Poster: A snowHead
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@rungsp, do you know if Switzerland accept EHICs from citizens of EU member states or citizens of specific countries explicitly including the UK independent of EU member status?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Are injury clinics in Swiss resorts private or state-funded? EHIC won't cover you in a private clinic.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The Flying Snowplough wrote: |
@rungsp, do you know if Switzerland accept EHICs from citizens of EU member states or citizens of specific countries explicitly including the UK independent of EU member status? |
The EHIC is an EEA thing, and Switzerland is included for health care - http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/Healthcareabroad/countryguide/Pages/EEAcountries.aspx
as rob@rar suggests - the clinic in a ski resort may well be private so won't be covered by an EHIC whatever the country.
eg from personal experience the clinic in Arc 1950 is private and will want to see your insurance details or be paid upfront.
You need EHIC and insurance. The insurance company will expect you to have an EHIC and use it when applicable to keep down costs.
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@agw, I notice that Andora is not in the list of countries accepting EHIC
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@johnE, is it not included within the 'Spain' banner? Monaco, the Vatican and San Marino are explicitly stated as not being covered, but it doesn't mention Andorra.
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My experience in Switzerland was that I had to 1. Notify my insurer 2.pay everything up-front 3. Claim against the insurer and be reimbursed then 4. The insurer reclaimed costs based on my EHIC. So I learned a few lessons:
1. Understand that when an insurer says 'notify us immediately' this is literal. Ideally, someone in your group needs to 'phone them right away, even as you're being transported to the nearest treatment centre. This isn't always as easy as it sounds, since people are often fairly panicky and their priority is to get you treatment, of course. Plus they may not have your insurer details. So make sure everyone in your group has everyone's name and insurance contact details to hand, on piste.
2. If it's really serious, then you'll need to be helicoptered out. In some areas they'll check you have Carre Neige and if you don't they'll ask someone or you to provide a credit card payment. MediVac can cost upwards of £5-£10K. So always getting 'avec assurance' may be worth the extra £3/day to streamline this process.
3. In most cases you'll need to pay up-front and then claim back. I have skied with people who have been happy to leave their wallet behind because they were in a group or with their boyfriend etc. This is a very bad idea if there's any possibility of you getting separated. There is usually no process (for non-life-threatening situations) of waving an insurance policy and getting the medics to bill the insurer directly.
4. The EHIC Card is terrifically useful if you end up at a public hospital etc. as it has all the details they need to streamline your registration and treatment. Without it, you may have to fill out a very long form in a foreign language in circumstances where your main focus is on the person who is ill. The EHIC is effectively what keeps premiums down for European cover, as much of the treatment cost can be reclaimed by the insurer.
5. Some cheaper insurance doesn't include repatriation. If so, it's likely that there are conditions buried in the policy that limit the duration of expensive hospitalisation locally. The repatriation in more expensive cover is a mechanism for the insurer to get you back to the UK and end their liability, and the £10-£20K this costs is well worth it for them, and for you.
6. As ever, fine print. Some insurers won't pay for helicopter evacuation unless you're injured. Perversely, you might be in a near-death situation because you've got lost, with no possibility of extraction other than by helicopter. But this wouldn't be reimbursed unless someone was injured. Do read your policy details and think thorugh some common scenarios just so you really understand (a) what you need to do and (b) what is/isn't covered.
Finally, I'm always concerned when people I ski with say "I'm fine - my bank account / credit card / etc. covers me for travel.". I doubt that they have gone in depth into what is actually covered compared to a 'proper' policy. And when I say about their details they respond "Err, somewhere back at the hotel, probably in my luggage. I think."
As an aside - also think about summer in the mountains if you do this sort of holiday. If you're not covered for helicopter evac in the winter (or even if you are), what about an accident in the mountains on a summer holiday? I've seen as many summer helicopter evacs as I have winter, including walkers as well as mountain bike accidents. For £60/year I have family cover for unlimited helicopter evacuations both summer and winter in Switzerland.
