 Poster: A snowHead
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[/url]http://www.snowmediazone.com/the_zone/uploads/1862/Capture.PNG[url]
It's going to take a couple of spraycans of defroster to sort out the running gear on this lift....
But why hasn't VL managed to open?
Things I know:
December was warm
Pisteurs and lifties were laid off
It's rained
It's now cold
It's been windy
It's east of the main Alpine ridge (I think, or at least its east of the Ecrins)
Precip has been coming in from west and NW
They don't have snow cannon on the upper pistes
I'm going there week on Sunday 
BUT
the brand reputation of this mega, international area is damaged big time - you would think the lift company (and the vast majority of businesses plus TOs) would be desperate to get it open.
It may well be that they are doing everything possible - in which case it would be interesting to know what the issues are but I'm afraid I for one won't commit to going there again...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Another go at loading image....
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Went to the Via Lattea for the first time last Easter on a cheap deal. My impression is that there is not a lot of spare money in this area as a whole (old, slow lifts on some connections that should be high traffic connections, no alternative connections, some lifts not opened even when adequate cover). Plus it seems to get a decent amount of local skiers who can presumably just drive around if connections aren't open.
Combined with the very poor start in that area this season I think it's likely to be that there was no base on some of the connections, no money to spend flying snow around as in other areas (plus no cannons on the links), and there are no alternative routes. So everything is delayed and perhaps the incentives to get it open are not as strong as in other mega-areas.
If you are a big group we found it not particularly expensive to get a taxi trip to/from Bardonnecchia (we were 4) for a change of scenery. It's also not that expensive to get a taxi to Claviere from which you should be able to access Montgenevre too, although I believe they've also had a very poor start to the season. This is much quicker than enduring the tedious lift down/3 lifts up it otherwise takes to get you over the valley.
It's a bit of a shame that the area can have issues as the scenery is gorgeous if you like tree runs and we had some great powder days during our trip. It's also one of the cheapest places I've found to eat on the mountain!
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I forgot to say, Bardonnecchia was included in the lift pass we got, although I think you need to get some sort of access pass/receipt from the Via Lattea lift pass offices if you want to use it.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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thanks belette - they had made a big play of the investment for the 2006 Olympics but it looks like it could be in serious decline. As I said, it wont get any more of my tourist dollars after this holiday.
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| sergeantslow wrote: |
| As I said, it wont get any more of my tourist dollars after this holiday. |
You've not even got there yet! It's a charming area with fun and scenic skiing, good food and great prices compared with many other areas of the alps. Also with Sauze you've also probably got the best apres-ski of any Italian resort. Give it a chance with an open mind before writing it off.
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...@AthersT, I'm sure all that's true - but seeing all the other major areas open (including Dolomites, which has had much less snow), IAt the moment there are about one piste in 10 open - (36/320) and 7 liftes in Sestriere, three of which are magic carpets on the nursery slopes. I feel that the main factor that attracted me there may well not be available - and even if they are its not a chance I'd care to take again given my limited opportunities to ski. I'm having flashbacks to a wet week in La Clusaz a few years ago - and I havent been back there either (lovely though I can imagine it is in most years)
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@sergeantslow, Is it windy today - possible reason for extensive closures? There is snow forecast for the Via Lattea tomorrow and more from the weekend into next week.
The weather has not been kind to the VL so far this season but that's not to say its not a good place to visit in most years. Have an open mind and make the most of your week, or if your not happy consult your holiday insurance and see where you stand with piste/resort closures.
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There is movement up there today. Seen a few piste bashers up on the peak where the red runs back to Sauze and the chairlift back up from the bowl was being tested this afternoon. Also got a couple more runs open today in Sauze and the skiing was excellent. Blue skies and really nice snow.
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@AthersT, fair comment on making the most of it - and I'm genuinely interested in the reasons why they've not managed so well when others have done ok or better. Its not wind directly as today is the most they've had open yet - however wind scoured pistes with little or no base would increase difficulty of preparation. Maybe its just the old micro-climate thing - Montgenevre seems better and Serre Che looks in good shape - combining with the underinvestmet that @belette, refers to. But I think they risk a downward spiral on incomefrom international visitors who will leave it to the Turinese (who can pick their weekends) to enjoy.
