Poster: A snowHead
|
Ok from the title it sounds like I'm new to skiing. I'm not. Been skiing for years on and off and would consider me an upper intermediate to bottom experienced. Maybe a 7 on the scale perhaps.
Anyway, I've always just hired skis as my puritan nature didnt allow me to buy skis that would have only been used for an absolute maximum of 10 days a year. I went to whistler a few times and was spoilt bathe relative quality of their hire equipment. However earlier this year I went to Mayrhofen and was entirely disappointed. This made my mind up to get my own, at long last.
I did some research early summer and opted for some kastle mx78 (at 5 foot 9 I'm probably looking at 168s), they had good reviews and some retailers were selling them cheap. However I didn't bite the bullet and buy them at the time and now I can't find any anywhere!!!
I'd be interested to know if any of you massively experienced snow dwellers know if there are any out there, or alternatively if you could recommend some others for me.
Price point of sub £500 including bindings, used mainly for paste skiing. Need them to be good on hard pack/ice too.
Many many thanks for any future help.
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Something of similar width might be the Blizzard Latigo...There's quite a lot of Latigo love out there, and a snowheads thread from someone who's bought a pair. I confess I have pulled the trigger on a pair too. Great reviews all round. Mine were £269 plus another £77 for bindings
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
What kind of skiing do you do? Piste? also off-piste? Fast? Slow? with a lot of technique or using power to wrestle the turns? What's your weight?
There's no point in offering any suggestions until we have some more info.
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
Hi guys.
Thanks so far.
@Cheizz - my predictive text messed up, but I did try and say that they'd be mainly used for piste (not paste) skiing. I may go off the side but would be unlikely to go full off piste for any significant amount of time.
Fast or slow? Well I guess a combination of both, I do like to go fast at times so some stability would be nice, but I'm not after skis which require a huge amount of effort to get the most out of. I'm not wanting very aggressive type skis (had some of those in Canada and didn't feel I could comfortably give them enough). Good carvers with good grip on the hard stuff.
Basically good all rounders with good grip.
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
@Swarfega, Welcome to Snowheads - I love your stuff btw
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
@ timberwolf thanks bud, thought it was about time I joined as I've got a ton more questions I need answering about various types of equipment! And as much as I'd like to, I can't lay claim to creating the green gunk.
@ perty , having had a look around I can see you're not wrong about the latigo love. Good reviews indeed! Although they're tricky to find seemingly (I'd probably be opting for the 170s, at 175 cm tall I'm not sure the 177s would be for me, though I remain open minded) especially for the price you picked them up for. Best I've found so far is £314.
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Swarfega, how heavy are you?
|
|
|
|
|
|
@spyderjon - I think I'm around 80kg
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
Swarfega wrote: |
@spyderjon - I think I'm around 80kg |
Then you definitely want the 177cm as with the rocker the Latigo (which is excellent by the way) skis a lot shorter. I'm also 175cm/80kg & ski the Blizzard Brahma (88mm underfoot version) in a 180cm. If you were buying Latigos from me I wouldn't let you get the 170.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wow really? I suppose it's more of a statement about how I view my abilities. The thing I didn't want to do is buy a set then find out they were a bit too 'full on' for me. I think I was scarred by the salomon ones I got in Canada. They were good but found I had to ski very hard in order for them to come into their own. I wouldn't want to repeat that as I don't want to be skiing that hard all the time. To that end I suppose I was thinking shorter rather than longer. However if the latigos act shorter than they are then maybe I should re evaluate my thoughts on that.
Very much appreciate your thoughts on this.
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
What current ski is 'traditional'? Rocker does help making the ski ski easier. That doesn't mean a ski can't be too much for you. On the other hand: if you plan on improving, take a ski thhat you can grow into. Otherwise they will become very dull or unstable pretty quickly.
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
Ok thats fair enough. Sorry, I deleted that post. To those who didn't see it, I asked if technique should change with different profiles of skis. I've just used traditional camber profiles before.
