 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi all. This is my first post - although I have been lurking a while as a 'guest', soaking up tips and info - so please be gentle. I feel the need to give you some background info so that you get an idea of our skill level, but by all means skip to the third paragraph...
I'm 43 and my daughter is 26. I talked my daughter into taking lessons at our local dry slope last March, and after the first 3 hour session (even while complaining that those boots would NEVER feel comfortable, and marvelling at having the use of our ankles back) we were hooked. We've pretty much been back every week since we got 'signed off' on the main slope, and joined Ladies Club to improve and develop our skills... We've been lucky to have an AWESOME instructor who drilled us over and over on balance and technique very early, so even though we're 'only' in the 'Advanced Beginners' group we're proficient on variable terrain (the fun park, small jumps, waves and (very slow) moguls) and in our first annual 'Agility' course we beat some of the much more advanced skiers. We're just starting to pole plant, but we're still not quite making parallel turns yet: we're working on minimising our ploughs and getting that inside ski round - although I spent a day at Hemel on snow and found that snow is much easier to ski on, so I was pretty much parallel after an hour or so (when I got over the fact that, WOW, this snow stuff is slippery!). We're confident but humble (not at all cocky), and we've got good control but know we still have lots to learn. Our instructor says we'll be fine on the Valnord blues, and should maybe even tackle the reds (and I trust his judgement absolutely).
I spent weeks researching our first ski holiday back before Christmas, so I'm really happy with the booking (Arinsal with Valnord pass, Feb 21st-28th), having decided to go with a TO package with all the trimmings rather than book it all separately (for the annual beach holiday getting the best deal is priority, whilst this time I needed to simplify things in case of any issues i.e. only one company to deal with). We are hiring boots, skis, helmets, and have bought our clothing (nothing fancy, mostly used or in the sales), gloves, goggles, and inexpensive gadgets (skistrap, cable locks). I've got a long list of things to remember to pack because I'm used to packing for a 5kg beach holiday (this is a whole new ballgame, excuse the mixed metaphor).
TLDR:- Since we've worked hard on lessons over the last year and feel prepared, so we haven't booked any lessons in advance BUT we don't want to bite off more than we can chew. I've pencilled in the first three days of skiing as:
Day 1 - nursery slopes, then pootle round the Arinsal area greens (maybe blues) and get our bearings
Day 2 - bus it down to Arcalis for the MegaVerda, sightseeing and a gentle warmup on greens, pootle on the blues
Day 3 - head over to Pal for greens and blues, reds if we're brave enough
After that, we'll have a good idea of the three different areas so we can head to wherever we feel suits our ability for days 4-6.
I was going to seek out any 'returners' on the transfer bus and get their advice, but then it occurred to me to signup to SnowHeads (since this love affair with skiing looks set to continue) and check out my plan with those with experience - firstly, am I naive to think we don't need lessons, and secondly, does my plan sound ok, or should we do it in a different order?
Sorry about the essay... I'm more excited about this than any other holiday I've been on, possibly because I have no idea what I'm letting us in for!  Thanks for reading this far, looking forward to your responses.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Amunah wrote: |
| am I naive to think we don't need lessons |
Possibly. I did my first trip (and, in fact, all 4 since) without really having lessons and am capable to ski reasonably on most pistes...that said I am definitely in need of some lessons and will look to have some 'coaching' during my next trip. Initially for me it was a budgetary thing, I have been trying to ski as cheaply as possible and, seeing as I can get down the hills without harming anyone else, lessons and apres were the first casualties of the bank balance. My advice would be that, if you can afford it, take some lessons. Perhaps instead of a week of 2hr sessions with a group you could split the cost of some time with an instructor by yourselves? That way it can be tailored to how you ski and what you want from it. The dry slope work should stand you in good stead, it's a lot less forgiving than snow so highlights weaknesses in technique a lot more.
