 Poster: A snowHead
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I don't think I could ski in Japan on a sunny day, I think I'd spend all my time just looking at the trees!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Anyone colliding with you from behind is out of control, no argument. The person who does it to me or a member of my family ends up wishing they hadn't.
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| Tubaski wrote: |
| @SnoodyMcFlude, interesting use of the word "routine" |
Well I wholeheartedly condone it if it's random.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
Slope users that crash into other slope users are an issue of course, but I fail to see how their age/gender/nationality/clothing/etc. are relevant.
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<- that!
And I generally reserve the right to be pissed off at people who ski into me from behind regardless of age, gender or ethnicity - as I'm all about equal opportunities.
(also being able to swear in English, German, French and Italian (at a push) comes in handy too).
Ultimately, I believe in doing like I would want to be done by - i.e. skiing a reasonably predictable line and only veering from that to react to whatever people are doing lower down to avoid skiing into them.
Mind you thinking about it - I can only (luckily) recall two occassions over the past 20 years or so which would loosely fall into the category of "having been skiied into".
First one was a beginner friend of mine misjuding the stopping time needed to join the T-Bar line resulting in a joint sit-down on respective bindings and having the lifty dash out of his hut for untangling purposes (emberrassing) and the second one was some out of controle mid-twenties girl succeeding in skiing over the ends of my skis somewhere on the Sella Ronda and then promptly falling over (her not me) as a result of that idiocy...
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| billb wrote: |
| Anyone colliding with you from behind is out of control, no argument. The person who does it to me or a member of my family ends up wishing they hadn't. |
Nope - not if you've just set off from stationary into the heir path. No absolutes.
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I just got taken out last week by a French woman of advanced years (well, she was older than me). She was part of a pack of older women - 6/7 - all skiing together tentatively down a crowded red slope. One of her pack abruptly turned in front of me and just as I took avoiding action my nemesis decided to turn in front of me from the other side. I shouted a warning but she just ploughed into me. None of these ladies seemed in any way aware of what was going on around them, having their gazes magnetically locked on the fronts of their skis. After I picked myself up 50 metres down the slope, I was surrounded by the rest of the pack, clearly uninterested in the fate of their companion but very keen to apportion blame to me for going too fast (I wasn't) and repeatedly asking me with a certain ghoulish glee where I had been injured and whether I required a helicopter. Their companion was in a small heap at the crash site but they didn't seem to bothered about her. Don't know what preventative measures could be adopted (short of leashing them together) but for the sake of us all, please think of something fast.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@RattytheSnowRat,
From what you have written they both turned in front of you, if so you are technically at fault.
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@DB, +1
@RattytheSnowRat, skiers in front of you do not turn abruptly, they just turn. It is your responsibility to keep out of the way of any movement they may make. BTW, did you shout a warning in French?
It is because of attitudes such as yours that I often look uphill before turning if I am on a reasonably crowded piste with the possibility that there may be a skier behind me going faster than me. I do not have to do this since it is actually my right of way as the downhill skier, but I would rather stay upright than be in the right and flat on the snow.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@RattytheSnowRat, you were the one taking someone out, not vice versa.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@RattytheSnowRat, it does sound as though if one could turn into you from one direction and another from the opposite direction, that you were skiing through them. Which may have been unavoidable (e.g. they were taking up the whole piste) but generally sounds like a recipe for trouble...
If you can't some to a complete stop in time to avoid anything that happens in front of you (as in this case, from your description) while you might not be skiing out of control, you are certainly skiing too fast.
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@RattytheSnowRat, Awww... you've blown it son. The Pack have cornered you - nothing left to do but abandon this pseudonym and start again. Still, you've racked up a score of 1509, but I'm afraid it's not good enough for the SnowHeads star prize, lets see what you could've won...
Aww, a fantastic speedboat! Nevermind, heres your BFH.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Richard_Sideways wrote: |
| @RattytheSnowRat, Awww... you've blown it son. The Pack have cornered you |
Haven't they just!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Like vultures! 
