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Which Winter tyres?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@mooney058, I probably will, been running Dunlop winter 3d's on the current and other previous Audi year round and very happy with that setup but I don't want to run winters year round on the mercedes at that size tyre and a 5 litre engine with rear wheel drive....
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@ansta1, if you already have dunlop 3d, that is an excelent tyre. An amg with winter setup, niiice Madeye-Smiley i saw one ferrari and a few porshes in Tignes and Meribel and thought that was extreme, but hey, I was just jealious :- Madeye-Smiley
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
so, despite advice for Contis, the Michelin Latitude LA-2 were about 30% cheaper, the garage and EU markings suggested just as good.

fitted today in the nick of time for this weekend's snow (fingers crossed) and so I might have quick feedback.

Bought from local dealer as he stores them over the summer and vice versa.

as expected, I'll be in the market for 4 summer tyres come the spring Sad
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@under a new name, just drive gently for the first 300-400 km, so the tyres will last longer and serve better.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Sorry to butt in by my local supplier can get Kumho winter tyres for me at a very good price. Are they any good?
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@emwmarine, ADAC don't seem to think very highly of them:
https://www.adac.de/infotestrat/tests/reifen/winterreifen/2015_winterreifen_205_55_r16.aspx

Try sticking your make and model into here:
https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/tyres-for-car/
or for wheel deals try:
https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/tyre-pack/?tole=1
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Nokian Hakkapeliitta R2 SUV if you can find them. Madeye-Smiley
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Hyst, if I could have got those I would have done Happy
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@under a new name:
https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/nokian/hakkapeliitta-r2-suv/235-65-r18-110r-76962

Not cheap, and poor wet weather performance.
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altis wrote:
@under a new name:
https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/nokian/hakkapeliitta-r2-suv/235-65-r18-110r-76962

Not cheap, and poor wet weather performance.


Of all the things, EU's tyre rating system is the biggest cr..p 💀😱💀😱

Hakka R2 is also a real nordic winter tyre! Sodter and better in snow and ice, not so friendly to long highways drives
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@mooney058, that description might actually be less attractive to me. We get some snow in Geneva, but winter precip is usually wet rather than solid.

While I want a tyre with good snow/ice grip I also want something that performs well on the motorway in just cold temps.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
under a new name wrote:
@mooney058, that description might actually be less attractive to me. We get some snow in Geneva, but winter precip is usually wet rather than solid.

While I want a tyre with good snow/ice grip I also want something that performs well on the motorway in just cold temps.


In that case you should consider the Goodyear Ultragrip 9. Gave a solid showing in Auto Bilds annual tyre test but excelled in the Wet conditions testing.

http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2015-Auto-Bild-Top-18-Winter-Tyre-

I have some on order, along with a full set of 16" Alloys, for less than the high street cost of 4 fitted tyres. Means I will save the £100 - £120 a year for swapping tyres over and also less chance of damage to tyres or alloys with the on/off procedures every year.

http://www.mytyres.co.uk/Complete_wheels.html
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Garioch, too late. New Michelins went on yesterday. Goodyears weren't an option.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@mooney058, I usually drive gently. And there's a 110kph limit on the A40 for the winter again so I won't be tunneling it up to Cham.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Still waiting for the rims and winters to be delivered from reifendirekt.ch. Granted only ordered on Mon, but at this time of year their normal 2-5 day lead time has turned into 10 days Sad Went for the Nokian WR-A3s; the summers are Nokians too and the reviews are good (Autobild in particular) so fingers crossed
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Yes, I have Pirelli SottoZero Serie-II on my 3 Series and they were great in the Jura Mountains last year. And actually, even better in the mad, slushy autoroute driving around Lake Geneva (frankly, I think that the autoroute is more dangerous than the mountains ...). They've been superceded by the Serie-III now, I think. Previous car had Vredestein Wintrac Xtremes which were similarly excellent in deep Alpine snow. Other FWD A3 had Michelin Alpins and was one of only 5 cars to get up our local hill when 'snowbomb' hit 3 years ago.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@mooney058, I'm struggling with why taking it easy for the first few '00 kms makes a difference. I can't believe the tyres know what you're doing and I can't think of an mechanical/chemical change that would happen?
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
When tyres get their final vulcanisation (pressure-cooking, in effect) they're treated with a lubricant to ease removal from the mould (all those tiny sipes are the inverse of small metal flanges). This can take a little while to get scrubbed-off a new tyre. My recollection is that the advice is to take it easy on the first 100kms or so until this is fully removed.
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@under a new name, it does make a difference, temperature and even burn/heat-in
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
@mooney058, ahhh, even burn/etc. makes some sense and thanks also @msej449.

