 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi
First time poster and first time ski purchaser. I appreciate, therefore, that my questions are a bit newbie but I've not yet found the answers I am after on the forum search.
I had my first ski holiday in my late 30s, seriously caught the bug and, surprisingly, found I've got a reasonable talent for it (makes a pleasant change, I'm notoriously clumsy). As I get more into this hobby I'm willing to pump in more money in on kit. At the start of the season I bought some boots from Rivington Alpine, following recommendations on here, and I was absolutely delighted with the experience and the result. Graham is awesome. Anyway, I would now like to splash out on some skis.
Based on some of the descriptions I've seen on the web I'd consider myself some-sort-of-advanced (this appears to cover a wide range of ability so to give context moguls still flummox me on steep slopes, but I'm comfortable on most blacks until they get badly cut up). I've done only a little edge-of-piste but I would like to try out off-piste in a big way next season.
Q1
I'd like to buy piste skis, but bearing in mind I will want to try out off-piste, I'd appreciate advice on options.
1. Buy dedicated piste skis and hire off-piste on holiday
2. Buy All Mountain skis
3. Buy flat (is that the term?) piste and off piste skis and a single set of bindings
4. Any better options?
Q2
Are there any particular ski models you might suggest I should consider when looking? Indeed are you aware of any bargains right now? I'm not fussed about having the latest gear - if skis from a season or three ago are just fine then I'll take them.
Q3
I spend the week in Stoke and the weekend in Liverpool/Manchester. Are there any recommended shops in that triangle? I can travel further at the weekend so can cover most of the North West. So far I've only really come up with Rivington Alpine and Snow And Rock. The good Midlands shops I have found are miles from Stoke so not realistic mid-week.
Budget: Not really sure, but let's say a max of £500 for one set of skis + bindings, £800 if going for two sets + bindings. I hope that since I'm in sale season this would get me reasonable kit.
Considerations: I expect I'd keep these skis for some time so I'd like to get some a little more advanced than my current ability on the assumption I'll improve into them.
Sorry the above is a bit wordy but I thought better to give too much info than not enough. Anything else you need to know please ask, and please let me know if there are other questions I should be asking! I'm very grateful for you reading this far and any suggestions will be very gratefully received. This looks like a great community and I hope (in time) I can make a contribution to it.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hi - Also first time poster.
I'm slightly different to you in that I've skied since I was a kid, however I've returned to it after a long break (several kids of my own now!) and have also just bitten the bullet in purchasing my own kit . . .
From my perspective (and having learnt to 'hop' off-piste on long skinny Atomic ARC's back in the day) IMHO all of todays skis are a doddle comparatively, so on this basis I used to hire the best slalom skis that were side cut enough to perform short radius turns with ease on the piste, but fat enough at the tips and tails to venture off piste (side country) when I felt the urge. (Fischer RC4 SC - the 2004 model were a revelation!)
Based on this I went for All Mountain skis that fit my likely holiday use ie. 70/30 On/Off piste - unless your are or are going to go at least 2-3 times per season then I can't see the point on taking fat skis and finding you don't use them as there's no dump/off piste is cut to shreds . . .conversely you'll rue the day you take some race orientated slalom specials when there's no ice on the piste as it's knee deep in powder . . .
I tried a few variants on my last holiday in Feb (from Head Supershape Titans to Elan Amphibio's 88's to Scott the Ski's) and then a few more at Tamworth when I returned (look out for the Ellis Brigham demo nights and check the models they'll be demoing on the night) and eventually opted for some Rossignol Experience 84's . . .for me (now middle aged and not as fit as I was) these have the perfect blend of skiability on all surfaces/speeds . . .they're also light and I find I tire less easily on these than a lot of the others I tried . . .the extra waist makes off piste even easier!
Good luck with your search - I actually bought mine from Glisshop at an amazing price (£290 with bindings free post) . . .Snow & Rock weren't willing to price match as their model variant was in a different colour, so I took the risk and they're perfect.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@hallidayd, Just my 2p worth I'm by no means an expert.
I like having my own gear, I've never bought brand new. The newest I've bought were a pair of off piste oriented skis that had been used for a demo day that were £300 the new price would at a guess would have been £600+ I've bought others second hand from Snowheads members and had the odd punt on Ebay, where there is a lot of cr@p but bargains if you know what you're looking for/willing to take the risk.
As a holiday skier i.e. someone who gets a few weeks in a season you really just have to accept the conditions will be what they will be particularly if you're booking reasonably in advance. For me I've got some piste skis and some 100 mm skis which don't perform too badly on piste. I feel with these two pairs I've got all the bases covered.
Personally If buying new and/or shelling out the kinds of sums you're talking about I'd want to be sure I was getting the best skis for me which would mean trying [b/]A LOT[b] of different skis ideally out on a real mountain as opposed to an indoor slope. I've demoed skis indoors before and back to back you can tell the difference but this is obviously limited in terms of conditions-bit like take a car out you fancied buying on a test drive round a circular track limited to 20 mph!
