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Why is my back leg wrecking?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
OK, so I am very much an idiot ( and not the youngest ) still learning. Currently out on hols with newish board and nice snow, and progressing quickly (literally), linking turns, reasonably carved most of the time, upright most of the time and coping on steeper stuff too.
However, my back thigh front and side is just so strained that it's getting hard to keep going at times.
I suspect the reason is that I'm 'braking' with it all the time on turns, esp on heelside. I guess that this is pure fear... Not prepared to commit at speed to a fluid turn, etc.
Riding on toe edge is much less strain once it's sore/burning than heel edge.
To relieve/rest it I'll ride switch for a while - but then the other back leg gets tired too!
Any suggestions/assists, and how much is this just part of the inevitable learning and confidence curve?
Cheers.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Sounds like you are getting leg burn more associated with riding powder, ie putting your weight on the back of the board to keep the nose up. You need to distribute your weight more equally on both legs, that will solve the issue.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Grizzler, Is your stance too wide?
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cad99uk wrote:
@Grizzler, Is your stance too wide?

Possible, but it's on the absolute minimum setting for the board - already adjusted that this week before the leg 'strain'.
FYI I ride 'duck' 9 degrees each foot, seems the most comfy for my body & knees ( previously was 6 but gone to 9 when narrowed stance width).
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@JimboS, good thought ( says OH coach). Possibly I am - suspect again a fear of committing down the nasty fast hurts when you hit it hill thing.
Oh for some nice soft powder... rolling eyes
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@Grizzler, Probably not a width issue then. Mrs cad rides +18, -6. Try something like that and see if it makes any difference.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Your weight distribution is wrong for the perceived conditions. You need to be further over your lead leg.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
If it's your back leg, then the chances are you're not riding in a balanced centred stance. You want your weight evenly distributed between your feet, balanced front-back and side-side. It's common to see people with a straight front leg, loading up their back leg, and kicking one or the other leg around to make "turns". If you're doing that, then it's going to be hugely tiring. Get someone to video you riding and you'll see it straight away, if this is the issue.

For what it's worth, you also want to ride centred in powder. If you find you have to shift your weight back, then instead shift your stance back, because if you don't then you'll burn out really quickly. If you're riding a twin board (in powder) then commonly you will need to do this as they're not directional. Most powder boards have the reference stance set back. But note that you still want to ride them centered on the stance - never ever load up one leg.
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@Grizzler, As said above. I used to do the same, and still do sometimes when I'm knackered. When I find myself doing it and want to snap out of the habit, I try to consciously drop my leading shoulder which brings your centering back over the middle of the board a bit. Some suggest that while you're teaching yourself to centre, reach forwards with your leading hand as though you were going to try to grab the nose of the board (not ACTUALLY grabbing the board though, just pretend OK...) Its also a good practice for when you're learning to ride Switch, as quite a lot of people tend to shift their weight back when Switch.
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Thanks all. Have booked a private lesson for tomorrow so will see what they say (been equalling up the pain on both legs on 2 planks for a couple of days' rest). Think certainly that I am tensing the back leg a lot of the time and not 100% centred - mainly through fear of committing down the slope and generally putting force/weight forwards in case I catch a front edge. It's this painful falling off stuff, you see... wink Seriously, have caught myself a couple of right hard cartwheeling smackers this week, struggling with the after effects still, so am very cautious on certain terrain, and especially on heelside turns Sad
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So just an update. Had lesson (though today in general my rear leg wasn't hurting/strained anyway, perhaps because confidence in faster turns has increased). Instructor said that I was indeed not putting enough weight on front foot, particularly in heelside turns.
So spent 2 hours practicing riding and turning leaning bodily forward over front of board, straight rear leg etc, gripping front knee and dropping front shoulder.
All feels very strange and will have to get used to quite a different turning technique too, though it does feel lovely on the odd occasion when it comes together.
At least it's now my front leg that hurts like buggery, not the back one... I suppose that it's progress Confused Laughing
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Grizzler, always remember though, it's about a balanced stance. Getting on the front foot is good, but don't get stuck there.
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@stevomcd, Yes, this is something which worries me and, TBH, I just don't really understand weighting and stance on a board as yet.
I felt quite in control before my lesson, just the aching rear leg. Now I feel less in control (but just getting used to a new stance perhaps?), but am apparenty technically riding better (certainly faster!) with the front leg aching. That feels equally not right...
I did ask my instructor about stance and weighting and how it changes through the turns and other riding positions/purposes, but it didn't really get answered. She was very keen on getting the weight right forward by physically leaning forward, shifting body sideways/forward so that front pelvis/hip was directly over the front foot and the rear leg straight. (Also dropping front shoulder, which is an issue on my part to be sure.) Traversing also seemed to be very much get and keep the weight forward and tip the boad on edge. Her version was that board steering is purely (?) by leaning down the fall line and changing edges, not as such rotating any part of the upper body (or other parts). Puzzled
Asked Mr G, and his version is "um... I don't really know what I do, it's just instinct now"...