given a fairly pedestrian SUV and no antics I guess I'm good
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Soooo...

So far so good. Very quiet on autoroute (possibly even quieter than old summer tyres Shocked ). Driving around, well, we haven't had to tackle anything too severe yet as we were in a rainy Geneva during the recent snows but got up SiL's steep driveway with around 20cms uncleared without batting an eyelid - or even seeming to trigger 4x4 mode - and in and out of our awkward drive with considerable more flair than the old ones.

And very confidence inspiring on the icy -7C roads around Cham this morning.

Looking good...

Must say though, off topic, that going in the space of a week from regular 16C highs to a -7C morning has been quite the shock to the system!! Where did autumn go??
snow conditions
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Just bought a set of Pirelli 295/35 R21 from tyreleader as they were the cheapest I could find. Bit of a cock up on the delivery as I selected a local fitting centre from their website that turned out to be closed. tyrleader were suggesting that I would have to pay a fee if the tyres were returned to them. All sorted out now thanks to the nice people at parcelforce. It had better snow now.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
@Lemond, it's not the snow you want them for, daily, it's the low temperatures, which will definitely arrive...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Regarding Tyreleader, my own experience (and this is reflected in the online reviews) is that they are really well priced, and fine so long as the transaction goes smoothly, but a nightmare if anything goes wrong as they have hopeless and inflexible customer service.

If you want to order from them then ensure any tyre bay you want to have the tyres sent to: exists, is willing to fit the tyres, and will do it for the price you expect (the price quoted on Tyreleader will be a starting price for a small high profile tyre).

In my case I bought very well priced tyres, was aware of there year of manufacture (as it was clearly stated), lined up the tyre bay in advance to take delivery of the tyres and hold them until I was back in the UK. Everything went very smoothly, I'ld done the diligence but actually it would all have been fine if I hadn't.

There is an issue regarding German TVA, our UK VAT status and intercomm supply (which is a technical B2B niggle and an understandable error on their part), but trying to resolve it has been a nightmare with multiple ignored emails. I can well imagine that any problems during a transaction would leave the customer with a mountain to climb in terms of resolution.

Would I buy from Tyreleader again? Yes, but I would proceed with caution to avoid any problems.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
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So far I'm really liking the Nokian Weatherproof tyres fitted to my car a couple of weeks ago. Haven't tried them in snow yet but they are brilliant in the rain, a big improvement on the previous tyres. And they've done one morning commute on icy roads without drama too. Plus they were a bargain. Happy driving!
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Here's a question - would you put snow tyres on a LandRover Defender ? I have MT ( off-piste type tyres) - useless on ice.

- assume I'm an idiot Twisted Evil
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@skiingwithdemons, uh. Idiot.

4wd means (with summer tyres) 4 wheels spinning on power. And the same useless 4 wheels on braking.

Of course you would.

And you'd never need snow chains neither.

