 Poster: A snowHead
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Having this dilemma for the EOSB, either 79 or 98mm. Took the 79mm option for a slushy March trip and were good, especially with the morning hardpack so might go for those again. Also can use an equipment related excuse for the off piste lessons should things go awry that way!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Width isn't anywhere near important as is Feng Shui regardless the ski................ Make certain that whatever ski you take the intrivated articular novimborn helix joint within both mesial and distal regions of the binding surpflufaxial joint are in full operation mode and properly lubricated with either a lithium or aluminum based grease and are under <5% for a NGLI #2 Water Washout Supplex Grade when using ASTM D-1264 test.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I have nearly 5" but some girls don't like it that wide.  (Volkl BMT 122s, a bit emotional on ice) My choice is very limited as some rascal stole my ski tool box which had my Dynafit Zzeus alpine sole plates in it so i'm stuck with tour bindings for now. So its the BMTs or some ratty old Rossi S80s for me. Not much of a choice.
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trouble is your average once a week holiday skiers get on their fat skis "surf the bases", lean back, straight line the slush and cause considerable danger to other snow users....granted you know how to use them
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^^^^^THIS is the big issue....Could diehard fat ski-skiers actually ski anything narrower off piste  |
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| arcsinice wrote: |
| Width isn't anywhere near important as is Feng Shui regardless the ski................ Make certain that whatever ski you take the intrivated articular novimborn helix joint within both mesial and distal regions of the binding surpflufaxial joint are in full operation mode and properly lubricated with either a lithium or aluminum based grease and are under <5% for a NGLI #2 Water Washout Supplex Grade when using ASTM D-1264 test. |
I'm glad someone has nailed the thread with this pithy bit of truth.
I always wondered how I always seem to manage just fine with the pair of skis I have, whatever the conditions. It's by paying attention to these wise words.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| mountainaddict wrote: |
| Quote: |
| trouble is your average once a week holiday skiers get on their fat skis "surf the bases", lean back, straight line the slush and cause considerable danger to other snow users....granted you know how to use them |
^^^^^THIS is the big issue....Could diehard fat ski-skiers actually ski anything narrower off piste |
Um, yes. It's not rocket science; it's just less fun and requires more precision (i.e. less 'free').
^^ BTW surf the bases doesn't mean keeping skis flat, it means using the base instead of the edge when skis are tipped over in soft snow, like a boat in water. A thoroughly enjoyable sensation you just don't get without a certain amount of width.
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It's funny - the number of people who talk a good game about good skiers using skinny skis in (soft) off piste conditions is almost inversely proportional to the number of actual good skiers using skinny skis in same conditions. One might think that those who believe in the 80 is plenty mantra don't actually ski off piste that much.
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Mike Pow in Japan uses skinny skis , also Scott & Rob from inside out regularly use them
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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After a recent experiment in Zermatt, I am happy to confirm that 98mm is too much width for a comfortable ski on the refrozen piste, not terrifying but not a wholly rounded and controlled skiing experience before 10.30/11.00 am.
Will be going to back to my Head SL's and alpine boots for the late season slushfests in future
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| Quote: |
It's funny - the number of people who talk a good game about good skiers using skinny skis in (soft) off piste conditions is almost inversely proportional to the number of actual good skiers using skinny skis in same conditions. One might think that those who believe in the 80 is plenty mantra don't actually ski off piste that much.
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I think round here you could count the talkers on one hand, and I know myself I ski off piste relatively frequently, and on skinny skis. Although not h.p. as much nor as radically as I would like.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| snowxxx wrote: |
| Mike Pow in Japan uses skinny skis , also Scott & Rob from inside out regularly use them |
My advice is to try and be on the most appropriate pair of skis for the conditions you are skiing, for the largest proportion of time. The more "niche" a ski gets (e.g., very stiff & narrow race ski; very wide with funky geometry; etc) the narrower the window of "appropriateness". So be honest with yourself about the skiing you will actually do and choose a ski that is most suitable for as much of the time as possible. I'm not anti-fat ski, perhaps proven by owning four pairs that are wider than 100mm underfoot, topping out at 118mm.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| try and be on the most appropriate pair of skis for the conditions you are skiing, for the largest proportion of time |
. This, and I'd add "to your ability'.