@japes1275, Thanks for the encouragement and pleased you had a good day - best of luck for the links opening before you come home. 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@sergeantslow, I am afraid to say that in a weather dependent activity, sometimes, weather.
Your not returning to La Clusaz because you once had a poor week is somewhat shaky reasoning.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@under a new name, the reasoning is pretty simple - with very limited opportunity to go skiing I will choose to maximise my chance of doing what I like to do (as do lots on lots of holiday skiiers) - on-piste day touring from one part of a big piste map to another (and hopefully back again).
In my early years I used to go 3v, EK, for exactly those reasons. I then expanded horizons to 4v and Arlberg - all good (though St Anton was a little iffy in 13/14). Last year I went with a group to Dolomites and it was great - loved the Italian/Tyrolean thing and was seduced into thinking areas with less good snow records would be ok.
Of course I realise that lower areas can have great conditions and higher ones can be rubbish ( a week in a storm at Arc 2000 was grim indeed) but in future I will play the odds and go back to the snow-sure(r) areas.
When I retire and tour the Alps for a season I will pick one fine day to return to La Clusaz to see it in all its glory.
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@sergeantslow, which is more or less fair enough.
Now, one could argue that deciding on one area and becoming familiar enough with it that you can (within limits) always find fun might be a better solution?
I have once had a mildly disappointing week skiing on my own in an unfamiliar area, which didn't (due my own ignorance) live up to expectations. Just because I didn't know where to go at any point/conditions to maximise fun. Nothing wrong with the snow, just the insight.
Xmas and NY week were pretty shocking by Alpine standards. While I admit I have been harping on that my clients had fun - we didn't ourselves ski.
It's unusual. A stormy week in a high resort is far more likely and possibly less fun
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You know it makes sense.
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I think you've just been unlucky this year - I wouldn't write off the Via Lattea because of it, although it's not the same experience as 3V/EK/4v/Arlberg/Paradiski. To me it seemed that all those areas have much, much more money pumped into them (I can't imagine any of them relying on a slow and dodgy 2 man chair as a main valley link for example!)
If people don't go to the VL though, it will never get the continued investment it probably could do with. I think you have to take some of the annoyances of the area as quirks to be considered alongside the cheap mountain food & drinks, lovely scenery and mostly quiet pistes. Last Easter we found it pretty slow to track out where 3V or pretty much any of the others would all have been covered in tracks after a few hours.
I'm also not sure that more snow cannons would have helped them - from the VL thread it sounds like the links were also being damaged by high winds stripping what snow fell, and snow cannons can't work if it's too warm. Montgenevre doesn't look to have a lot open either and the lifts are noticeably newer / piste management a bit more active over there (don't shoot me if you don't agree; this was my experience as a punter!)
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@sergeantslow, are you going DIY or a package like Crystal?
Crystal have been running free trips to Montgenevre from Sauze and have been updating customers almost daily on twitter - https://twitter.com/Sauze_Oulx_ski
It also appears it snowed quite alot on the 11th see here - https://twitter.com/Alpineapres/status/686500255848882176 and here https://twitter.com/Alpineapres/status/687227866271084544 and here https://twitter.com/Sansicario_ski/status/686570809075175424 so maybe pistes will begin to open in the next few days.
Twitter is a great resource and gives a far rosier and possibly more realistic picture than the bare open/closed piste stats. As for the links - I would imagine when they open for the first time this season it will be on a weekend when it is busiest - also I would imagine that staff laid off due to a slow start to the season will start to be rehired as the February high season approaches.
Also avalanche risk is at 3 at the moment so could this be part of the reason for closed pistes?