Duh... wink
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@midgetbiker, I had my tyres delivered to my house for that reason, I knew that two of the places no longer existed when I was asked to select a fitter. We've got a mobile guy who does all 4 for £45. I did have a couple of heart stopping moments when it appeared they'd been delivered but turned out to be still in Germany.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@skiingwithdemons: 1st thing is to get winter tyres, whatever drive you have. Key advantage is the compound which is designed to be more supple in lower temperatures (i.e. below 7C, not necessarily sub-zero). Even in the UK, morning/evening commute periods are often below 7C for a significant part of the winter, and even on dry roads, stopping distances are reduced. The obvious difference to summers is in terms of more grooves - useful in snow, where the tread traps snow and gives snow-on-snow traction.

You know you have a certified Winter Tyre with the above characteristics if it has a 'mountain and snowflake' symbol on the side.

Mud & Snow (M+S) means nothing other than perhaps a more blocky tread for, well, mud. The term should really be banned as there's no certification for M+S like there is for Winters. They're the same as summers in terms of compound and snow-on-snow traction. There are rare exceptions of M+S which are also Winters, but most aren't.

4WD will be an additional help if you already have winters, but 4WD on summers doesn't come anywhere near to 2WD on winters in terms of stopping distance in the cold (even in dry), and safe handling in snow.

And before anyone else states the obvious, of course, if your car stays in the garage most of the winter and/or you take the train to work most days and/or etc.etc then winters may not be cost-effective. And of course, someone who only does one Alpine trip a year may be lucky for many years, and never notice the advantage of winters. Or may be able to use snowsocks happily on the one occassion they did hit snow etc.

Regarding chains: Chains are no substitue for winters. The big problem of summers and chains is if you're on slush, mixed snow and tarmac, or thin snow, for protracted distances. We drove 'round the Lake Geneva Autoroute last year in mixed snow/ slush / tarmac and without winters I'm not sure we could have managed it. Then, when we hit the Jura Mts. the cars with summers and chains were having terrible trouble on the lower parts because the snow kept giving way to tarmac, then back to snow, then tarmac and so on. Basiclly, they had to stop every 500m.

The only other cars in our little trans-Jura convoy that had problems were a BMW X5 (who ended up in the ditch as he was too heavy to compensate when his inside front drifted off the road slightly) and the Land Cruiser behind me (who had to leave a larger gap to brake due to his greater weight). All the rest were a real mix of RWD, FWD and AWD cars from a Fiesta to a 3 series xDrive - none with chains and all, i assume, on winters.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@msej449, cheers - comprehensive education. I will invest.
I do put on chains when it snows, but I'm often in that 1/2 snow 1/2 tarmac situation.
Twisted Evil
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
skiingwithdemons wrote:
@msej449, cheers - comprehensive education. I will invest.
I do put on chains when it snows, but I'm often in that 1/2 snow 1/2 tarmac situation.
Twisted Evil


I just bought a set of spare wheels so I don't need to take tyres in and off. I was lucky they came with winter tyres with 6mm of tread all round. Total price was £350. That's not bad for four Disco/RRS wheels and tyres. Have a look at eBay.

The problem I had, and stil, do is that I really want winter tyres with decent blocky off-road tread to use in the fields as well. The trouble is that such a thing simply doesn't exist.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@foxtrotzulu, Will do - That's my problem - I do occasionally go off-piste (car parks etc) where my Mud Terrain (the knobbly ones) work a treat. It's a bit like skis - I've alway go my piste skis on when I want my powder planks. Spare sets of wheels would be a pain to take to Morzine - no room for bacon and books and the million other things an Englishman needs abroad. Besides which if I spent £350 + £400 worth of new tyres I'd double the value of my Landie.

Think the solution is winter tyres + chains when it first snows or I'm likely to heading off-road?
Twisted Evil
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Nobody tried Avon? My experience of their other tyres has been exceptional but not tried winters.

Made in the UK from memory, and some of their winter tyres are very cheap.
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Absolutely agree with @midgetbiker, almost non existent customer service at tyrleader but as you say if you are confident with the delivery address i.e. Home perhaps, then all should go well and you end up saving a few quid.