The knee jerk reaction of many on this board is to engage in a p!ssing contest about how wide their skis are, irrespective of the question being asked. Some people might be able to get a carve on frozen pistes on 90+ skis, but not very many and far fewer, I would wager, than those claiming to on here. There were very few massive fat skis on the hill last week in St Anton, somewhere that specialises in very good skier on very fat skis. That's because the conditions didn't suite, and properly good skiers tend to use skis appropriate to the conditions and aren't bothered about a hairy chest competition in the lift queue.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| snowxxx wrote: |
| Mike Pow in Japan uses skinny skis , also Scott & Rob from inside out regularly use them |
My advice is to try and be on the most appropriate pair of skis for the conditions you are skiing, for the largest proportion of time. The more "niche" a ski gets (e.g., very stiff & narrow race ski; very wide with funky geometry; etc) the narrower the window of "appropriateness". So be honest with yourself about the skiing you will actually do and choose a ski that is most suitable for as much of the time as possible. I'm not anti-fat ski, perhaps proven by owning four pairs that are wider than 100mm underfoot, topping out at 118mm. |
rob speaks the truth, alternately just deal with the "ski what you brung" decision rather than agonise about it. i have on rare occasion left a second pair of skis locked to a rack and gone out on e.g, SL skis in the morning but the reality is that even for me that's a lot of faff. I did once go back to the appt and swap skis for a snowboard because breakable crust really wasn't a lot of fun on the former but that's kinda at the extreme. I could alternately have decided to stick to pistes or whatever.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Dr John wrote: |
The knee jerk reaction of many on this board is to engage in a p!ssing contest about how wide their skis are, irrespective of the question being asked? |
Was the question asked not this one? "Snowheads, if you could take one pair of skis on holiday to ski in April - what underfoot width would you choose for a typical mix of conditions"
So honest personal responses are answering the question. I've only had to do it once and I took Redeemers (after due consideration of the forecast including big powder day the beginning of the week and prospect of leftovers etc). I had a good time. On other occasions including early May weekends I've taken skis like Icelantic Shamans.
Fortunately I don't usually have to do it for my April trips. Frankly I don't give a rats ass about what the gnarly dudes in Jennewein think or what other people are on, I make my own decisions and I live with them.
Last edited by You know it makes sense. on Wed 5-04-17 13:25; edited 1 time in total
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Dr John, @Dave of the Marmottes, agree, and I tend to think that points to a "middle of the road" kind of ski which is a better compromise for the typically wider range of conditions you get at the end of the season when you are in spring temperatures and are looking to ski all of the day.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I've discovered that my Scott Lunas* love slush. All I need to do now is learn how to get them properly on their edges. Plenty of IOS clinics planned for the summer... 
*edit - all mountain rockered ski, 84 underfoot.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 5-04-17 13:39; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Dave of the Marmottes, Indeed. In my consideration is that I've booked on to the off-piste clinics again, so that's two days where fatter skis will be preferable. And for the rest of the time, I'm sure they will be fine.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Dr John wrote: |
The knee jerk reaction of many on this board is to engage in a p!ssing contest about how wide their skis are, irrespective of the question being asked. Some people might be able to get a carve on frozen pistes on 90+ skis, but not very many and far fewer, I would wager, than those claiming to on here. |
From what I see the knee jerk reaction is usually more along the lines of 'no that's too fat to use in Europe, if you were any good you could ski that on skinny skis too, blah blah.'
It would be pretty hard for you to win that wager* as no-one has said anything about carving re-frozen spring pistes first thing on fat skis (other than that you can avoid that particular misery by going out an hour later and skiing until later), and finding less than none tends to be difficult. 8:30-10am on a spring morning is far better spent having a leisurely kiss'n'cuddle in bed then a decent coffee than rattling your teeth out on rock-solid corduroy, even if you've brought your FIS slalom skis along.
*Edit - just double checked, not one single person has said anything good about carving fat skis on hard snow in this thread.
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Wed 5-04-17 13:45; edited 1 time in total
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Out of curiosity, why is carving on a fat ski harder than on a narrow one?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| martinm wrote: |
| Out of curiosity, why is carving on a fat ski harder than on a narrow one? |
Much slower from edge to edge, harder to manage the transition with precision, more difficult to manage the forces.