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Wed 13-01-16 18:42; edited 2 times in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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I have had issues in Via Lattea at Easter when the links could have been open (enough snow) but weren't and it appeared to be due to the Italians giving up before the official closing date. This was the link between Montgenevre and Claviere. However the skiing on the French side in Montgenevre was excellent.
Funnily enough I had a similar experience to Sergeantslow in La Clusaz and haven't yet been back either. I think you will like the milky way more, at least the French part of it.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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We arrived in Sauze last year on a Friday and none of the pistes were bashed until the Tuesday night. On top of that there was no child discount over 8 yrs for lift passes and we were charged between 3 and 5 Euros per person cover charge wherever we ate. - lots of it was pretty poor, they have a nice area there but IMHO the Italians need to get it together.
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@sergeantslow, wind speeds of over 100 km/h today and forecast similar for next few days - I don't know about previous to this.
This would definitely keep lifts closed -
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@AthersT, What website is ^ that from? The ones I look at all show much slower wind speeds. Cheers.
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@sequoiaboard, meteoexploration
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@AthersT, Cheers....lightening fast reply! 
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| nem wrote: |
| We arrived in Sauze last year on a Friday and none of the pistes were bashed until the Tuesday night. On top of that there was no child discount over 8 yrs for lift passes and we were charged between 3 and 5 Euros per person cover charge wherever we ate. - lots of it was pretty poor, they have a nice area there but IMHO the Italians need to get it together. |
Where were you eating? I spent 10 days there, and never was charged a cover fee...
never paid more than 2,30 for a large cappuccino... bliss.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| HeidiAmsterdam wrote: |
| nem wrote: |
| We arrived in Sauze last year on a Friday and none of the pistes were bashed until the Tuesday night. On top of that there was no child discount over 8 yrs for lift passes and we were charged between 3 and 5 Euros per person cover charge wherever we ate. - lots of it was pretty poor, they have a nice area there but IMHO the Italians need to get it together. |
Where were you eating? I spent 10 days there, and never was charged a cover fee...
never paid more than 2,30 for a large cappuccino... bliss. |
We were there last year. After France were amazed by the prices, especially up the hill. 3.5 Euros for a pizza up the hill!!! We never had to pay a cover charge.
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There was a cover charge almost everywhere we ate, even the pizza place in town. We really noticed it because there were 5 of us and one bill payer. (Me)
I must admit the 5 Euros was quite a fancy place on the slopes but still, 25 euro on top of what you expect to pay for your lunch made a difference.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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TBH the cover charge wasn't the major issue. The completely ungroomed pistes for 4 days out of 6 and the expensive lift passes for the kids was more of a deal breaker.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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agree the price for chidren's passes are dear - there should be a family deal or something...
a sort major FAIL on pricing.
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@nem, A six day lift pass at the Via Lattea is 196 euro (minus Montgenevre 246 with). That is very cheap.
Under 8's is 36 euro for six days. I agree that there could be an 8-16yrs price but with the adult one so cheap it kind of makes up for it.
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You know it makes sense.
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| AthersT wrote: |
@nem, A six day lift pass at the Via Lattea is 196 euro (minus Montgenevre 246 with). That is very cheap.
Under 8's is 36 euro for six days. I agree that there could be an 8-16yrs price but with the adult one so cheap it kind of makes up for it. |
and correct if I'm wrong, but that is the price for anyone 8 years and older? I do recall that the total price was about the same as a Super Dolomite pass for the same period for a family of 4.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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We are paying the same in les arcs/vallandry this year (195 euro) but this is not touted as a 'cheap' resort and I assume they groom the pistes more than once a week!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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We also paid 170 euro more for our ski hire in Sauze than we are paying this year in les arcs.
Don't get me wrong ...we had a lovely time (of course) but I there are issues. The price of an individual coffee or beer isn't the only story.
(And I was a bit annoyed about the piste bashing thing- as I had a very nervous intermediate who found the conditions difficult)
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@nem, I guess at the end of the day with a super resort like Les Arcs vs Via Lattea it's about economy of scales - both have lots of piste KM's but one is busy year after year with many more customers and the other not so much. That region of the Italian alps seems to me to be a victim of fashion and proximity - too close to french mega resorts and not fashionable enough to pull enough people away to afford to catch up.