What are people's views on needing chains aswell? I am hoping not to need them. We are gong to Sainte Foy so if the gendarmes are insisting on chains I will need to drive back to Bourg and arrange alternative transport. Thoughts?

Also take the point about going downhill being the most risky part of the journey!
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
skiingwithdemons wrote:
@foxtrotzulu, Will do - That's my problem - I do occasionally go off-piste (car parks etc) where my Mud Terrain (the knobbly ones) work a treat. It's a bit like skis - I've alway go my piste skis on when I want my powder planks. Spare sets of wheels would be a pain to take to Morzine - no room for bacon and books and the million other things an Englishman needs abroad. Besides which if I spent £350 + £400 worth of new tyres I'd double the value of my Landie.

Think the solution is winter tyres + chains when it first snows or I'm likely to heading off-road?
Twisted Evil


Not sure I'm with you. I suggested getting some wheels and tyres on eBay for about £350. If you do that you can change the wheels over yourself when you do head off to the Alps. You won't need the the knobbly tyres there I presume. Your solution seemed to be just getting some winter tyres, which will cost you about £500. (You'll need the chains in both cases). Alternatively, unless you are going somewhere where winter tyres are compulsory you could just drive on your current tyres and take chains. That's what most people seem to do. Might be a slight pain with intermittent snow up the mountain, but the likelihood is you will be fine.
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@Lemond, Whatever car or tyres you have I'd definitely take chains. You probably won't need them, but if you do, the hassle of trying to find some would be monumental.

BTW, what car are those tyres for? Must be a Porsche or similar. If so, will you even get chains on them anyway? If not, would auto socks be a better option? Preferably on all 4 wheels?


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Sun 29-11-15 8:44; edited 1 time in total
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Quote:

We are gong to Sainte Foy so if the gendarmes are insisting on chains I will need to drive back to Bourg and arrange alternative transport. Thoughts?

My thoughts are that you'd be daft to travel without chains and risk such a major delay to your holiday. Or could happen on the way home, of course.

You will, of course, be hoping for big snowfalls, won't you? And sadly they've not worked out any way of making it fall only on the slopes.

When are you going? Makes a difference because they will insist on chains more readily on the busy transfer days when a few twits without them can cause chaos for everybody else. Even if they are not insisting on chains it's perfectly possible, in some conditions, for four snow tyres to fail to get you up a hill.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Just bought 4 steel rims shod with Goodyear Ultra Grip from these guys, very knowledgeable, helpful, next day delivery free , if ordered before midday.

Price was good as well

http://www.mrwinterwheels.co.uk/
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skiingwithdemons wrote:
Here's a question - would you put snow tyres on a LandRover Defender ? I have MT ( off-piste type tyres) - useless on ice.

- assume I'm an idiot Twisted Evil


YES!!! Happy

I have a 04 plate Honda accord with Goodyear 9 winter tyres. Sticks to the road and I go in the 4x4 carpark in Glencoe (thanks chaps @ Glencoe) because they know I'm kitted out.
Porche Cayenne got stuck and BMWX5 spun as he went round a corner like me at 15mph.

My company car is a freelander with M&S tyres. Macdonalds car park in perth with 10cm snow and it was sliding around all over the place. I used to see soooooo any 4x4 spinning 4 wheels in George Sq Edinburgh and they were stuck. All because they parked next to my old Volvo S70 (with winter tyres). I had to reverse out a couple of times and then give them a shove. I used to get the comments all the time.... how come the volvo got out but my 4x4 didn't?

says it all really. Get winter tyres.
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@skiingwithdemons, I don't really think any car parks are going to require off road tyres?

@Lemond, usually (!?!) if you have 4x4 and snowflaked tyres you're OK. Even most alpine roads aren't that snow filled and steep (the ones that are are summer only, typically) so the usual "chains required after this point" sign exempts 4x4 with snow tyres.

2wd requires chains, buy a cheap set, treat them gently if you do have to use them, practice fitting them properly in the warm and dry before setting out.
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