If you want just one pair of skis something All Mountain wouldn't be a bad choice, but there will be a compromise to be made somewhere. Some people are quite happy on piste on fatter skis whilst others (more a questions of ability technique) will happily ski off piste on what now would be considered a piste ski. On a guided week our guide was happy and putting most to shape on his old Salomon Pocket Rockets which were well under 80mm. It depends a bit on your dimensions too, skis don't know how tall you are just how heavy, if you're small and light something really stiff won't do you any favors.
Earlier in my skiing I always went for something a bit more supposedly advanced as I float between 16-17st so on the heavier side could get away with a stiffer ski. I don't own a pair but one of the better all round skis I've tried is probably a Volkl Mantra.
It's up to you but for someone willing to spend £800 that's a lot of rental credit (even more when you factor in carriage each time unless with certain airlines) getting you latest gear and suited to whatever conditions you get in any given week.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Hi @hallidayd,
And welcome to the Pleasuredome.
I must admit I just love buying skis or thinking about buying them so I know the feeling.
But in reality I should not own a pair of skis at all ...
Unless that is, I was living near the mountains and didnt want to spend half an hour in the rental shop every Friday night.
But I aint that lucky (anymore)
You would be really better off renting "test skis" each time you go skiing for a week. When you consider the charge airlines levy on a pair of skis, plus the absalute phaaf of taking your fabulous boards to the airport.
It may look Cool having your own kit, but you will always hanker after another pair.
I do like my own skis ... but I will buy another pair in two weeks time.
Getting back to the ski hire shop, have a good look around the resort rather than the sausage machine outfit that the holiday reps shepherd you towards.
Tell them that you are interested in buying a set of skis and could you try differnt ones through the week.
Or just ask them if you can have different pair every day. (That's great cos you can have freshly serviced tools every day)
A good shop will let you do this no problem.
That way if you do buy a pair you will know what suits you and the size that you feels good.
There is two more factors to consider, Servicing at £30 a pop each time you go and the fact that the kit improves every year and if you rent you'll have the latest kit.
You certainly did the right thing in concentrating on the boots first.
Also I dont think its a good idea buying your skis in this country. Buy in the resort, if things go wrong .. such as a dodgy binding etc.
You just take them back and get another set.
Saying that .. I'm looking forward to getting my new pair of Black Stars from Swiss Tim, but I have tested them so many times now I feel like I already own them.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I totally agree with DrLawn on the rental front (though i would love some of my own, my ski habits / time constraints dont remotely warrant it).
That said, Snow and Rock look to have some good deals on the Blizzard Brahma and Latigo at the moment. I can't remember the price, but I had to leave the shop so that I didn't buy them 'by accident' 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Sail and ski in Chester, great shop and would rather give you the right advice than sell you any old thing.
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. . I have to agree my recent purchase is somewhat based on vanity rather than true sense, however £290 notes on a pair of this seasons skis is worth the punt - they will pay for themselves in a few trips . . .I did buy them as 1 - a reminder to ensure I go every year and not sporadically and 2 - to enable me to maximise time on shorter trips, which is the likely reality these days . . .Also its good to have your own kit that is familiar - I've stopped buying new tennis racquets every other season as most of the time its just a paint job your paying for - much better to spend the cash on new strings / string materials, so with skis I'm imagining it will be the same . . .(decent service / bugg*r about with waxes / edge angles etc)
Don't forget Snow & Rock do have a great price match service - as long as the product is the exactly the same spec / model / year / colour and available from a UK/euro retailer, they will match the mad prices found on some euro sites (not sure whether this is a faux pas on here? - apols if it is)
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Don't be put off by the nay sayers. Having your own skis is great and I don't find it a faff getting them to the airport. Any faff is certainly outweighed by time wasted in hire shops. And if you're skiing for a weekend or arriving late in resort it saves missing the first hour of skiing in the morning.
I've got a pair of all mountain skis which are great in most conditions and ok in all.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hi, I would defiantly recommend having your own skis as you will get to know exactly what they can do and how hard you can push them etc, Also, in my opinion, it is worth making sure that you get top end bindings for your skis. Working in a ski shop in Morzine, I've seen far too many people with top end skis and the cheapest bindings mounted on them. If you looking to go off piste you want a binding that you can trust.