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I can only talk in detail about EHIC in Verbier and associated hospitals.
I broke my leg skiing.
Piste Patrol rescue and helicopter was covered in an instant, they just looked at my lift-pass and said "Tres Bien, C'est suffit"
Nothing at all for me/us to do.
I was helicoptered to Sion hospital, I didn't have my EHIC card with me, my wife brought it in the next day.
Operation
Hospital stay etc. Some physio in hospital.
The day of discharge the hospital asked for chf64 which was the only amount I had to pay. They claimed everything else through EHIC and I had nothing to do with that.
Clinic in Verbier:
There are two main clinics.
One of which (The Doctors Popescu) take EHIC for everything and anything (broken leg...sore throat..prescriptions...the lot). This one is just uphill from Place Central going towards the main church. With EHIC you just pay 92chf flat fee for whatever is required, including prescriptions and follow up appointments.
The other one does not (near the big Migros).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@dp, MPI will cover you for 24 hours in a country adjacent to France.
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@SnoodlesMcFlude,
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is it not included within the 'Spain' banner?
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Andora is an independent Principality with two heads of state (Princes) : the President of France and the Bishop of some small Spanish town. It is not in the EU and thrives as far as I can see on on lots of cars trunddling up the pass to transfer fuel from one to the other paying little tax then trunndling down again
@rungsp, @msej449,Is mountain rescue free in Switzerland?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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johnE wrote: |
@rungsp, @msej449,Is mountain rescue free in Switzerland? |
No, I don't believe it is. I think you can buy a policy a bit like Carte/Carre Neige which is recognised by rescue services so not much paperwork required in the event you need their services.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@johnE, as Rob says, it is not free.
A small extra option available when you buy a lift pass.
If you need it, just show the lift pass...end of story.
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You know it makes sense.
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@rob@rar, @rungsp, I was thinking more about climbing during the summer rather than winter sports.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@johnE, I'd guess the same applies, as it does with Carte Neige (the annual policy, rather than the version you buy as a daily policy with your lift pass).
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Poster: A snowHead
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Just a gentle reminder that Carte Neige or daily variant does not cover accidents/medical emergencies after hours in town, so it is a useful top up but not a panacea. Last year a bud hurt herself and was repatriated to the UK on CN, but you are repatriated to the address registered, so I use my UK address. Also worth noting that CN has an alcohol clause equal to the French Drink Driving limit of 0.5, so more than a pint in the Foolish Douche and you are pushing it.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@snowglider,
Really good (if having a serious accident can be called good) experience with LV= last winter, my wife had a nasty accident which needed repatriation by air ambulance.
LV= organised everything very efficiently. The transfer by ambulance to Geneva airport, Air ambulance back to Exeter and then private ambulance to our local hospital was seamless. They paid the piste recovery, medical centre and hospital directly. The only expense I had to pay and reclaim was the ambulance transfer from medical centre in Les Gets to the hospital near Annemasse. The final claim was dealt with quickly and sympathetically and paid promptly.
Absolutely no hesitation in recommending them.
Only downside is their limit of 31 days winter sports.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Timc, does LV cover off piste without a guide?
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@holidayloverxx,
Don't know for sure, we don't, so it wasn't a concern for us. Sorry I can't be more helpful.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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rungsp wrote: |
The same will soon(ish) be true for the UK.
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But will it?
Theresa May doesn't seem that fussed about securing the UK a good deal. The main concern is in freeing parliament from European control, so that they can start fleecing the poor better / destroying the planet / gassing the disabled, etc etc etc. One of the arguments for leaving was bringing an end to European health tourism on the NHS, if we're actually going to deny treatment here to our neighbours I can't image they're going to welcome us in for treatment.
I don't want to go into politics too much but I don't think you can count on a preferable deal for the UK post-Brexit on any of the niceties we've got used to.
