 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I googled this just the other night. Titanal is a trademarked name for a high strength aluminium alloy produced in Austria by AMAG. It's mostly used in skis and other sporting goods. 88.5% aluminium, 7% zinc, 2.5% magnesium, 1.7% copper, 0.1% zirconium. No titanium at all.
I don't know for sure but I don't think any skis use titanium, where Ti is mentioned it's Titanal.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I just checked Atomic's website and this year's version of my skis (now catchily called Vantage X 80 CTI W) is described as having a light woodcore and titanium backbone.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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who the hell came up with that name, just as well there's not a break after the third letter!!!! could be something completely different 
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@Valkyrie, my atomic automatic skis have titanium in them so they say.
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@iskar, Quite...a mate of mine has a pair of Rossignol Hero Short Turn (ST) skis and delights in the fact that they have Tit and An*l inscribed upon them.. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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So - waiting for a decent chemical enginner to come along - Titanium and an Aluminium alloy are actually quite different really, and there just to make off-the-shelf ski choice all the more confusing  Both lightweight, but one, I think, quite a lot 'stronger' than the other, certainly with different flex and torsional characteristics (or I could be talking utter horse excrement).
And lithium is...? (apart from a very very soft metal)?
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Mood stabiliser? So if conditions/your skiing/lift queues are horrific, simply lick your edges for a calming moment of tranquillity. Mmmmm
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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WARNING: Side effects of Lithium include:
- drowsiness
- tremors in your hands
- dry mouth, increased thirst or urination
- nausea, vomiting, loss of appetite, stomach pain
- changes in your skin or hair
- cold feeling or discoloration in your fingers or toes
- feeling uneasy
- impotence, loss of interest in sex.
But them most of us get some of those from being up a mountain and/or Tartiflette exposure....
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Richard_Sideways, I think I might lose my Lithium tankard, other than the changes in skin I am nailed on.
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@Grizzler, as I understand it, pretty much everyone uses titanal, the aluminium alloy @Valkyrie mentioned.
Definitely can't say no-one uses titanium, but it would probably be pretty expensive!
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Several brands of race ski use titanium, I have some Fischer ones.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Mr G has lots of Titanium in his arm 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Understandable, it's light and extremely inert, so ideal for surgical implants.
Titaniums main benefit is its weight, it's a LOT less dense than steel so for only a small reduction in strength (5% like for like) over steel you save about 40% of the weight.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I think it is fair to say that there is a fair amount of "marketing science" around the use of Ti, i.e. some willful creation of confusion that the expensive stuff is being used alongside a healthy does of ignorance that Titanal is not the same compound.
I'd just ignore it all really - metal suffices in terms of understanding generally what it is there for, don't get sucked into all the woo science that ski companies put out there about why their design is better. Other than nonsense like "monocoque" being justification for a noodly ski make of foam there isn't really any bad tech out there.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I honestly have no idea.
But what Dave said:
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
I think it is fair to say that there is a fair amount of "marketing science" around the use of Ti, i.e. some willful creation of confusion that the expensive stuff is being used alongside a healthy does of ignorance that Titanal is not the same compound.
I'd just ignore it all really - metal suffices in terms of understanding generally what it is there for, don't get sucked into all the woo science that ski companies put out there about why their design is better. Other than nonsense like "monocoque" being justification for a noodly ski make of foam there isn't really any bad tech out there. |
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@clarky999, to be fair that does sum it up...marketing blurb " two layers of Titanium " = a stiffer ski than " a layer of Titanium " and both are made of a alloy of which contains no Titanium what so ever simple.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I think Lithium is just a name for a model of binding...
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With snowboards, the "metal" is all Aluminium branded as Titanal, certainly not Titanium. If they're claiming a "backbone" (a stringer?) that sounds like a different thing, as with snowboards you need layers of Aluminium plus layers or rubber for the dampening. It's not used for stringers, to my knowledge.
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I think titanal has higher stiffness to weight than titanium which is more compliant?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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On looking 3 out of my 5 pairs of skis say on them or quote to have Titanium in them.
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I would be very surprised if there is Titanium in any ski due to material costs. Whenever I tune a pair of skis with "Ti" in the top sheet it cuts way too easy to be actual titanium, I used to design things that had a lot of titanium in it..
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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It would be interesting to get a definitive answer on this.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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For snowboards, when they say "titanium" in my experience they always mean titanal/ aluminium. I think they are simply "not geek" people: they find it hard to differentiate similar sounding words.
>I think titanal has higher stiffness to weight than titanium which is more compliant?
Actually it's the other way around from their Young's Modului.
That's probably why they use Ti in bike stuff, which you want to be stiff but to weigh nothing.
For a snowboard, I think you're trying to achieve something quite different structurally - you're using thin sheets of the stuff, for a start.
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| philwig wrote: |
| I think they are simply "not geek" people: they find it hard to differentiate similar sounding words. |
This is possibly the reason. There is wishy washy marketing speak and then there are facts. "Facts" should be checked for accuracy before they are released, and they will be in other marketing areas where compliance is required, like food.
But it could happen like this:
* Production sends out list of components, probably as acronyms and departmental shorthand
* Someone in marketing has a go at writing the description from the list
* The description is checked for spelling and grammatical errors, but unless it is passed back to someone who knows about materials, inaccuracies may not be picked up. Alternatively, something may have been lost during translation.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
>I think titanal has higher stiffness to weight than titanium which is more compliant?
Actually it's the other way around from their Young's Modului.
That's probably why they use Ti in bike stuff, which you want to be stiff but to weigh nothing.
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Ah interesting.
In bikes Ti has the reputation of being more springy and "comfortable" than ally but I've heard it said that that is more a function of ally tending to be used in thin-walled / large diameter tubes which then become stiffer whereas Ti frames are more like steel ones (narrower tubes).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Ti would be useful has it has no memory effects on the molecules as in it can flex without loosing shape due to fatigue like when you flex a beer can and it rips or bend steel repeatedly it snaps ti dosnt do that,Ibis the mtb manufacturer used to make pivotless full suspension bikes the Ibis Bow beuatiful bikes. This I guess would be of use in the construction of a ski.
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FAQ
Or are they just out to confuse me? 