Not familiar with the resort but the plan seems reasonable, a case of start slowly and then explore later in the week is a good idea. Try to stick to it though, I got all over excited during my first holiday and found myself skiing all sorts of stuff that I really wasn't good enough for. The plan before we went was to spend time on green slopes, but I wasn't familiar enough with reading piste maps to be able to actually find any obvious greens, so ended up straight on a blue with a fairly steep start to it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I would book into a ski school. Wouldn't worry about greens. From the level you've described you will enjoy wider blues or easier reds much more than dry slope or indoor snow. My wife and I went in ski school when we were at a similar level a few years ago and loved it. Yes,it's not as intense as a private lesson but it was good fun, took all the worries of navigation away so you can concentrate on your skiing plus we got on really well with other members of the group and met up socially for some apres.
I'm getting lessons when I get to saalbach (Austria) in a few weeks and I will ski any colour runs. You can't have 'too much' instruction 😀
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Get lessons. If that's the one piece of advice you listen to.
The mountain is different to a ski slope. From what you say You'll be parallel turning within first few days and your skiing will improve so much.
Have a great trip.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You will have a fantastic time whatever you decide! Soon, you'll lose interest in summer holidays and like most snowheads, you'll spend the summer planning winter trips 
I think you can bypass the nursery slope and head up a green to find your ski legs. I'm sure you'll both be skiing parallel really quickly.
It sounds like group lessons would be great for you both if you can afford it. I think the instructor will take you further afield and probably push you a little more than you might yourselves. Not beginners level. They usually spend the first hour or session assessing ability, and may swap people around groups to get an even level as possible.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Welcome to snowheads  , and welcome to skiing. It's a bug though so beware...
Get lessons. It's simple to not get them, you can do it, you can learn, you can progress. The speed in which you get better is so much faster with lessons though. It's not just the instruction, you can talk to other people at the same level when in your group when your instructor is not focusing on your and learn so much. It makes skiing much more fun.
I failed to do this and only 3 or so years' in realised that lessons made it soooooo much more fun. Being able to ski better is exhilarating and I thoroughly recommend it. If you can find a group that does just morning lessons then you get to pootle around yourself in the afternoon that would be awesome in my view. It's a holiday after all not a training camp.
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Echo above, definately get lessons, a couple of hours a day is fine and then use the PM to practice. Otherwise you just teach yourself bad habits and never progress beyond a certain level.
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Lessons now will make next years holiday so much better as you'll be much more advanced. Think of it as an investment.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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An instructor will take you to places you wouldn't have the confidence to go otherwise. Definitely take some lessons. Doesn't need to be too many, but some would be a good idea.
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At your stage, when everything on snow is new and exciting, group lessons are great fun. With your lack of snow experience they'll probably put you in a very basic beginners group, but don't worry about that as they'll quickly move you up to the right level of group. Then you'll have an instructor picking the right pistes for your abilities, you'll meet a load of people who are just as excited as you are and your skiing will improve rapidly. It's all good!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Good work! It's definitely worth taking a few lessons early on though, especially if you're not going to be with a group of more experienced skiers or people who know the resort. There's a lot to learn about being on snow in the mountains and how ski areas work. Lots of little things that won't have been relevant on a dry slope. For example, the condition of the snow on a run can be far more relevant in determining its difficulty than the (often somewhat random) grading on a piste map. Skiing with someone who knows that a particular blue run has a pitch that can be icy in the mornings can be very valuable when you are starting out!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If you choose not to have group lessons consider booking a private instructor for you both on the first day, or two.... As well as helping you improve your technique he/she will be able to guide you around the local area. Piste maps are notoriously subjective and it is always possible to find yourselves on a run that is a little overwhelming especially if snow conditions are not ideal. What may be labelled as blue, and would be easy in good snow, may have some very icy narrow bits and may challenge your technique at this stage. And if you inadvertently turn the wrong way (not very likely but it can happen) you can find yourself on a red, or potentially even a black before you know it.
It is very different up a mountain to being on any kind of artificial slope and conditions can change very quickly and vary tremendously from one run to another. An instructor will take you to the best choices for your abilities.
Whatever you choose have fun!
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Get lessons. There's a lot more to skiing than just knowing how to make turns. You are in an unfamiliar environment, the weather may be less than perfect. Plus, lessons are great fun and you'll meet other people who are in similar circumstances to your own.