So - any help or pointers to helpful articles/YT vids would be most appreciated. Smile
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Sounds rather like she is trying to get you into a place where you'll be consciously pressuring and twisting your toe/heel edges to start your turns rather than using your upper body position to move your weight around.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@Grizzler, Get yourself a copy of Go Snowboard. Then you can get to grips with foot steering.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Go-Snowboard-Neil-McNab/dp/1405315741?tag=amz07b-21
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
You're almost certainly not turning properly. You're probably trying to use your back foot as a rudder and skidding your turns, rather than flexing into your knees and ankles to initiate from the front foot. Especially if you're riding with any kind of speed, this is highly inefficient and will wear you out much quicker.

As others have said, it has to do with weight distribution.

Looked up "skidded turns" versus "carving" online and you'll see the difference.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
A snowboard is just a giant castor, like a supermarket trolley wheel ......

Little experiment; get old old lolly stick, lay it out sideways in front of you on a smooth surface, such as a table. Put a finger near the left hand end and pull the stick to the left. Lolly stick follows obediently. Now centre the stick, put finger near right hand end and again move to the left. See what happens? It tries to come round, again and again. Inherent instability, basic physics.

A snowboard will do this whether you're going straight or turning. So you are constantly, often unknowingly, fighting to steady the board with your trail leg. As most ride at or near (sometimes beyond ......) their limits, the trail leg tires before the lead leg, as it's actually doing more 'work' than the lead leg.

Grizzler I've not seen you ride but have seen a lot of learners/progressers do this: Lead leg is ridged, giving them the impression that the weight is over the front of the board when it's actually being forced over the rear due to a more flexible trail leg moving the weight distribution back, giving reverse castor. Both legs need to be flexible, but in a way that gives the lead leg more weight wink

Gross oversimplification and, yes, there will be times when your weight needs to be moved around due to terrain and conditions, but it sounds from where you're at, it'd be good to maybe work on the above first.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Thanks, guys. That all makes sense.
According to said Instructress, once through the standard claims that I couldn't possibly manage to do it, I was actually doing it all well proper-like: high fives all round once she'd got me to comit to this weight forward business (felt really good too). Unweighting and bending was all good, too, no skids unless I wanted to put them in (which at the speeds I was ending up at was not infrequent - gibber gibber!). It was just that I was probably trying so hard to stay forward weighted that my front leg was wrecking (and the rear not at all) - constantly keeping the quads under tension. Presumably at some point it'll become less of an issue as I get used to it and relax a bit more (or just gets stronger).
Just need a lot of practice now, I guess. And perfecting my switch riding so that I don't end up with one leg stronger than the other...
And there was me taking up snowboarding because it seems to strain and hurt the legs less than skiing - or that's what I was told Puzzled

@BCjohnny, supermarket trolleys don't hurt so much wink (or I ain't given to falling off them so often...)
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@Grizzler, sounds like you're doing well.

Ultimately, the goal is to be able to transfer weight to the front foot right at the start of the turn, then make a strong, steady shift towards the back of the board as you move through the turn. The front foot gets the turn started, the back foot provides the power to finish it off.

I'd say you're on the right path!
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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stevomcd wrote:
Ultimately, the goal is to be able to transfer weight to the front foot right at the start of the turn, then make a strong, steady shift towards the back of the board as you move through the turn. The front foot gets the turn started, the back foot provides the power to finish it off.


stevomcd I've always found it hard to put turning into words, but that's about it. Not spitting hairs in any way at all, but they way it feels as you transition to the bold highlighted phase feels more like 'popping' the board out in front as much as leaning back onto it. Semantics I know, and not that it matters. wink

Power in on the lead leg, roll into the turn 'popping' the board out front as the weight loads rearwards. Making it overlapping and fluid is the hard part .......
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@BCjohnny, for sure!

All depends on the type of turn, of course. Quick and snappy in bumps, on steeps, in trees, mellow in carves or in powder.

The shift from back foot (at the end of one turn) to the front foot (to start the next turn) is quick but very brief, the return to the back foot is immediate, but much more gradual.

Incidentally, and just for interest, I actually think Ryan Knapton rides in a more "BASI" style than the Canadian video I posted. A BASI video would be similar, but would have some stylistic differences - more for interest than really substantial.
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