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rob@rar - Helicopter evacuation in Switzerland has to be paid for, through either (1) additional cover bought along with the skipass ("avec assurance?") (2) paid by you (and then your claim on your insurance) or (3) a local heli group insurance (like mine with Air-Glaciers in Sion). The most seamless is [1] as it's on your skipass, so even if you're alone and unconscious, it's clear you're covered. I only do [3] which is the same level of cover (and the same helicopters) because we also always spend time at our apartment in CH in the summer and hike the mountains there, so this gives the same level of cover in summer. A side benefit of [3] is that I can call them out even if I'm simply in a bad way/lost e.g. strayed way off-piste in the fog and then find I'm stranded somewhere really dangerous and there's no other way to get out.
At CHF 5/day for option [1] this seems a pretty small amount on the holiday cost to cover the potentially CHF 10'000 or more a heli evac would cost you.
@Timc - The LV= example shows the benefit of going with a company that does not outsource their claims handling. I moved my travel (and car) insurance to LV= after a hopeless experience with the AA Travel, who have a separate subsidiary/outsourced claims handling company that operates purely on profit i.e. targeted with handing out as little money as possible. A fairly simple claim after I had my passport stolen in Switzerland and had to go to Berne to get a temporary one took over 15 weeks to resolve and their liability was no more than a few hundred quid: heaven knows how much more hassle they'd have given me if it was an injury claim in the tens of thousands. I now would never insure with a company that outsources their claims handling.
Note that you won't get left on the snow as the helicopter flies away, simply because you didn't have cover. But you and your companions will be pressed for someone to provide some plastic. Other posts indicate that you'll get asked for about £2,000-£3,000 up-front, although this won't be the final cost. This is in recognition that many people won't have a lot of credit margin on their cards - but it does get them your card details to debit later. I'd speculate that since they have your lift pass details, and you'll almost certainly have paid for that by plastic, then they can track you down in the event that you steadfastly refused to provide any details.
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Thu 23-03-17 14:43; edited 5 times in total
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@LaForet, thanks, I guess that's a similar situation in France.
Is there an insurance policy which can be sold with Austrian lift passes that is recognised in a similar way to Carte Neige or the Swiss policy?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@snowglider, Can't comment on MPI's claims handling but their view on pre-existing medical conditions is very relaxed, basically if your condition and your medication hasn't changed in 12 months then they don't want to know about it plus they will cover more than 31 days winter sports. Maybe worth checking out again.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@Timc, +1 for MPI being relaxed about pre-existing conditions. They pushed my excess up a little, following a couple of tests I had and disclosed to them recently, but not the premium.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Cheers @Timc, might be worth a shot.
Not knowing what else to do, I tried yesterday to get some insurance quotes on a few comparison sites. Tried to declare my "pre existing conditions" - only I couldn't. Turns out none of the comparison sites' booking forms deems bone - fixing surgeries as a "pre existing" condition (only heart & gastric bypass surgeries, blood vessel corrective procedures and 1 more - I forgot which one).
So it does appear as if LV were undully strict - I know, I know, that's their prerogative.
But, equally, taking my business elsewhere is my prerogative, and that's exactly what is going to happen.
It was too late yesterday to call anyone else, but will give a call to MPI tomorrow and see what they say.
Thanks again for your input and help.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Fri 24-03-17 1:34; edited 1 time in total
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@Hurtle, nice to have that confirmed!
Thanks. I'll definitely give them a call tomorrow (well, technically today)
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You know it makes sense.
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I have "free" travel insurance with my Nationwide bank account. It is "free", but I pay for top ups, for winter sports and declared medical conditions. I have claimed on it a number of times. The claims service is excellent. As I ski in Switzerland, the medical claims have been small. The EHIC works very well with the public hospitals there.
It covers off-piste skiing, but only with a guide.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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snowglider wrote: |
Have just spoken to LV and requested a quote. Preferred to do it over the phone rather than on t'internet (as I have had a fair few injuries over the years) and wanted to make sure everything gets described (and taken down) correctly.