Knowing what I know now, after many years of skiing, if I were you I would get group lessons every morning for the whole week. Have a great holiday
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You know it makes sense.
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@Amunah, Welcome, lessons 100%, I did on my first week, best thing I could have done, got me used to skiing on a mountain etc, 2nd week during half term in France, busiest week of the season I dropped out of ski school as the class was huge, 16 people, skied around ok but didn't progress. 3rd year went to Soldeu and had morning group lessons, I quickly realised that dropping out the previous year had been a mistake.
The instructor will also show you places on the mountain that you probably wouldn't go to on your own, away from the crowds and the best snow.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I haven't been to Valnord area as usually do Grandvalira when in Andorra, but the ski school is apparently excellent. So I would definitely go for the lessons, that will be mornings sorted. Nice lunch and then a potter in the afternoon. Try arinsal.co.uk for group lessons (3hrs a day, 4 or 5 days), it is the main ski school and priced very reasonably. Enjoy!
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Poster: A snowHead
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This is getting boring but.....get lessons, all week. I don't know Andorra but by reputation instruction there is excellent. Not in beginners class.
The mountain is completely different. Much nicer when conditions are good. But you could find yourself coping with hard packed icy slopes, or mounds of unpisted "leg breaker" snow or visibility so bad you won't see each other if you're ten metres apart.
You're right to be excited. You'll have a terrific holiday. A great adventure to be having together.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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One of the things that takes a lot of first timers by surprise is the scale of the mountains and the subsequent map reading required to make sure you don't end up at the top of a black run by mistake (Arinsal won't be too bad this way, but still......) having an instructor to lead you round for at least the 1st couple of mornings will make a huge difference.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Tom Doc, that ^
Simply having someone take away the need to navigate until you find your way around the mountain on the first trip means you can concentrate on the skiing. However simple the piste map might look on paper turning that into reality is often not as easy as you might expect.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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And another thing....where there's a choice of lift passes ask the ski school which you'll need
And don't forget to write a trip report.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I'm going to buck the trend here. Yes, I'd definitely recommend lessons, but I would book a 2-3hr private lesson on the first afternoon, i.e. after you've had time to get used to being on snow. Depending on how that goes you can then decide whether to book a couple more.
It sounds like you've had quite technique-focused instruction to date and have responded well to that, so I think you might find group lessons quite disappointing. Often ski school group lessons are fairly big groups and consist to a large extent of being led round the mountain, with the instructor's focus being divided between a large number of people. Private lessons with very low student to instructor ratios are completely different, as the instructor had time to analyse and correct the issues with your individual skiing. I've found them far more beneficial. Group sizes in ski school rarely allow the time for the instructor to identify and correct issues with individuals' skiing.
I was probably at about your level when I had my first private lesson (3 pupils and 1 instructor) and got so much out of that lesson - I still remember the shouts from the instructor of "not like Rossi!" I now have at least one private lesson each year to keep working on improving my technique, and try to get recommendations in advance for a good instructor. Personally I find it makes a difference if the instructor is a native English speaker, as they can understand your questions better and describe things in multiple ways.
I guess it doesn't help that I found ski school a horrible experience of being dragged around the mountain but not really improving my skiing.
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I would also suggest just perhaps having one private lesson (but not on the first day) - with ladies club following on from beginner lessons and sunday night supervised you have been having technique focussed lessons every week for nearly a year - you have had more instructor input than most people do in their first five years of skiing. You already know what you weaknesses are, what to work on, and drills that will help.
I would suggest just ski for a couple of days to get used to snow rather than dendix and get the feel for what your abilities actually are, then if you feel the need get a private lesson to give you pointers on where to go from there.
A problem of group lessons is that would get assessed for a group on your first day when you are unfamiliar with snow, the mountain and conditions, but with all your dry slope coaching behind you, you will progress from your first day standard far quicker than would be expected, so you would have to keep moving groups, or be held back. ( I am an instructor at your dry slope by the way, but not one of the ladies club ones)
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The OP and her daughter have technical instruction coming out of their ears.I'd say that their priority now is miles on snow. "Being led round the mountain" sounds spot on. Following an expert down a variety of slopes on a variety of snow will give them the "topographical" ability to make good use of their technical skills. Nice rounded S shaped turns down longer runs than they've had an opportunity to ski until now.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Welcome to and like most others I am going to say"get lessons" of some description. Instructors will take you to places you might not have thought of and will push your abilities to good effect.