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Poster: A snowHead
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@valais2,
I think you should be wary of extrapolating from two nasty incidents into a trend. I don't think older skiers present much of a hazard. Apart from anything else the consequences of a collision (or even just a fall) can be pretty serious as your bone density deteriorates. The older skiers I've know have generally got quite a lot more cautious and ski within themselves.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@jedster, I agree. I found on returning to the slopes after a long break(27 years) that while my skills (such as they are) were still there I was definitely much more cautious than before. Probably because I no longer had the brute strength to get out of trouble so it was best to avoid it in the first place.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@jedster, Absolutely right regarding the point that we should never extrapolate from deficient samples - luckily as a researcher very aware of that and tried to write the original post as an exploration of a specific mechanism which may have played a role in two incidents - the mechanism being a specific category of skier where previous competence has been compromised without the skier perhaps recognising it, and compensating for it. And I continue to think it's a possible mechanism. I certainly tried to emphasise that I was not examining what proportion or volume of accidents may be caused by this mechanism - I suspect not many (facts in this area are made more difficult by the issue that the age profile of those injured is analysed, the age profile of those CAUSING accidents is not). Just to add an interesting coda, I have seen two nasty accidents in the last two years, caused by instructors hitting people - skiers who are not their clients....but that's another story....
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@thecramps,
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Been hit twice from behind in the last few years and both were old skool / old guys skiing too quick , kids just bounce off me so they don't count 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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<outrageous_generaliasation>
| Jonpim wrote: |
From my experience there are 2 groups of older skier:
1. Those with impeccable technique who ski with care and attention, and who may take a lesson every now and then
2. Those who had just one or two weeks of lessons a hundred years ago, who are a danger to themselves and others, who have no insight into their lack of technique, and who completely refuse to accept they might benefit from a lesson or two.
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</outrageous_generaliasation>
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@skimottaret, ...ah ha...that's another instance of the experience I was trying to understand....interesting
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I've seen rubbish skiing from all ages. But I have seen more reckless skiing by young rather than old - including the knocking over of a child (and skiing away pronto).
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| Been hit twice from behind in the last few years and both were old skool / old guys skiing too quick |
Obviously need a bit of work for the speed test.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| @skimottaret is treading on dangerous ground - many of his clients are pensioners. |
None of whom are allowed to ski old school, although all are encouraged to ski fast and drink lots of alcohol.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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And ski like hooligans...
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@rob@rar, Judas! 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Hurtle, gotcha!
Don't give me this "we're just pensioners" nonsense. I've seen you ski.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| billb wrote: |
| Anyone colliding with you from behind is out of control, no argument. The person who does it to me or a member of my family ends up wishing they hadn't. |
Nope - not if you've just set off from stationary into the heir path. No absolutes. |
I disagree. It is the responsibility of the uphill skier to avoid the skiers below them. They don't own a path. In my experience, many skiers, even very competent ones, ski too close to others. There are plenty who act as if they're better than they really are and seem to think they have more right to the piste than others. It's put me off skiing at busy times.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Scrumpy wrote: |
See 3 & 5 - but read all of them as you obviously haven' t before  |
Haven't I? Rule 3 refers to the choice of route of the uphill skier and re-inforces my point. Rule 5 refers to starting again after stopping. Obviously, you'd look up for your own safety but I still say an up-hill skier shouldn't be so close as to make a collision inevitable. Of course it is inadvisable to start suddenly in a traverse when there are a group of speed merchants hurtling down above you but it isn't quite the same as driving - not as precise.
N.B. I've been aware of FIS rules for some time. I'm not an idiot.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| Been hit twice from behind in the last few years and both were old skool / old guys skiing too quick , kids just bounce off me so they don't count |
Nothing wrong with old skool or old guys, but anyone skiing too quick or beyond abilities is plain wrong.
Have to say, I have only been skiing for 20 years so a late starter and only been taken out once, that was in Selva by an errant single ski with no skier attached on the first ever day of skiing.
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FAQ
Confucius he say, 'do not bite the hand that feeds'. 
