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Overzealous base grind or just normal?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hey guys,

Quick update, thanks again for all the helpful replies. I spoke to the shop again today once I had given them time to speak to the technician who carried out the service. They said that apparently he had already mentioned that something had gone wrong during the service and thought that it seemed like the base was very thin in that particular spot. They suggested that it was a manufacturing defect from K2 and that I should bring the board in for a closer look.

I've just got back from dropping the board off with them, they tried to get in contact with K2 while i was there but were apparently unsuccessful. Understandably they don't want to shell out on a new board for me if it is in fact a manufacturing fault, in which case K2 will hopefully step up and sort it.

The guys in the shop did seem genuine, so I'm hopeful that if K2 come back and say there was no problem then they will do the right thing! The owner said that he had never seen anything like it before and was at a loss as to how it could have happened...I suggested it could have just been a mistake but he didn't seem to think this could have happened.

Anyway, we are all in agreement that something is definitely not right, and that I need to be put back in the position I was in before I took the board in, i.e, a non-damaged board which i can use on my holiday!




Strax wrote:
I thoroughly recommend you ask @spyderjon, on the forum (maybe pm him?). Certainly, if the shop don't do the honourable thing, you would need an independent report of the totality of the ruination of your ride. Jons (spyderjon) shop the piste office is one of the most informed technical resources on this forum. (I have no lien or any other association with him)



Thanks for this, good info! i'll definitely keep this in mind if things go south! At the moment I want to keep things on good terms, I don't think they are out to screw me over, but it's always good to have a back up plan!


Edit: Forgot to mention, they had a real good look over the board when I took it in, for what I assume was warping and high spots and didn't find or mention anything.
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If the tech thought something wasn't right then why didn't they speak to you when you collected it?
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Markymark29 wrote:
If the tech thought something wasn't right then why didn't they speak to you when you collected it?


+ 1 x a lot. very not clever.
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^^^This.
I'd also be alarmed at the owner's categorical dismissal of any possibility whatsoever that a mistake might have been made during servicing (since that would lay the blame squarely at the shop).

Looks like they're being less than honest with you at the moment, and it just smacks of creating a pretext in order to cover up the techie's mistake.

Hope I am wrong though and that it all ends well for you!
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Quote:

Looks like they're being less than honest with you at the moment, and it just smacks of creating a pretext in order to cover up the techie's mistake.


^^THIS^^

As I mentioned earlier, K2 will not touch this with a barge pole.

The board has been used for 3 weeks.
This is enough for them to write off any 'structural' or base/edge damage due to usage.

The board has been stored privately after being used.
This is enough for them to write off any responsibility for 'warping'.

The base has been ground by a third party to the point of showing the core.
This is enough for them to chuckle to themselves and say something like 'What did YOU want to do that for?'

This is a shop only matter.
The shop know this.

Just keep things happy and ask them to take the matter to K2 directly once they have sorted you out with a replacement board at cost price.

You took them a board in usable condition.
You paid for a service directed and controlled by them.
You have been returned a board in a damaged and potentially dangerous condition (those edges will pop out and stick into something you really don't want them to!)

The shop (not K2) is responsible for this damage.
If the shop wish to try to recoup their 'losses' with K2 then they can do that on their own time.
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@flangesax, Nicely put.
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Whilst I understand the need to keep this polite and cordial, it does seem as though the shop in question are trying to duck their responsibilities.

If the tech had suspected a manufacturing default, he should have stopped working on the board and notified you. As it is, they let you take the board back post service without discussing the issue at all. This falls squarely in the lap of the shop and not K2.
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fk wrote:
I don't think they are out to screw me over, but it's always good to have a back up plan!


.


Not sure how best to put this, but they have...already.

You need to put a dead line against it and demand a resolution before that date. Otherwise the clock is going to tick down to your holiday and you'll end up having to buy a new board.
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K2 offer a one year limited warranty on snowboards. The shop will know this.

They have ground a hole in your board, waxed it and then given it back to you and hoped you wouldn't notice. They are now finding another route to ducking responsibility. There is now a pattern of shady behaviour, which suggests that they are not your friends.

I wouldn't threaten them with the internet - thousands of keyboard warriors are not about to spring to your defence in real life. But if this persists it would be good to know which outfit is trying to shaft you.
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I'd just spent about 15 minutes replying to everyone when I got a phone call from the shop with some good news!

They had spoken to the K2 rep and apparently they agreed it was a manufacturing fault and they will send me out a new board asap, so that should be here tomorrow! Great news because there was no way I could afford a new board, especially with my trip coming up and Christmas coming up. Apparently the edge and base was very thin in that particular spot and that's what caused the problem.

Thanks to everyone on the thread for your suggestions and advice, definitely helped me with knowing what was actually wrong with it when speaking with the shop and knowing what to say to get a good result Very Happy

I am surprised after what everyone said about K2 not wanting anything to do with this, maybe this could be considered a point in favour of k2?