My family found it good and useful to have free time to ski and to put into practice some of the things learned in lessons. You don't say whether the lessons available are mornings or afternoons or all day. See if you can get morning group lessons either through the Tour Operator or direct with a ski school. It is a generalisation, but some countries tend to do all day lessons and some tend to do half day lessons. I don't know what is available in Val Nord.
One year our family arranged private lessons for two hours on Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday and it worked very well for us. We got the instruction and time to practice and the instructors were great in suggesting areas to go and practice.
Skiing on snow will be very different from a dry slope but you will soon get used to it. Don't think you have to keep seeking out a fresh area every day. You will get a lot of benefit from skiing the same slope a few times, getting to know it and getting more out of it each time you ski it. You won't get bored.
Things to take that you may not have immediately thought of:
A small day sack / rucksack in which to put a plastic bottle of water and bits and pieces and in which to put spare clothing that you discard when you get too hot.
Good quality sunglasses (I use prescription sunglasses which I think are one of the best inventions ever)
Lip salve / moisturiser with sunscreen built in. ideally one of those combi sticks that you can buy in resort or at ski shops in UK which has high protection sun cream for your face and lip screen built into the screw cap.
A bum bag as an addition to or instead of the small rucksack (although a bit difficult for carrying clothing in it.
A Snood / Buff - one of those things you can use as a neckwarmer, hat, face mask etc
Have a great holiday
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Definitely lessons. I have been to Arinsal a few time, excellent Instruction, most of the instructors are British, they have an advanced beginners group, for people who have only skied on dry slopes or indoor slopes. The lessons are 9 till 12.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I was at what sounds like a very similar level to you when I went on my first ski holiday and I am very glad that I chose to take group lessons.
Having learned the basics in the UK, I found the reality of a resort skiing quite overwhelming. Its one thing being confident to ski an indoor or artificial 150m slope with a vertical drop of 20m, but quite another when you stand at the top of a blue that's several kilometeres long and has a vertical drop of 600+m (especially first thing in the morning when its icy)... It looks scary and so much steeper than it really is! Having a ski instructor and a bunch of other newbies with you is such a big confidence booster especially when you're one of the better ones; which no doubt you would be!
In a lot of ways, lessons are hugely valuable as a means of exploring the mountain. Your instructor will always know the best places to go and will always ensure that you're pushed a litle (something that might not be the case if you go it alone), but are only ever on slopes that are within your ability. Doing things on your own and choosing pistes on the basis of piste grading can be problematic... I have skiied green runs in Val d'isere which were harder than some of the reds I have skiied in other resorts and you may well find that even in more sedate resorts, some blues are redder than others!
The other benefit of skiing with an instructor (if you get on well) is that you may end doing things you would never do alone. On my first ski holiday, our instructor took us off piste and we spent the several hours learning how to ski through close packed trees, narrow paths and do a bit of jumping. It was a bit irresposible of him, but was great fun and something I would never have done alone...
Just some thoughts...
R
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Wow, thank you for your great responses - some variety in there, but I get the general sense that instruction of some sort is advised!
We're not adverse to the idea (or the expense) at all, but I think we're so used to small, intensive instruction (our group is rarely more than 1:6, frequently less) that I just dreaded the thought of being stuck in a massive group plodding down the nursery in plough* whilst looking wistfully up at people swishing down the slopes. I think a private instructor sounds perfect - I'll have a look at prices for that - but if it's out of our price range we'll add the tuition pack offered by the TO before we go.
@RobinS Hi, Robin! I think you might be responsible for all this... do you take the taster/beginner sessions?
*Just to be clear, I know there isn't anything wrong with recapping on skills and going right back to basics.
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You won't be stuck in a group below your ability, so don't worry about ploughing nurseries all week. I think most instructors tend to push (although not force) people to get around the mountain and on to more difficult slopes. Also try looking at options not offered by the TO, likely you will have more flexibility and less cost
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You know it makes sense.