Probably says alot about Italian attitudes/government support vs French attitudes/government support in recent years towards marketing and growing their product.
Illustrated by the lack of explanation to show there is a 8-15 yr old lift pass allowing it to be confused with the over 65's. Maybe they are just happy with busy weekends from Northern Italians visiting.
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I agree. I would actually rather not go to a mega resort hence why we went to Sauze. It was just frustrating to see it managed in a way that makes it less competative than it could be.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Had 2 trips to claviere 2 years ago, was awesome holiday, great pistes all the way over to Sauze and the food was amazing the whole week, and so cheap. Can't remember ever paying a cover charge or feeling ripped off (unlike most french resorts). I had though been warned that things get pricey in Sauze, which is why we stayed somewhere else in the VL.
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[quote="AthersT"]@nem, I guess I'm used to slightly higher prices in Austria. Where they do groom the pistes at least once a day, And invest in new lifts and snow-making year in year out. 
@HeidiAmsterdam, With a little reading it appears you can get a Vialattea Gold ticket for three days for under 15's at a cost of 63 euro's - it doubles up as a ticket for the over 65 too. You'd need to rebuy after three days but thats 126 euros for six day for 8-15 yr olds.
Translation via Google Translate - "for those under 15, over 65 gold and it requires an identity document proving the age of the beneficiary"[/quote
Good to know for next month, and it appears I paid to much last time 
I'm not bothered by the piste bashing, to be fair I'm not a fan of skiing corduroy anyway. And actually, my favorite part of Sauze (or one of them) are the drag lifts. At first I was annoyed that best skiing had drag lifts, but realizing that most other people are as well, it keeps them away from what is some of the funnest skiing on the mountain... and finally, I don't mind the drag lifts. Sometimes it's better than freezing on a chair!
I had to rent boots for my oldest last year, rented them at the shop at the bottom of the Clotes lift. She had grown out of boots between Christmas and New Year!!! Anyway, was a reasonable price for the week, comparable to what I'd paid elsewhere...
But do agree, that the lift pass isn't cheap, and it's a pity that snow isn't managed better. In contrast to the Dolomites, who have invested heavily, the complete Sella Ronda was opened at Christmas on 100% artificial snow. This will surely give skiers confidence to book the Dolomites at Christmas. They can not only say they can do it, but they actually did it. And sadly, Via Lattea is the unfortunate Italian cousin in this story...
But, still love skiing there
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super resort - les arcs... hmmm i thought it was a bit poo-poo, no character, old 80's style, ignorant french and crap expensive food.. give me sauze any day.. 
are we skiing in the same places??
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@j0no5mith, it's a comment on the size/spending power/visitor numbers etc, not what I think to the resort quality as I've never been!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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thing is, the more visitor numbers do generate more money, which can be invested on better infrastructure (newer faster lifts). Though i would take a slow lift without queuing, over having to queue 30 mins to get on a new fast lift - which is my experience of les arcs vs sauze.
when there lots of snow at sauze its brill, just at the moment its lacking in natural snow, with limited artificial snow. Though the temperatures haven't been too good for the snow cannons either.
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Todays official bulletin says 36/320 pistes open and no links, same as yesterday.
Also, picked this up from the Vialattea site "More than 60% of courses scattered about the different skiing resorts of the area are covered by the planned snowmaking system net."
"Planned" is interesting - bit of marketing spin / vapourware there?
Again, I know that the snowmaking depends on temps, humidity, water reserves, chemicals added etc etc but Dolomites are an exemplar that VL are just nowhere near. it will be interesting to see how much gets opened after the coming week of (probable) artic temps.
Meanwhile, if any VL champions hooked in on here want to share best runs or best huts it would help with @under a new name,'s observation that there is no substiute for local knowledge (and help me look forward to it!)
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FAQ
but I will still be looking for better odds in the weather gamble next year.... 