the next trip, following your procedure.
Many thanks!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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And to remove the last possible variable (wax of unknown quality), you've got an order for some dominator zoom universal with my name on it. Thanks again:)
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