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Looking after your kids on the slopes...

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
So, this easter we're off to Les Arcs for our second 'proper' family ski trip. We've taken the babies/toddler's a few times before, and my wife and I are seasoned snowboarders. Now the are grown a bit and we have an 11 and 8 year old whom last year, progressed to red's. Meanwhile the 4 year old is looking forward to his second year in Piou Piou...

My question is, how do folks help to keep them safe on the slopes and not lose them? It's a minor risk, i believe and I'm pretty sure if they did get lost there are many friendly folks on piste who would help a lost child.

Our approach:

1. We have / are drilling them in piste etiquette. (downhill skier priority, look before you set off, be aware of who is around you, control speed etc.)
2. They always carry a piece of paper in their pocket with Chalet name/our names and phone numbers.
3. We have also drilled them to be aware where WE are on the slope, and if they lose sight of us, or get to a junction in the pistes they are to stop / wait and not move until one of us finds them.
4. Eldest will this year have an iphone with him (he's into secondary school next year, so in our family that is the qualification point for a mobile phone). Bizarrely our middle child is more aware, and i feel more relaxed him not having a phone
5. My wife and i will generally ride 'shotgun' - one in front / alongside the kids, one lagging behind to pick up fallers. Last year, i was behind. But this year I suspect the boys will be going faster and my wife will take the natural position behind.
6. For the next few years at least, we intend to return to Les Arcs where they can be more familiar with the runs/navigation and hence gain more freedom anyway.
7. We are going late Easter when it is somewhat quieter, and they are less likely to get hit by other skiers in the on-piste traffic.

This is not to suggest I want to wrap them in cotton wool - more that i want them to be safe, have as much freedom as possible, and continuing enjoyable experiences that will mean in future years when I am decrepit they will extend me the same courtesy and look after old Dad on the slopes...
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I don't have kids but if they stick to pistes can they really go wrong? they are all numbered, along with a piste map and a quick explanation i'm sure 8 & 11 year old's can work it out, worst case they go to a pisteur and call you or get directions if they were to get lost, you seem to have all the bases covered.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Why not get a cheap and cheerful mobile for your middle child to have on them just in case, and if someone else does lose their phone you have a spare. A basic non smart phone is around £20 or so they generally have good battery life so can be left on and secured in a pocket.
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We bought 4 binatone walkie-talkies for £100. The kids generally love them as a 'toy' but on ski trips they have been great. They put them in an inside pocket and the drill is that if we get separated everyone stops somewhere safe and we all jump on the walkie-talkies to figure out how to reconvene.

I've also used them on boys trips. Useful when away from mobile phone coverage.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
We generally give ours (10 and 8 this year) old smartphones. Three do a really good "unlimited" abroad PAYG SIM so it works out very cheap to have data. Then if we need to find them (or we're just curious where they are in their lessons) there's the Google Location app we can use. I also tend to leave SkiTracks running when they're in lessons so we can see afterwards what they were up to!

We have our phone numbers on their ski jackets too - written on in clothes marker pen.

And if we're out with them, we do what you do, although with the older one now she does have a little more freedom, but she is also responsible enough to stop at piste junctions and not mess around. It's why I was happy skiing with her, just the two of us, last year.

The youngest two (5 and 3) won't be straying much out the snow garden and certainly won't be doing anything spectacular with us, so aside from phone numbers in ski jackets, that's all!
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We also put her EHIC card and a copy of our travel insurance into our daughter's pocket (these days we use the sleeve pocket as there is never any reason to go into that one, once the ski pass is in there).
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Richie_S wrote:
in future years when I am decrepit they will extend me the same courtesy and look after old Dad on the slopes...

Don't you believe it - they will be forcing you to go over the Blue jumps in la Chapelle park, insisting you race them down the boarder-cross, calling you out when you jib out of the picnic table in the stash cos there's no snow and only ice on the landing, make chicken noises when you choose to keep your board in contact with the rainbow rather than clearing it from the up ramp, take the mini pipe in Avoriaz instead of the super-pipe or refuse do do tail presses all the way down coup du monde.

TBH when they were on skis it was harder than when they began boarding, the only other thing I would add is to tell them not to take the jumps that go back onto the piste.

About 4 years ago our youngest emerged on skis from the MTB jump on the left of PLJ over the heads of a class of kids which an instructor had lined up at the edge of the piste blissfully unaware that it was right under a jump. I have no idea how I would have handled him taking out one of that class head-high if his jump had been a bit lower.

Now I "let them" go on ahead, and hang well back if it looks like they are getting into any nonsense.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
We found the walkie talkie solution was no solution at all. either everyone was chattering on the same waveband, or the batteries were flat 'cos our kids had been chattering. Plus the coverage wasn't great.