Out of interest what would be the negative aspects of getting the shorter ones over the longer ones? You mention that they would get boring more quickly. Is it generally thought that a longer ski makes for more fun/more challenges?
I'm now tempted by the 177s! Especially as I can find those cheaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
Length is just one of many aspects, and in this case not the most important one.
I found the Brahma too demanding with 3 layers of metal (and I'm not a light-weight at 85 kg), and I'm an advanced skier... There are more fun options that remain very fun when you become more skilled. K2 AMP Rictor 82 XTI, Fischer Progressor 900, Fischer Motive 86 TI, the 'old' Nordica Fuel (2013 or 2014 model)... All have tip rocker, stable bodies, very good edge drip and are both skiable now and in the future.
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
A ski like the Latigo is no different to a conventional camber ski apart from the rockered tip make them more forgiving, especially in variable snow. The longer rockered tip also negates the tip dive in soft snow associated with a conventionally cambered ski as it lengthens the ski, which effectively moves the mounting point back which keeps the tip up, as well as increasing the surface area for more float & effectively
The reverse of this is that on firm snow they ski very short for their stated length (as their long tip is off the snow) so they need to be purchased in a longer length otherwise their running length will be too short.
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
You're right @spyderjon. But I think that in piste skis the amount of rocker is much less significant than in all-mountain or powder skis. And with that, also the lenth-compensation you have to consider. I think in the category of skis I mentioned bove, a length between 170 and 175 would be apropriate.
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
Hmmm, 170 or 177 that is the question. And it's now making me wish I didn't have short back bottoms for parents. Another inch or two on my height and it would have been a no brainer.
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Head Supershape skis are great on ice/hardpack and there seem to be some going really cheap at the moment. Magnums or Speeds in 170 would suit probably suit you although it'd be worth having a try-out in a fridge if you could. Ellis Brigham have quite a big range of test skis available.
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
Hi again all. Bit of a hiatus in communication but am back.
Thanks valkyrie for those suggestions. As with other good recommendations they are harder to get hold of than I'd like.
After much review reading I'm aiming still for the latigos, but they're like hens teeth in the 170. I've found some without bindings for £314 however. There's more availability on the 177s but I'm still in two minds about which length to go for thanks to the different opinions above.
So, for a euro piste boy, 80 kgs, 175 cm, and 6-7 level ability what do we think? Will only be buying one set so needs to be the right length.
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
....although, the head magnums are beckoning argh!!
@ valkyrie, the supershapes don't need a massive set of thighs to make them work do they?
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
If you go for the Latigos, I reckon 177 would be good for you. I'm 172, so a little shorter than you, and I'd be more tempted by the 177cm than the 170cm! (And my new skis (hopefully) arriving today are 176cm, and a bit wider than those...)
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
I suppose my only quibble with the 177 is that they'd be noticeably more 'hectic' than the 170. I've always been of the mindset that carvers should be a bit less than your height, 177 would be over.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Swarfega wrote: |
I suppose my only quibble with the 177 is that they'd be noticeably more 'hectic' than the 170. I've always been of the mindset that carvers should be a bit less than your height, 177 would be over. |
That's true for a conventionally cambered ski but these are rockered so you need extra length otherwise their effective/running length will be too short!!!!!!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Swarfega, Try Ebay....... there's a couple of international sellers listing Latigos, Brahmas, and Bushwhackers in varying lengths.
I've skied the Brahmas in 180 (I'm 176cms, 95 kgs) and found them perfect. My lighter ski guru (70kgs) found them too skitty. A little extra weight sets you better with 2/3 layers of Titanium.
BTW, +1 for Spyderjon's advice
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
@Swarfega, glad to hear you a looking for the Latigos. I second the advice to go for the 177s. I am female, 5ft 5 and around 61kgs (on a good day!). Based on your self assessment I am probably a better skier than you. However, that aside I have gone for the 170s. Though I have not tested them, I tested skied the fatter and stiffer Brahmas in 173 last winter and loved them for their grip and stability. I really think the rocker means you'll be grateful for the extra length.