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@martinm, more ankle roll technique required to get them onto the edge, and to keep them there for the duration of the carve.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| I don't give a rats ass about what the gnarly dudes in Jennewein think or what other people are on, I make my own decisions and I live with them. |
That's because you are an incredibly good skier with many years of experience in all conditions on all types of planks, probably incredibly handsome to boot. Looks like the poster isn't (experienced that is) and that's why they were asking.
Regarding the language used, I took the view that the OP was asking what skis would you advise I use in variable spring freeze/thaw conditions. If that's the case then shouting FAT SKIS FAT SKIS FAT SKIS back at them isn't very useful.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| ... I think the stiction is not such an issue when skiing dynamically on a reasonable pitch. Running a flat cat track with flat bases probably stiction is more of a problem. |
Yes, agree, although I think you need to get above blue terrain before it becomes less of an issue.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Dr John wrote: |
Regarding the language used, I took the view that the OP was asking what skis would you advise I use in variable spring freeze/thaw conditions. If that's the case then shouting FAT SKIS FAT SKIS FAT SKIS back at them isn't very useful. |
Actually unless you're absolutely determined to ski the first hour of the day (which most people have caveated), I think it is pretty useful advice.
I just don't get the 'you must be super gnarly and really good skier' attitude about fat skis. There's nothing mysterious or scary about them: the whole point is to make skiing easier and more fun for more people. Yet from half the posts on here you'd think you have to live in a snow hole half way down an Alaskan spine (and probably have a big Viking beard) before you can use them. Why?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@rob@rar, I certainly found it a problem on blue slopes in Austria the other week, but managed to find the right amount of edge on said Lunas to cope.
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@clarky999, My Viking beard is rubbish.
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You know it makes sense.
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@Scarlet, but if you managed to grow it, at least it would be the right colour  .
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Scarlet wrote: |
| @clarky999, My Viking beard is rubbish. |
So's mine 
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Poster: A snowHead
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There's only one beard for skiing:
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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And one's more than enough.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Chamcham, but surely you need one beard for the morning freeze, and another for the afternoon slush? Or is there an all round beard that will be able to cope sufficiently with variable conditions?
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Depends on the width, shirley.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Dr John. Nah it was a general canvas of opinions and a bit of a thought experiment, the OP has already admitted he isn't actually restricted to a single ski and is likely to do with Cham 97 with some bigger guns in reserve should conditions permit
Which IMV is an excellent all round ski and unlikely to disappoint.
But beats the brick wall banging about Brexit at least with skis you can try for yourself whether the otherwise has any merits.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Dr John,
...and would that be a big fat one like Terry's or a long skinny one?
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@musher,
Long thin skinny ones,
Short fat juicy ones,
See them squiggle and squirm.
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@clarky999, one page back I alluded to the fact that many people that ski fat skis do so because their technique is so bad off piste it's the only way that they can manage to ski fresh etc
Super "gnarlys" (guides etc) can ski on anything and like I said, they seem to manage fine on 90's etc
Mind you this morning was interesting, weather looked grim so we decided against going up the hill, then at 10:30 sun came out and was nigh on wall to wall sunshine so we thought "why not".
There was quite a brisk cold NE'ly blowing with a keen wind chill (temp in the valley was +6), so even by 11:30 snow where you'd expect it to be well cooked was only just softening, not too good for us as we were planning to go off the back and do some slack country.
So we did a little hike hoping that another 45mins it would be just about right, and skied some three day old fresh on N Facing, then the grim weather returned (cloud) and we decided to abandon, then I had the joy of skiing (sliding) back down to resort on my 115's on the refrozen piste.
So might be April / Spring but before your week look at the long term weather forecast as best as you can before deciding what skis to take !!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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For a new/returning skier after 20 years of snowboarding...what is considered a "fat ski"?
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I managed fine on my Rossignol Soul 7s which are 106 underfoot, on a Freshtracks holiday last week skiing both on and of piste with a guide.
We were catching the lift at 9.30 and it was only really the first run down that was a bit tricky. Someone with local knowledge can quickly take you to the slopes that catch the sun first. We did have almost perfect spring snow conditions with clear skies first thing meaning that the snow softened very quickly.
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FAQ