We did exactly what you have planned, but tbh, it didn't always work. The problem arises when someone at the back falls or crashes, and the 2 at the front don't notice.

I would thoroughly commend the mobile phone with apps: (I use maprika) then all bases are covered.
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Good advice above. I also intend to point out the Resort and Ski School uniforms, so that my son approaches one of them for help is necessary.
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Nothing to add to the good advice above (though how did we manage when none of us had mobile phones? We had a plan......).

But the OP intrigued me with the statement that his wife's "natural place" is at the back. wink is she the strongest skier? In my view the strongest skier in a group should be back marker - I've several times had cause to be grateful for a competent hand behind me, especially off piste. But on piste too, it's no good if the sweeper is struggling to keep up!
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Quote:

We found the walkie talkie solution was no solution at all. either everyone was chattering on the same waveband, or the batteries were flat 'cos our kids had been chattering. Plus the coverage wasn't great.


Yep, understood - the ones we have used DCS to give subchannels, so we have literally never had anyone else on our wavelength. We made a rule that they are for emergencies only. If need be we actually have them turned off, only to be turned on in the event of a separation. We have had our youngest take a wrong turn twice in the last two weeks of skiing. As soon as he realised he was no longer with us he stopped, switched on the radio and we all got back together v quickly.

But cheap mobiles are a good option too, I just lovved the boys' toys element of the walkie talkie!

One more general thing to add though. We now make sure that every time we stop we repeat the name of both the next run and the next lift. Nobody is allowed to just drift along (except the wife, she is perennially lost on the mountain - "have we done this run before"..... "yes, everyday for the last three trips"...)
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
All this is why, if I had kids, I'd be stick them in ski school throughout so I can chill out and enjoy a holiday without worrying about them all the time Smile
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Quote:

We also put her EHIC card and a copy of our travel insurance into our daughter's pocket (these days we use the sleeve pocket as there is never any reason to go into that one, once the ski pass is in there).


Good idea!
Having lost one of mine in fog, toward the end of our first week of family skiing, I am in real fear of it happening again - particularly as VT can really suffer from low viz. I'm seriously thinking about taking a small LED back light from my bike and clipping it onto the back of my goggles strap if we get caught in thick fog again.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Not a bad idea @tomj, I wear high viz clothing, so I look like I'm off to repair a motorway, but it certainly helps my children and wife to spot me.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@tomj, I've seen a few skiers VT do this in poor viz. I'm not convinced how well it would really work in a whiteout, but its better that nothing I guess.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
We ski in a column kids "sandwiched" between us. This year in Norway we found a girl (about 10) snowboarder lying on the ground. We stopped to help and realized she was crying. Worse still she was clutching her wrist which looked to be very swollen. We couldn't speak each other's languages but we established though hand gestures that she was lost (parents nowhere to be seen) and she didn't have a phone. We helped her across to the (fortunately) nearby lift attendant. He leapt into action, putting her in a warm hut and getting on the radio to others. He was fantastic. Our advice to the kids is that if they get lost and can't get a signal on their mobiles, go to a lift attendant. I feel safe with them (rather than anyone skiing free in a uniform) as they are based in one place and have lots of people around watching what is going on. Other than that we don't do anything else. I'm so slow at the back I can spot what's going on ahead when one of ours falls over!!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
pieman666 wrote:
Not a bad idea @tomj, I wear high viz clothing, so I look like I'm off to repair a motorway, but it certainly helps my children and wife to spot me.


That's an excellent point! I can now justify the "can see from orbit" shade of pink jacket we've recently bought for our 8 year old! Given she's the one who tends to meander or lag behind, this is no bad thing.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Digger the dinosaur wrote:
All this is why, if I had kids, I'd be stick them in ski school throughout so I can chill out and enjoy a holiday without worrying about them all the time Smile


There speaks someone with no children. When you have children you always worry about them all the time. Very Happy

Wife and I usually do the lead and tail-end-charlie routine. It's usually better with me at the back as I'm the stronger skier and have got very good at dropping right in above/below a fallen kid, sometimes carrying shed skies.

Much more difficult though if it's only the one of us. In those situations it's usually easier to try to stay behind the kid/kids as if you get in front, inevitably they take a fall and you end up with skis off tamping back up the slope to sort them out.
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As others, we always gave them our phone numbers on card and told them to ask at lifts etc if lost to call us.

Rule they had to obey was stop at junctions

Not lost them yet - but they're old enough now not to worry (as much)
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Quote:

Our advice to the kids is that if they get lost and can't get a signal on their mobiles, go to a lift attendant.


Absolutely - when we lost one of ours in fog, she was picked up by lifties and taken into care by piste patrol. The whole system swing into action very smoothly, and I was back with her within a little over half an hour. Which is good, because I'm not sure I could have sustained that high heart rate for too much longer!

