 Poster: A snowHead
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In Europe there are lots of detachable chair lifts, often serving key routes (e.g. Solaise Express, Tommeaus, Fresse in Espace Killy, or Plein Sud in Val Thorens) and when I've been there they always seem to be able to run them.
Over in the US (I've only been to the East Coast) they seem to be forced to close their detachable lifts due to weather conditions.
What's the difference that means Europe can rely on these lifts, but in the US they need to have some fixed grip lifts as backup? Or have I just been unlucky in the US?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Does the US or anyone else actually have lifts that are really not detachable? Every chair I've ridden on in Europe has been detachable, the difference is just whether they are designed to be detached at the stations for slower loading/unloading before being reattached for transit or not. In both types the chair isn't in any way part of the cable, it's just clamped to it. The difference is if it's clamped by a big bolt someone has to undo with a big spanner or a chuffing great spring.
I can't remember any 'fixed' lifts that weren't also old, lesser used ones.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I don't think I've ever heard of a difference in detachables and fixed grips due to weather. I guess there may be factors related to East coast ice storms that have an impact. More usually it's that lifts close due to wind speed trips being triggered.
There is a big of an issue with checking out drive systems at the moment due to the Granby Ranch accident I suspect.
US still has plenty of fixed grips - Vail only got rid of the last one they had last summer. Usually they are the better lifts to ski as terrain will be less tracked from them due to throughput (and you get a nice long rest to recover each lap)
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thelem, in high winds they will also close chair lifts (of all kinds) in Europe.
(and Solaise Express, if you are thinking of the one in Val d'Isere, is now a Gondola)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Mjit By detachable I mean the ones with a spring that come off at both stations for loading. Looking at http://www.skiresort.info/ski-lifts/new-ski-lifts/ the majority of new chair lifts are detachable, but there are still a few fixed grips going in.
@Dave of the Marmottes It was the report from Mount Snow that made me ask the question, http://www.mountsnow.com/ski-ride/snow-report/ "We will not be able to run the detachable lifts (Bluebird, Canyon, Nitro) this morning, due to freezing precipitation." They mentioned freezing precipitation and you mentioned ice storms, so is that the difference, that the different areas get different kinds of weather?
@Jonpim Yes, I just mentioned it as an example that many people would know. The same applies to gondolas actually, as they are usually (always?) detachable.
@rob@rar Scary. I understand why you wouldn't want people to get on a lift when it's windy, but I'd hate to be stuck on one that had shut down because of the wind. How did they get people off in the end?
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Not sure I understand the question. The wind blows the chairs into the towers, so they close the lifts. It doesn't matter which continent you're in.
The East Coast of the US is hardly representative though. I would say that the US, or Canada for that matter, is mostly like Europe. So there are small hills with centre-pole chairs, and lots of swanky tourist places with six-person detachable chairs. You get fewer pomas and t-bars in North America, but otherwise it's pretty much the same.
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I think there are only 2 maybe 3 single speed non detachable lifts left in the whole of val thorens. i don't think there is a huge amount of difference in reliability these days.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@emwmarine That only strengthens my question. Why can a large French resort rely on detachables but East Coast resorts close their detachables while other lifts remain open. I don't think it's wind, I could understand it being ice freezing to the cable though (stopping the chairs from reattaching).
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Just learned that a technique with detachables in severe weather is to detach all the chairs and then keep the cable running so as to avoid ice and snow buildup.
Doesn't answer your question but interesting.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Yes the gondola at Aonach Mor near Fort William is designed so that the line can run slowly to prevent icing, a particular problem in the uk's maritime climate.
Humidity is lower in the alps because of drier air masses and because the air is also drier at high altitudes.
The east coast USA is quite famous for its icy runs. Perhaps freezing rain is more common there too?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Holy poo-poo rob! Im never going in that lift again!
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Now in Colorado skiing Steamboat & Winter Park so far. I'm surprised by how old the level of equipment is here. It was mostly old in Big Sky too when I was there 4 years ago, (though I hear they have updated a couple of their chairs). Sun Valley in Idaho was worse with old equipment. Europe is way ahead in technology in the mountains. Steamboat only introduced proximity passes last season whereas they have been common place in Europe for years.
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You know it makes sense.
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I was a lift op in Aspen years ago. Wind is #1 reason for closing lifts. Swinging chairs can cause the cable to jump a sheave. It would ruin your day.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Old Man Of Lech wrote: |
| Europe is way ahead in technology in the mountains.. |
But hey at least you have natural snow and skiable off piste terrain as a poor consolation.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Old Man Of Lech wrote: |
| ... Europe is way ahead in technology in the mountains. ... |
I can see why you'd say that, but you have to think too about where you go. North America has lots of smaller hills, some of which are visited by tourists (which I note you're probably not). Those same tourists would probably visit a big circus in Europe, which is built for high volumes. The only place to compare come close to those big Euro places is Whistler, which of course has some funky new lifts kicking around here and there too. That's because the market's the same.
Come down to Taos and it's more like those obscure Austrian or French or Pyrenees places where you have to know about it to go, and the lifts don't need to be high capacity or good for novices.
The nature of the terrain is different too, so where as in France you may average "one run per lift", in North America the lift/ "run" ratio is very different.
Sure, they're different places, but the technology is supplied by the same companies and tends to be appropriate to the problem being solved. Technology differences are an effect of those differences, not a cause.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| thelem wrote: |
| It was the report from Mount Snow that made me ask the question, http://www.mountsnow.com/ski-ride/snow-report/ "We will not be able to run the detachable lifts (Bluebird, Canyon, Nitro) this morning, due to freezing precipitation." They mentioned freezing precipitation and you mentioned ice storms, so is that the difference, that the different areas get different kinds of weather? |
Actually I could see a reason there. If you've got freezing rain or fog conditions where the precipitation is still liquid even though temps. are sub-zero it freezes as soon as it touches anything, such as a chair lift cable. In this case when you try to re-attach a chair to the cable it might actually be a section of cable with a wrapping of solid ice you're attaching to and so you can't be 100% sure the chair is safely attached so you'd close the chair. A non-detachable chair won't face the same issues and I guess the reason for the US/European split is that those weather conditions are more common in the US.
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