Anyway, thanks again everyone, stress over and can get on with looking forward to my holiday again and compulsively checking the webcams! snowHead
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Thumbs up to K2, I'm surprised that they're taking the hit on this. Regardless, a good result for you.

Enjoy the new board!
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Yes, a great result. Enjoy your new board. Pics required Very Happy
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fk wrote:


I am surprised after what everyone said about K2 not wanting anything to do with this, maybe this could be considered a point in favour of k2?


Glad to hear it's sorted!

I'm also very surprised K2 agreed to that - looks much more like the shop screwed up to me, though as long as you're sorted it's fine! Good work K2 though!

I disagree with flangesax that as:

Quote:
The board has been used for 3 weeks

&

The board has been stored privately after being used.

This is enough for them to write off any responsibility.


I've had skis warrantied twice, once at the end of a full season of use when they delammed badly (though I contacted them halfway through the season to let them know), and another when after ~3 weeks of use in 6 months or so I discovered the base was concave when getting them serviced.

Both manufacturers considered it a fair warranty and sent me a new pair of skis no questions asked - which was the correct thing to do IMO - and I really don't think a few weeks of use voids the warranty... If the skis/board can't take that then they are not fit for purpose!
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
well! - very good, @fk, must confess it sounds like either a. a known problem from K2 or b. the shop's realised it was their fault but decided to blame K2 anyway.

Neither of which scenario is encouraging.

I don't understand why you didn't get a phone call immediately the damage was done explaining that something had happened and they were doing their darnedest to fix it nor why you were allowed to leave with the clearly damaged board in the first place... rolling eyes
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Nice to hear positive things about K2 customer service. I'm currently considering their Carve Air model.
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Glad to hear its sorted.

As @under a new name, says, it does sound suspiciously like the shop saying K2 is taking responsibility when it could be them replacing the board to save their reputation.
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under a new name wrote:
well! - very good, @fk, must confess it sounds like either a. a known problem from K2 or b. the shop's realised it was their fault but decided to blame K2 anyway.

Neither of which scenario is encouraging.


Given that K2 almost certainly won't have seen the board yet then then I agree it's either option A... in which case why aren't the forums full of people K2 issues? or option B.

Now I know I'm a cynical old toad but I know which I find more believable.
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Well... I'm happy to eat my hat and any other clothing that is being offered to me.

I'm quite interested about the K2 side of things.
I honestly don't think that K2 have anything to do with this and are being blamed by the shop.
It would be interesting to know if you get any evidence that supports this.

@clarky999, it's a 3 year old board!
A brand new in warranty item is different all together.
Why would K2 take an interest in an item out of warranty?
They would have had to trace the serial to the manufacturing batch on a 3 year old product overnight.
The K2 rep hasn't even seen the board.

I'm worried about the next person getting a service from that shop.

Why were you not told of the problem if they were convinced it was a manufacturing fault?
Why didn't the shop contact K2 as soon as the problem was reported by the tech?
Why did they return the board to you AFTER their conversation about the damage (in a potentially dangerous condition) and not tell you about it?

It's great that you are getting a fee replacement and that it is all going well for you
@fk but I really do smell a rat.
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Doofenschmirtz wrote:
under a new name wrote:
well! - very good, @fk, must confess it sounds like either a. a known problem from K2 or b. the shop's realised it was their fault but decided to blame K2 anyway.

Neither of which scenario is encouraging.


Given that K2 almost certainly won't have seen the board yet then then I agree it's either option A... in which case why aren't the forums full of people K2 issues? or option B.

Now I know I'm a cynical old toad but I know which I find more believable.


yeah, I have to confess that my first thoughts were that they decided it was there own fault and have ordered a new board. it'll be interesting to see where it gets delivered from!
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@flangesax, ah sorry, didn't realise it was 3 years old.
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It will be delivered from them, they have already said it's coming from their stock and K2 will reimburse them so I don't know we'll ever get the full story..

I have to admit the thought crossed my mind that they might be blaming K2, but I don't see the reason to lie in this situation? Even if they have seen this thread I haven't named them so what would they gain from it? In regards to K2 not yet having seen the board I think he said that the rep had come in to see it, is it possible that they have a really good relationship with the rep and K2?

Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to stick up for them, but I obviously have more facts about the whole situation but less knowledge about the whole industry so as questions arise I'm just trying to answer them and give a possible explanation.

At the end of the day I'm happy with the result and it did get resolved pretty quickly to be honest, I only collected the board on Saturday and fingers crossed I'll have a new board by tomorrow.



under a new name wrote:
well! - very good, @fk,

I don't understand why you didn't get a phone call immediately the damage was done explaining that something had happened and they were doing their darnedest to fix it nor why you were allowed to leave with the clearly damaged board in the first place... rolling eyes


To me this is the most troubling bit of the whole situation, but I will try and give them the benefit of the doubt, I guess maybe it was just a calamity of errors which ended up with me not finding out until it was too late. Maybe I'm being naive but I would like to hope no shop would send a customer off with a potentially dangerous board.