Quote:

When you have children you always worry about them all the time.

This +1

I like the idea of a bit of day-glow gear; if anyone sees a eye-watering shade* goretex shell for sale, is be interested.

*shade, not price. I know the price will be eye-watering!
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Tog24 has lots of particularly dayglo this year for a decent price - otherwise the only other place I've seen a lot of it is Spyder. Unless you get it in TK Maxx at the start of the season (last year's offerings).. well, yeah.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Our 8 year old son managed to lose my wife last saturday! On a nice clear and quiet green run! Shocked
He knows the mountain very well, and is a very strong skier, so not complete panic.
We have also told him to either go to predefined meeting spot, and/or find ski patrol/instructor/lifty and get them to call us. By the time I got to the patrol office he'd already done this and we could find him straight away - training worked (and he even listened despite showing no signs of doing so at the time) Smile
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Richie_S, lots of good advice already. On the walkie talkie issue, we always carry ours, pre-set to our sub channel. Only turn them on when needed. Useful many times, especially if mobile signal weak, unavailable, or battery drained.
Two low tech ideas. Carry a whistle, eg attached to jacket zip, not far from mouth. Especially handy if fallen off one of those nice green tracks into the forest below. Or up to chest in powder snow.
In bad vis, those cycle velcro arm bands, fluorescent with flashing LEDs, easy to see. Dead cool too. wink
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Lowjack the rugrats. See http://rcbeacon.com/blog/?page_id=338

NB Do not rely on the GPS Phone / text devices unless you KNOW you have good cell phone coveraged.
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Quote:

We have also drilled them to be aware where WE are on the slope, and if they lose sight of us, or get to a junction in the pistes they are to stop / wait and not move until one of us finds them.

We instructected our son to ski down to the first lift and wait there. Junctions are a bit tricky to notice but lifts are identifiable and if we still hadn't found him by the time the lifts close then at least the liftie will wonder why this small boy has been there all this time. It did happen when he was about 8 YO and we did locate him (eventually). I'll not mention any other stories, but he grew up fine.

In fact he learnt more about going to the shops on his own, going into restaurants on his own and ordering a meal (the Cairn in 1600) than he ever did at home. We all felt much safer in the ski resort.

@TQA, Les Arcs has good mobile coverage.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Yes, we've always had good mobile coverage wherever we've gone (Tignes, 3V, La Plagne and Les Arcs - so fairly major resorts) so it never occurred to me to use walkie talkies, although we have some we use for camping.

It might be another matter in a smaller or more obscure resort.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
My six year old always goes first on the slopes and I try and keep up. That way if he falls over, I can pick him up and get his skis back on. If I fall over or fail to keep up then he knows to stop and stand still and wait until I find him. By which point he is always crying and some kind adults are standing near him making sure he is ok. Then I always get dirty looks for being a bad parent and loosing my child, although I always know where he is, he just doesn't know where I am.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Having lost our then 6 year old for several hours many years ago (before much in the way of mobile phones and electronic lift passes) in Les Gets I can`t express how very scary it is, and we truly believed we had covered the possible issues! Your plans seem sensible but best to agree a meeting point rather than just a crossroads, hopefully a known place will be possible in a resort you know on runs you have previously skied. And make sure, really sure, your child has listened to what you have said!

Having met a family on a chalet holiday a couple of years ago who lost their 10/11 year old I can also tell you that the modern ''tracked lift' systems, certainly in Courchevel makes tracing a child very easy these days. That child was found and back with parents within an hour!
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@Richie_S, for those of you with the mobiles the Yuge app in Les Arcs is good for keeping track of each other. As well as a myriad other diversions.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
doddsie wrote:
My six year old always goes first on the slopes and I try and keep up. That way if he falls over, I can pick him up and get his skis back on. If I fall over or fail to keep up then he knows to stop and stand still and wait until I find him. By which point he is always crying and some kind adults are standing near him making sure he is ok. Then I always get dirty looks for being a bad parent and loosing my child, although I always know where he is, he just doesn't know where I am.


I've had that in shops and other places just in the UK, with my 7yr old.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
All good stuff. For me, the first post, plus the comment about telling them not to jump back on piste from the side. Which I did this week, even if I didn't do half the other stuff Embarassed Both now have helmet covers and I never even noticed the clear pocket so names and numbers will be going in there in future.

They already know our mobiles by heart (did that a couple of years ago, nothing to do with skiing). Wonder what people's experiences are of mobiles, with mine the batteries are a bit old so don't last long. Wife and I have talkies - comes from going regularly to Andorra where non-EU prices are eye-watering - and wondering now about buying another pair (slightly cheaper) so we all have them. But I know they don't work all the time either, if there is a solid object in the way. Will have a think over the next year.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
tomj wrote:
I like the idea of a bit of day-glow gear; if anyone sees a eye-watering shade* goretex shell for sale, is be interested.