Well... their premium quote was £138, which I thought was reasonable, and was ready to take out a policy.
BUT.... it turns out they view an operation on my ankle (to pin & plate my tibia & fibula, done 11 years ago; no problems since), as "pre - existing medical condition". Ditto for the surgery to repair my dislocated shoulder (27 years ago).
So, with those two "pre - existing medical conditions" they quoted me £370!!!
My explanation that it was a long time ago and that I don't have a problem squatting 400lb for 10 reps fell on death ears.
"Sorry - the computer says NO", was their response.
*Sigh* So, back to square one...
Does anyone know of a half - decent insurance company that doesn't charge such exorbitant insurance rates for "pre - existing medical conditions"?
I feel like crying... |
Columbus direct don't charge a huge amount extra.
My wife has arthritis (with one knee replaced), diabetes type 2, high blood pressure and high cholesterol, and with all of those declared and accepted it bumped the premium for our trip to Mexico next week by about £40.
Not sure what their base prices are for a European ski trip though.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@alex_heney, I will never use Columbus again after a horrendous experience 6 years ago. I snapped my ACL in Val d'sere. Contacted Columbus because I had to change flights to allow a locked brace (plus my companion), and transport to Lyon airport. Columbus were completely useless, told me I had to sort everything out then claim back because, wait for it, they said they had no contact information in Val d'sere. This is the same Val d'Isere that is one of the top 3 global destinations for British skiers, with Columbus advertising as "the skiers insurers". It took a very helpful Mark Warner manager to speak to them and give them about 10 transfer company details (all freely available on the t'internet), before they reluctantly agreed to pay for the transfer, then I had the battle to get them to pay for the flight, which I eventually won. It should have been 1 phone call, but I was routed to a South African call centre, required several calls over 3 or 4 days, I didn't speak to the same person twice and they never returned calls when they promised to, they made what was already a very stressful situation even worse.
There is a very good reason they are cheap.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Dr John, thanks, that's helpful.
About to ring a few insurers for quotes so will report back.
Well, getting insured at a favourable price is one thing, but alas, should there - God forbid - be a need to make a claim, and an insurer making good on their promises, seems to be quite another.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@snowglider, it's the old probability/impact equation. You probably won't need it, but when you do need it and it's rubbish then the impact is far greater.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Dr John, that's the thing.
Was just thinking about what you must have gone through, when your insurer (whom you paid for this service), instead of helping you in a situation when you are in pain and feeling quite vulnerable, is obstructing you every step of the way.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@snowglider, spot on mate. It got to the point where, the day before we were due to leave, we didn't have flights or transfer sorted. We only knew we were good to go at 9.30pm the evening before departure. This was 4 days after my accident. Peace of mind is worth more to me than a £30 (or whatever) saving.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I use riskalliance.co.uk - the Mrs has a list of conditions that they have to deal with.
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@Dr John, couldn't agree more with you. I'm at that stage in my life to know that a bit extra to pay is well worth the peace of mind that the extra expenditure affords.
Still think that LV were out of order to ask for nearly a 200% increase for the injuries some of which are nearly 3 decades old and pose no problem whatsoever.
Well, they just lost my business...
Speaking of which, just took out a policy with MPI, and they were very easy to deal on the phone.
They just wanted to know if I'd had any medical condition which has worsened in the last year, or if there's been a change in any prescription I've been given (I haven't).
The total, with covering the excess on the policy + laptop insurance came to £165, which I think is reasonable.
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@snowglider, join the Tea Club and get their skier specific utterly comprehensive insurance (including FOGG medi-card) for £135.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@snowglider, I got the SCGB insurance this year, mainly because of the off-piste without a guide cover. I have bank account insurance with enhanced snow sports package so doubled up, but I'll drop that next year and have the SCGB cover only. Can't comment on previous years SCGB T&C's.
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