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Swarfega, come to the ski test, I think it is in October but I'm sure there will be others around. Test some skis.
Personally I wouldn't make a call until you've had a play on some Kniessls. Talk to Tim, there is bound to be something he can reccomend and may well have ex-demo or ex-display skis that are well in budget.
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
@mistress panda - being honest I hadn't been aware of kneissl before now. They do look good, especially the blackstar. Plus they're going cheap on the website. However there's not too many reviews on them from the last couple of years. Only ones I can find are on here. What makes them so super special?
@spyderjon - ok consider me persuaded fully
As they come without bindings, I suppose my next question is what to go for in those? Or is that for another thread?
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
@Swarfega, kneissl skis are lovely. Well built, quality materials, great performance. And it's nice having something a bit unusual.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Volkl RTM 84s get great reviews, worth a look!
Kneissl skis were being raved about on the demo day on the EOSB a couple of years ago, a few people bought them on the spot after trying them.
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
spyderjon wrote: |
A ski like the Latigo is no different to a conventional camber ski apart from the rockered tip make them more forgiving, especially in variable snow. The longer rockered tip also negates the tip dive in soft snow associated with a conventionally cambered ski as it lengthens the ski, which effectively moves the mounting point back which keeps the tip up, as well as increasing the surface area for more float & effectively
The reverse of this is that on firm snow they ski very short for their stated length (as their long tip is off the snow) so they need to be purchased in a longer length otherwise their running length will be too short. |
spyderjon wrote: |
Swarfega wrote: |
I suppose my only quibble with the 177 is that they'd be noticeably more 'hectic' than the 170. I've always been of the mindset that carvers should be a bit less than your height, 177 would be over. |
That's true for a conventionally cambered ski but these are rockered so you need extra length otherwise their effective/running length will be too short!!!!!!! |
That's twice you've said "too short", but too short for what???
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
I still find rocker for piste ski a weird concept. Let's bend the tip up a bit so we shorten the effective length and then ski it longer to compensate?
Weird.
Marketing puff.
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
Right, back again. What would anyone recommend for some bindings to go with the latigos? Would some salomon sth 10 b90 be ok? Bindings really aren't something ivevever put much thought into.
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Hi Dude, I took the plunge on a pair of Latigo's only a mth or 2 back for next season. I tried them in Whistler last March and in varied and sometimes difficult conditions I fell in love with them. I am probably a bit behind you on skill level and umm'd and ahh'd over the length (1270 or 177) but went 170 in the end which is what I tried out. I picked them up in the snow and rock sale for well under the £300 mark and went for salomon sth12 bindings also in the sale. They are so cool...
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
And snow and rock have them in at 239.00 although the available shops to view are showing no stock...?
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
@adamski - thanks for your review! I'm just about to plump for the 177s, mainly because the 170s aren't readily available. Also because I've read some decent arguments for running a bit longer skis on this thread. I'm still a bit hesitant to get skis that are taller than me as I haven't used those since the late 90's. However I need to make the decision and as you say snow and rock are selling them and they're still on stock so I'll get round to it in the next couple of days.
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
Hi just picked up on this thread. Interested in Blizzard skis latigo or brahma. I like to ski aggressively. Most of the time on piste maybe 15% off. looking for a fun ski but also a ski I can charge on. (Perhaps a bit mutually exclusive). I have experienced the perfect snow first thing in the morning but I like to ski all conditions, on account I have paid my lift pass and I will be skiing.
I am 178cms tall and 85 Kgs.
I cannot test them so I will have to make a judgement call, hopefully based on the experience of someone in the know.
I realise both are very good skis and will not be disappointed ?.
So what should I go for and what size.
Help me make a decision.
|
|
|
|
|
|