Haven't got kids but partly for the benefit of skiing in a group I wear purple troosers and a bright green jacket. It's not unique but it's a fairly rare combo.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Ok, thanks for all the replies - i wasn't sure if this would've been discussed much before. Some comments:

1. Walkie Talkies - i should've stated, we have these too Embarassed but i thought they may be a bit 'passe' on here - i had them on lads trips before mobile charges were a reasonable price abroad. They are good for 'close quarter' comms, and where mobile reception is pants. I have an old Nokia 3310 or something ( 5 day battery life, ah, the good old days) with a PAYG SIM that may be stuck in the middle childs pocket. The iPhone of course benefits from GPS / Find my friends. I like the idea of starting Ski Tracks on them - last year, i'd ask the boys where they had gone in lessons, and got a shrug of the shoulders - it would be nice to know which runs they'd been challenged on, which would inform my afternoon excursions.

2. pam_w, my wife is indeed the slower boarder, and you may well be right. Tbh, hanging back, watching the kids get up to shenanigans and then blatting down the hill after them is good fun. The idea of a 'plan' - yes, I think we'll form the habit of talking it through specific to where we are - i.e we are HERE, we are going HERE, if you got lost STOP HERE. I try that on group trips with friends, but being is they are grown up 'blokes' they don't listen. The best chance of meeting up again is to state a Bar.

3. Kids are in ski-school in the mornings, but, and I speak for all parents i'm sure, having time on the slopes with them is epic.

4. LEDS lights... now that's an idea i'd not thought of. In poor vis, that would be good. Some of those little flashing LED bike lights that tie on would help to 'identify' your child. Similar approach with clothing, we have been known to dress the children in very similar 'bright' clothing when out in crowds as it helps identify them - as in, i don't know which child of mine that is, but i can see three of them, and that's good....

5. I like the recommendation of 'go to the nearest lift' - at least then, they are in 'civilisation'.

6. Mobile phone number in clothes - I'm almost ashamed to say, I've had 'name tags' made - the self adhesive type you stick to your children clothes for school - with our surname and my mobile on. They were cheap for 100 and i've found multiple good uses for them on cameras/other mobiles/Ipads/things we might lose/luggage etc.

Finally, I should state, whilst again, I don't wrap my kids in cotton wool - we DID lose one of them in Legoland Windsor for a mere 15 minutes a few years ago... it's not pleasant. So i'd quite like to avoid a repeat experience in an environment that may be more dangerous...
Very Happy
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we always ski one parent in front, then the two kids, then other parent brings up the rear, this helps in two ways, if one falls, the parent behind is there to pick up the child, the gloves, the skis, etc. The children follow the parent in front, so there is little confusion as to where to go, only once, where in Madonna there is a turn to go under a bridge, or go straight on to the next lift, did we lose the 8 year old. She skied to the next lift and waited, when i got there she had already told the lift controller she had lost her parents, and he was about to call us, but when we saw her miss the turn , I followed her.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
We all carry whistles and a laminated card with instructions on what to do if you are lost (stand still, keep your kit on and read the instructions on how to transmit a distress signal with the whistle). I have put this kit in all our jackets since an awful accident in Flaine a couple of years back when a child fell to his death after losing his bearings. My children have had it drilled into them to not move if they are lost, but refer to their instructions.


I haven't read all the posts in detail, but nobody seems to have mentioned the piste map. Everyone should have one unless they know the area intimately. Get your children to read and understand it before they start skiing the area. Get them to plan routes. If your children take an interest in where they are, they will be able to orientate themselves much more quickly. Whenever we start a run, we always agree where to meet if we get lost. Mine can do this aged 11 and 9 and they have been looking at the piste maps since they started skiing.

It's a person's awareness of their surroundings that is more important than their skiing ability (within reason) and for children making them aware that they need to look out for landmarks etc. is a better way of making them safe on the mountain than phones/walkie talkies (not that I'm saying don't use them).
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I remember that accident too. Chilling.

The instructions is a good idea. And I agree on teaching them to read the piste map. Just need to teach my wife too...
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
At half term in Saalbach-Hinterglemm for the 5th year with another family from our village, the two 10 year olds shot off ahead towards Leogang just after we'd announced a drinks stop at the next alm. At the midstation the run splits, and we couldnt see them on either run or in the lift queue. 10 seconds of minor panic was brought to an end when they shouted and waved from the terrace of the brolly bar next to the lift - coats off, table for 8 secured. Plus 20 points for being very sensible. Minus 5 points for not getting the drinks in... wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@ousekjarr, Very Happy
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Off topic, but I saw this on FB and thought of everyone on this thread!

http://youtube.com/v/s3GMCJbrMGA
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
I love this!
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