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I would agree lessons would be the best way forward. I have yet to meet anyone who would not benefit from lessons. One of my clients today has skied for 30+ years and still learned new things today.
Private lessons are best, maybe more cost, however all of the focus is on you. The quickest progress will be made this way. I would suggest you arrange something for the first day. Allow yourself just a small time on the slopes before the lesson starts so you are warmed up, but not at all fatigued.
Group lessons can be fun, but less personal.
Good luck with what ever you decide.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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My experience is that the group of random strangers from Sunday morning because your best friends by the end of the week.
Gives you options for your apres, too.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I would endorse all the encouragement to take lessons. I would also suggest that you are not too rigged with your plans as stuff happens. Most notably the stuff that happens is the weather, which might make your plans unsuitable; lifts and pistes close due to weather, races, mechanical failure etc. Although I have not skied in Andorra for a little while now I recall the folk there having the enlightened policy of putting up signs to the effect that although this piste is marked blue, today it is skiing as a red (ice, exposed mud/rock). Not sure if this is still the case, but it can knock your planned itinerary.
Go with the flow and you will enjoy yourselves - like the rest of us.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'd go for group lessons not least because you'll get to know some runs/pistes that are appropriate for your level of skiing.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Oooh, I remember precisely this situation getting on for 20 years ago.
We were REALLY good on the dry slope before we went.
The when you get to earl snow one realises that it is not flat, but bumpy, occasionally icy, occasionally moguls, often with a side slope, often with poor visibility, some really really narrow paths with a wall one side and the valley right below you, and often poor visibility / wind, a wide variety of chair lifts and drag lifts etc that can take no prisoners, and of course the sheer Altitude which can be disconcerting or more
PLUS ....
Lots of other people who don't wait to let you get to the bottom of the next slope before they start off.
You want this to be a fantastic holiday and I am sure it will be.
But think hard about lessons in the morning. Any of the above can occur in your furst couple of days and affect you for ages.
And finally, 20 years and a lot of skiing later, a good snow plough (and a simple side slip) is a vital tool in my armoury for when conditions deteriorate. and there is a huge difference doing it on real snow and real pistes than there is on a dry slope. They are worth putting the effort for in the early days.
Have a fab time, and many future fab holidays to come too
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I read the OP again. You're not parallel turning yet, but you've planned what, where, when for the week.
As mentioned above, grab group lessons for the first 3 mornings and let the instructors take you places they think is appropriate for you. At the end of the lesson, ask their advice for which slopes would be good for you to enjoy/ practice in the afternoon. I really don't think you need to tick off all the lifts in the resort within the week at this stage.
Hope you love it, sure you will .
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| dobby wrote: |
| I'd go for group lessons not least because you'll get to know some runs/pistes that are appropriate for your level of skiing. |
A private instructor will be equally happy to advise on this.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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You are going to have the time of your lives, but will not enjoy it so much without the structure, security and progression that skiing in a group will bring. You will instantly be assessed and put in the right group for your needs. Then, you can take off secure that you will be looked after, guided and set up for ski-life. I am really quite envious!
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| Chris Bish wrote: |
| You are going to have the time of your lives, but will not enjoy it so much without the structure, security and progression that skiing in a group will bring. |
Think this depends a bit on the person. While I could do with lessons, the rigidity of having set lessons in a group every morning at a set time would frustrate me...that's why I'm looking to do private. So in terms of enjoyment I'd find the structure to be a drag...plus there's always the risk of getting downhearted at others progressing quicker than me.
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When you're old and a latestarter, lessons are vital.
Do at least 10 hours of lessons per week for the first 10 vacations.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Whitegold, they're not vital......useful for sure but not vital. I started skiing at aged 39 I've never had professional tuition learned the basics with a friend who is a very good skier and I can ski pretty much anything reasonably well and what's most important I can do it safely with max enjoyment. Lessons have always put ski holiday cost too high for me and I've managed just fine so again they're not vital.
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I agree however proper lessons usually allow the learner to make swift progress. The 10 x10 remark above is just rubbish though.
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FAQ
