Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
So sad, I watched her on the Tele on Saturday morning. Rest in peace
After all it is free
After all it is free
Very sad indeed, so young. But it's an occupational hazard, isn't it?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Tragic. Another died to young avi victim.
Perhaps the most worrying thing about this is that, according to reports, she was very well equipped and had people with her. She was found quickly but could not be revived. We can buy all the transceivers, back protectors, avi lungs and be on top of the world in terms of skill with and experienced team around us but the mountains can still easily take a life.
My thoughts go out to her family and friends. It may be an occupational hazard but it doesn't make it any easier to bare for those who loved her.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Terrible news.
@cameronphillips2000, I've lost the link now but a report l read yesterday showed the path of the avalanche. It was a very serious (steep and rocky) couloir, I'd be surprised if anyone could survive being swept down it however they were equipped.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Damn. Such a shame.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@cameronphillips2000, she was going about 1000m down over the rocks, cliffs etc.... There's no airbag, helmet or anything else, that could save you in such fall.... unfortunately
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Perhaps @cameronphillips2000's "worry" also includes the initial assessment on avalanche potential as well?
After all, the best avi protection is not to get into one. We all rely on professionals to make decision on when to open a piste or whether it's safe to ski down an off-piste slope. When a team of professional could be so wrong about the avi danger, it reminds us how vulnerable we all are.
Very sad to see one so talented to have lost her life so early.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
abc wrote:
When a team of professional could be so wrong about the avi danger, it reminds us how vulnerable we all are.
And it certainly wouldn't be the first time pros have got it badly wrong. It seems to me a matter of odds and constant exposure to the risks involved. It seems those who spend most of their lives skiing in risky conditions are quite likely to eventually get caught out, regardless of their skill set.
Very tragic for someone so young and talented to end suddenly like this.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
The top freeriders have to take risks all the time, or they wouldn't be top freeriders.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
musehead wrote:
Terrible news.
@cameronphillips2000, I've lost the link now but a report l read yesterday showed the path of the avalanche. It was a very serious (steep and rocky) couloir, I'd be surprised if anyone could survive being swept down it however they were equipped.
This is the link that I've seen showing the path, as you said, a very serious couloir
Tragic. Another died to young avi victim.
Perhaps the most worrying thing about this is that, according to reports, she was very well equipped and had people with her. She was found quickly but could not be revived. We can buy all the transceivers, back protectors, avi lungs and be on top of the world in terms of skill with and experienced team around us but the mountains can still easily take a life.
My thoughts go out to her family and friends. It may be an occupational hazard but it doesn't make it any easier to bare for those who loved her.
Not to me. I don't think the stuff you list (expertise or gear) makes a significant difference to the objective risk in riding stuff like that. I only looked at the image, but in that terrain, if you're in a slide, you're going over a cliff. Maybe carrying a parachute would help.
To me, "tragic" would be getting run over by some stupid drunken motorist. This...if the risk wasn't there, the sport would not be there. Risk isn't an abstract thing, it multiplies through into actual fatalities.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@philwig, perhaps we were being too naive. But I think many of us see the risk being able to negotiate the couloir without falling. Not picking a questionable day with too high avalanche risk.
Couloir E of the Portalet. That photo on Plantski makes it look a lot more extreme than it actually is. The crux of slope is 40/45 degrees over 350 meters but it requires a rappel at some point.
The problem with these couloirs that are entered via open slopes / funnels is that even a small slide is concentrated into the couloir, where it may pick up more snow. At 3100 meters there would have been a lot of fresh snow and wind loading and the layer of Saharan sand in the snowpack doesn't help stability at the moment. Lots of side couloirs and cliffs on that slope if someone goes wrong. I'm reminded a bit of the accident that killed Chamonix guide Dédé Rhem. After skiing some of the most extreme slopes in the world he was caught by a small avalanche, easily survivable if he hadn't been above cliffs on the Hellbronner.
> When a team of professional could be so wrong about the avi danger, it reminds us how vulnerable we all are.
Well one could assume that slope was potentially at risk but 999/1000 it would probably be okay. I'm sure the guide would have pointed out the risks. It is a long way from an exact science and every year we see guides and pros caught in slides. After you've been heliported to the summit, your friend (Geraldine Fasnacht) has skied the slope and there is a camera crew waiting for your run with limited fuel the pressure to "just do it" must be enormous.
A lot of incidents with people wearing airbags this winter, in a winter that wasn't particularly dangerous. On steep, long and exposed slopes, triggering an airbag may decrease your survival chances as you will be carried further by the slide.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Thu 21-04-16 7:21; edited 2 times in total
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I think it's tragic for anyone to die at an early age. I've been to a funeral of a friend who died to young doing and extreme sport. The fact he died doing something he loved and knowing the risks didn't make it any easier.
My worry wasn't that experience around her didn't get the avi risk right and the gear didn't save her. Many are given confidence by the gear and ski in dangerous terrain. Many with far less experience think they can evaluate avi risk effectively.
Avalanche risk is a probabilistic game - guides get killed with clients when their risk budget will be much lower than a pro-freerider. At 45 degrees if there is any kind of powder there is never a zero risk of a slide. If the consequences of a slide are likely to be fatal (cliffs etc) then skiing that terrain in powder always has some chance of death. Everyone involved in this incident will have known that. Doesn't make it any less sad.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Tragic - far too young.
Photo below tells a story (....for these trying to learn from incident).
Very steep slope (45 degree+?) and risk level 3.
According to the munter scale this is too steep for statistically "safe" skiing.
Of course a film crew with athletes would looking to push the boundary a little...
After all it is free
After all it is free
Quote:
The fact he died doing something he loved and knowing the risks didn't make it any easier.
I've not had the experience of knowing personally anyone who died as a result of "extreme sports". But I do think the reason why people died can make a difference to how you feel about their death. If a skier in my family died I think I'd be more able to accept that skiing down a steep couloir with a considerable avalanche risk caused their death (given that they were a top expert, not just a daft oik) than having an out of control idiot crash into them from behind on a blue piste in Flaine.
And if somebody died very suddenly with no lingering illness, no pain, that's easier, IME, than knowing they had months of pain, fear and a slow deterioration.
Suicide makes perhaps the biggest difference of all.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Haggis_Trap wrote:
According to the munter scale this is too steep for statistically "safe" skiing.
Pro level Extreme skiing/riding is never going to be statistically "safe" is it?
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
The flame that burns twice as bright and all that. Terrible for the parents. Speaking from personal experience, no parent should bury a child.
Happier times for Estelle a few days ago in the studios of RTS, take note after 5m00
It seems to me a matter of odds and constant exposure to the risks involved. It seems those who spend most of their lives skiing in risky conditions are quite likely to eventually get caught out, regardless of their skill set.
In my ten odd years of armchair extreme skiing / off piste watching I've come to this conclusion too. Its just a dangerous activity. Do it enough and there will be losses, get unlucky and you'll lose early. Really sad for her and her family, 21 years old jesus, she seems a lot older in that video. I could barely cook for myself when I was 21.