 Poster: A snowHead
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I've just been away with a friend who boards. He's been several times, owns his own boots and bindings but rents a board. He is struggling and not progressing. One trip it all goes well and the next he is blaming the board. When all goes well he gets pain in the outside of the leading shin.
My suggestion is to get lessons as I feel he is largely self taught and sort out his stance and his binding settings. Then to buy a suitable board.
Is this a good approach or is there a better way?
Any suggested UK instructors/shops preferably south of Birmingham?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Buying a board sounds the obvious progression and from there, your correct, he can fine tune his stance.
I've bought new and off ebay, as long as you ask questions and see good photos you can pick up a couple of seasons old board that's only had 2 or 3 weeks of use off ebay.
Otherwise there's The Snowboard Asylum at Tamworth or Boardwise half hour from the Snowdome (10mins from M6 J12), both just north of Birmingham but could be linked in with a session riding.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Forget buying a board and spend the money on lessons.
It doesn't matter what your on, if you can ride, you can ride.
Obviously if your a beginner riding a super stiff board will compromise your riding but at intermediate level you should be able to ride anything.
You said your friend has been away several times.....he is still a beginner and still learning. If he gets on anything and can't ride it, it's down to his skill level and not the equipment.
Get him to take some lessons.
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@tarrantd, Got a photo or video of him riding you'd be willing to show us? Sounds to me like he's definitely got some issues with his stance setup - only time I can recall getting pain/discomfort in the area you're suggesting was when I was playing around with a wider stance and had gone too wide so it was causing my legs to bow out and put pressure on my shin, but that's really just guesswork without seeing him ride.
As the others suggest, get him down to Tamworth and onto one of the developer clinics they run there. It's more money but he'll get real value out of a 1:1 lesson from an instructor there than a group lesson.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I don't wholly agree with lessons being necessary. Some board techs take more pride in thei ar work than others and I've seen some pretty poor set ups on hire equipment so there could be a valid excuse.
I always had it drummed into me I had to ride with people better than yourself. On a season that's easy to find but back here I guess it could be tricky if not many mates ride in which case lessons could fill that gap...or he could become a regular at a freestyle night and watch the better riders.
If he does go for lessons consider a dryslope. My partner had a dryslope lesson and on her next visit to Snowdome she'd improved massively due to the need for good technique on dryslopes (and they are considerably cheaper)!
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| tarrantd wrote: |
He is struggling and not progressing. One trip it all goes well and the next he is blaming the board.
When all goes well he gets pain in the outside of the leading shin.
My suggestion is to get lessons as I feel he is largely self taught and sort out his stance and his binding settings. Then to buy a suitable board.
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I'm no expert, not really that far ahead of him at all, so can look back over my first few trips and experiences - and blaming the board is definitely one that I remember 
However, depending on what "not progressing" means, if you're talking about "trips" rather than days, I'm surprised that he's not getting better through experience and confidence. Unless his aims are set too high (which might be the case; exactly what is he struggling with - staying upright on blues, linking turns, carving down reds or doing big air tricks...?).
Also, as I know, pain is usually an indicator of something not being right stance-wise - so lessons, preferably one to one, are strongly recommended. I don't think that I'd have progressed as far (limited as it is) as I have without some lessons, a lot of you tube vid watcing (research and note making) and the patient assistance of Mr G and his barding and set-up experience.
However, it might well be worth playing around with the binding angles and stance width setting on dry land and seeing if any revelations can be achieved.
Also, if there's pain on the outer leading shin when it's going well, is that maybe just a boot fit issue? Pressure on the boot tongue/sides? (Again may not be helped by binding set up?)
Buy a board or not; depends if he knows what he wants and likes. I never had any problems with rental boards, although often the size and type were very limited. It wasn't ever really difficult to adapt and the bindings were the worst part for me, so if he as his own already then I can't see a major issue if size and type are OK.
The first board that I bought was too directional and stiff for my ability, and definitely did not play well in a snowdome  . I then bought a true twin, medium flex, because I'd liked the rental board of the same type, and I'm getting on very well with it for my ability level and for pure piste riding (but I don't do many 'tricks' or whatever, and have aready realised how stiff it is compared to what many ride even on piste, which will limit me in due course). But I'm still tinkering with binding angle and stance width after a couple of weeks, and probably will for a while as I experiement with my (hopefully-improving) technique.
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| manicpb wrote: |
| I don't wholly agree with lessons being necessary. ...My partner had a dryslope lesson and on her next visit to Snowdome she'd improved massively due to the need for good technique on dryslopes.. |
I agree with both of those points (and the other stuff here), but, there's a "but".
I taught myself. But I was an expert skier and an athlete, and I don't mind the work of learning new things.