If I've learned anything from the whole thing its that a three week old snowboard does not need a base grind!
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@fk, goodpoints!

Please try to remember that I am just a miserable old moaning bloke sitting watching the rain falling .... it'll be snow again soon and I might cheer up!

This shop in conjunction with K2 and NASA also faked the moon landing!
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Haha, no I do think the points raised are all valid, something is not quite right with the whole situation. On the other hand the shop is not a chain and relies on reputation and judging from the on-line reviews it has a good one. I think anyone who's had dealings with the shop would be surprised to find out who it was. I took my board in after its first week to get the edges done because again I thought they needed doing more regularly than they really did Embarassed and they told me it didn't need doing, costing themselves a sale.

So really I'm in two minds about the whole thing, I got the result I wanted in the end, but were they actually trying to pull a fast one on me and hope I didn't notice or was it a genuine mistake by not telling me Puzzled
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Its a fascinating little tale. So easily the title of this could've been "Great service when I had a problem with base grind"
Still, glad it's worked out amicably for you @fk. So, are they letting you choose a new stick or are you getting what you're given?


Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Tue 1-12-15 15:37; edited 1 time in total
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Glad you got it sorted. I am surprised and impressed that K2 stood by a product so long out of warranty.
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Richard_Sideways wrote:
Its a fascinating little tail. So easily the title of this could've been "Great service when I had a problem with base grind"
Still, glad it's worked out amicably for you @fk. So, are they letting you choose a new stick or are you getting what you're given?


Ahh so true, if only I realised at the time I could have saved all this stress Sad the board was a Raygun so not the most expensive to begin with, but I think I'll be getting this years model, I'll post a picture when it arrives!
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i had good service from k2 when some uninsured hire skis broke. They agreed to replace them for the shop just on a phone call so no hassle for me.
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Any news on the new board, @fk?

This whole tale has gripped me and I can't wait to read the outcome. Cool
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Agree they owe you a new board unless there is something that you hadn't seen which caused the base high spot. A popped edge (or separating edge might do this and you may not have noticed. Other lesson is that you shouldn't ever be handing over your kit for a base grind unless you really really trust the store and it's otherwise fubared IMO.
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@flangesax,

You're not old enough to use that in your defence yet wink
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Here are the photos of the new board, arrived just after lunch today - thanks again for all your help.



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@fk, Looks great. Well done for keeping your cool. Enjoy.
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Great result. Smelly rat?
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So to break this down; we are happy to take everything thing the OP says at face value but don't believe anything the shop 'says' with some even calling for the naming (shaming) of the store that has gone beyond it's legal obligation and facilitated the provision of a new board, free of charge.

We are also happy to accept that all information has come from the OP who we are wiling to assume doesn't have an axe to (stone) grind.

Not the most balanced discussion I have ever read.
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davidhammy wrote:
So to break this down; we are happy to take everything thing the OP says at face value but don't believe anything the shop 'says' with some even calling for the naming (shaming) of the store that has gone beyond it's legal obligation and facilitated the provision of a new board, free of charge.

We are also happy to accept that all information has come from the OP who we are wiling to assume doesn't have an axe to (stone) grind.

Not the most balanced discussion I have ever read.


To be fair the OP hasn't mentioned the shops name, the OP has a new board, problem sorted and I think the OP has done the right thing in not mentioning the shop

Now, if the shop was being a pain, and a new board didnt arrive, their customer services were shocking then I think we would have heard a much fuller story
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Well to be honest unless the OP was lying about the grind being done - it's hard to see how the shop didn't f this up. Even if the base were microscopically thin such that a very light grind ran through to the glass the should have stopped then and pointed it out to him. Realistically anyone with any experience of ski board equipment knows that a base with under 20 days on it doesn't wear through first grind unless its been dine very sloppily.
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@fk, result - you're in a better position than holding a ground-down board and with a feel-good story in the run up to Xmas...
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They gave him back his board with clear damage and didn't mention it, that is enough to ring alarm bells.
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Outstanding result, you didn't happen to mention to the shop that you were discussing your problem on the www did you?
I think @fk, may be a very wise rider... Toofy Grin
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Dave of the Marmottes wrote:
Well to be honest unless the OP was lying about the grind being done - it's hard to see how the shop didn't f this up. Even if the base were microscopically thin such that a very light grind ran through to the glass the should have stopped then and pointed it out to him. Realistically anyone with any experience of ski board equipment knows that a base with under 20 days on it doesn't wear through first grind unless its been dine very sloppily.

+1
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