But in this specific case I reckon your man has had that chance and failed, so if he was my friend I'd also recommend lessons. At most resorts there aren't many who would not benefit from that.
I don't personally know any UK instructors, although there's at least one on here... but he's north of Birmingham I think. It may be worth considering Tamworth for that reason alone.
You need to be on it for dry slopes, I'd go for the easier snowdomes as your man is less likely to blame the Dendix for the inevitable learning curve.
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Dendix however is a brilliant master - once you are comfortable carving both ways on Dendix then real snow is a doddle. I went from killing myself on plastic to 1 day burn and heather hopping in Scotland to riding anything at Lake Louise. The latter really surprised both me and my brother as we were expecting I'd have to pootle on blues while he tore it up on skis more interesting places.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Thanks everyone. I will suggest he tries lessons first and then buy a board.
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Lessons for sure.
There's no NEED to buy a board (although I'm all on-board with the WANT)... but be aware that most ski-rental shops rent out really shit snowboards. On the next trip, find a shop which actually rents decent kit.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Buy a board. It's a sound long term investment, rules out the randomness of the rental lottery, and brings consistency.
Get a one off private lesson midway through a week long holiday for some useful pointers in the right direction.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If you can find a copy with DVD then I'd recommend Andy McNab's Go Snowboarding book.
I've boarded for just over 24 years and consider myself a decent intermediate, but not very good at tricks. This book talks a lot of sense and should help with general technique.
It's always a good idea to get the odd private lesson as a refresher, and for someone with knowledge to spot and help correct bad habits.
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Like @philwig and @tallpaul, I taught myself. That's mostly because 28 years ago, there were no snowboard instructors. I nearly jacked it in several times in those early days, because I had plateau'd at somewhere between beginner and intermediate.
Today, there are loads of good instructors. Take the easy option... have some one to one advanced lessons.
The shin pain thing is definitely a set up issue, but you are not going to progress anywhere if you can't tell when you are set up badly. Spending a day out on the hill with a board tool and messing around with settings can be really productive. Big Tip: do it with a Burton ICS board and you can explore all of the options and the effects of the extremes quickly, simply and without losing bolts in the snow! Stance width, set back, front angle, rear angle all make a big difference. You might not notice 2-3 degrees out, you will notice 5 degrees.
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You know it makes sense.
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Just for clarity, I was taught to ride at Sheffield Ski Village on the first course they held. Even ended up on all the promo photos for many years with the K2 ironing boards they used.
I found the dry slope an excellent start to good technique as you have to work your edges hard to show proper control. Transferring this to snow was a revelation.
A correction. Andy McNab writes SAS based books, Neil McNab was (and still is) an incredible rider.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks again I'm passing on all your advice and hoping for a good outcome.
@tallpaul, can't help feeling that an Andy McNab book might be more useful for this particular friend
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Poster: A snowHead
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| tallpaul wrote: |
I found the dry slope an excellent start to good technique as you have to work your edges hard to show proper control. Transferring this to snow was a revelation.
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Completely agree - The dry slope demands good technique and takes no prisoners. Then when your mate goes back to snow it will be much easier.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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On the issue of pain on the outside of the shin (lead foot). I have had this problem and although I'm sure it may be linked to how I ride, fitness, flexibility etc, I have always found that it is when I have forward lean on that binding, when I reduce that lean the pain goes away, a friend of mine had the same issue and found reducing the lean helped a lot. I guess that by not having much forward lean my heal edge turn may not be initiating as well, but worth it to remove the pain.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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tarrantd, get your mate to buy a board. By all means ask for recommendations, but stay away from too stiff at his stage. Good used boards, way better than you can usually rent, are 1/4-1/3 the price new and just a click away. One less variable to worry about, and familiarity can be everything.
Not sure on the need for lessons, but it can't hurt.
Some people learn quicker with a double positive stance, or at least with the back foot at 0deg.
Unfortunately not every can move forward with riding, ultimately he might be happier on skis. If it's not fun it's just hard work ......
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I agree with most things said above, I'll just throw one more thing into the mix and that's his boots. I've certainly experienced shin pain with a particular brand of boot. Eventually I changed brands and have been fine even with the same board and binding stance settings. I've even had issues with the same brand but different models. Try some different boots or even lacing them differently could also help. My advice is start at within and work outwards....
Brain = knowledge/technique
Legs = how fit is he?
Socks = how many pairs? one or two? what material? Over or under base layer (long johns?)
Boots = size, width, stiffness, lacing system
Bindings stance - 30 degree difference in foot angle, toes in line with knees (quote from Neil "Andy" Mcnabb)
Bindings type - flex, hold, fastening, high back stiffness, forward lean angle
Board - shape, length - hight/weight of rider, flex and torsional stiffness?
Get all these right and he or anyone should be in for pain free riding
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