Anyway onto the skis. For your first question I'll break it down into your options
| Quote: |
1. Buy dedicated piste skis and hire off-piste on holiday
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This is good if you are only skiing once a year. Most of the time a good on piste ski will be able to so you around a resort with no problems. Something like the Salomon X-Drive 8.0 FS (Read the review on Blister Gear). Then renting a powder ski if you are lucky enough to be out when its snowing hard.
| Quote: |
2. Buy All Mountain skis
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Again a good option. The main difference in this is that you will lose some performance in hard and icy conditions. Also the ski wont be as good in the soft stuff as a fatter powder ski. But something like the Volkl Mantra or Salomon XDrive 8.8 or Quest 90. Again read the reviews on Blister Gear about the 90-100mm skis.
| Quote: |
3. Buy flat (is that the term?) piste and off piste skis and a single set of bindings
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So a "flat" ski means one without any bindings or integrated binding track to which your bindings are then drilled into. Unless you have 2 sets of skis with the same track system, this is not an option as you really don't want to be unscrewing bindings out of your skis. If you have to put them back in the same hole there is a lot less strength in the system.
The only way this could work is if you got the CAST system (Again look at the review of it on blister gear)
Another suggestion is to go ahead and buy 2 pairs of skis, one for those lovely powder days, and one of those nasty ice hard pack days and then work out which ones you like for everything else in-between.
As for brands etc, I've mentioned a few above, but for pow skis and all mountain skis really really look at blister gear (as I have mention a few times, they are the BEST review site I have come across). If you go into a ski shop, ask what the guys in there use.
Skis I would defiantly look at however, Dynastar Chams, Rossignaol 7 Series, Salomon Q range. These would be your fatter pow skis/All mountain.
For buying skis, have a look on Glisshop, they have some really great deals on at the moment.
Hope this helps and happy shopping
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There was a thread on here recently (last month) about buying v rental and no doubt many before that. There is no right answer. Budget, ability, amount of skiing done, mode of transport to the slopes, willingness/ability to service them and many more factors come into play.
As I drive and service my own I choose to buy. I've bought both new and second hand. By and large I've only ever owned one pair at a time. Personally I am not fortunate enough to only go out on pow days and I don't do slalom or lots of bump skiing so I've no need for that type of ski. What I do need is an all mountain beast that I can piste cruise and ski crud, slush and pow in. Let's face it, I'm not unusual. And as you'd expect there are masses of skis out there for me/us.
As it happens I've just been forced into buying a new pair. This was due to the bindings on my Rossignol B2's busting at Christmas. Hi hired some Cham 87s as cover and loved them, so bought some 97s. See this.
Trying before you buy is the ideal scenario. But that is easier to say than it is to do in reality. Or certainly to a great depth. So you do what you can and take an educated guess. Worst case scenario you do what I did when I bought Movement Thunders and sell them on for a small loss. If you crack a bargain in the first place...
Good time to buy as it's end of season though stocks are obviously running down so you might not get your first choice. Glisshop and Ekosport are cheap at the minute because they are large scale French and the Euro is tonked.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Thank you all for all your advice. Apologies if you make a point I've missed - feel free to run my nose in it. I'm going to attempt to reply to posts in turn - I have been trying to write a meta-reply but at this rate I'll never post it.
Dimensions:
6"0' (182 cm)
13 Stone (83 KG)
Ski Style: Kind of changes - if the last instructor told me I'm too aggressive then by the time the next gets their hands on me I'm not aggressive enough. I think my instinct is aggressive.
@Belch - I do intend to get 2-3 weeks per season, fingers crossed. Hoping for a fortnight in Canada next year (forgot to mention that originally...). I'll keep an eye out for the Ellis Brigham demo nights - I forgot about them as a retailer.
@Bene - "punt on Ebay, where there is a lot of cr@p but bargains if you know what you're looking for"...yeah...that rules me out then 
To be honest, I hope to spend a lot less than I quoted but I also don't really want to limit myself either. If I can get what I need for half that then I'd be very happy however if an extra £200 buys the perfect skis for me then I'll go for that. I've given the maximum I could stomach to spend rather than my intention. I love a bargain, but I'm also ok with paying a little more for the right gear.
I do appreciate that if cost was the only consideration then renting would be the logical choice but I would prefer to own; I'd like the continuity from holiday to holiday. I'm also a little bit of a geek and I suspect that I'd rather enjoy the processes involved in looking after them (lovingly waxing, fastidiously edging, tucking them in for nine months' sleepy time etc.).
Now, trying out A LOT of skis sounds tricky:
1. The season is over (for me a least). Therefore, since I hope for a sales bargain, that delays things for a year
2. I've no experience of asking a ski rental to rotate my skis daily - are they really that accommodating?
I also agree that 7 seconds whizzing down an indoor slope isn't likely to teach me much I can transfer to the mountain. As such, in principle, I completely agree that it would be crazy to buy skis without actually trying them out but...well...I'm not sure I have the self restraint to wait twelve months 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@DrLawn You do rather sound like a ski buying addict!
I've never rented from the recommended shop (always assumed it was based on backhanders and chuminess rather than quality).
| DrLawn wrote: |
Getting back to the ski hire shop, have a good look around the resort rather than the sausage machine outfit that the holiday reps shepherd you towards.
Tell them that you are interested in buying a set of skis and could you try differnt ones through the week.
Or just ask them if you can have different pair every day. (That's great cos you can have freshly serviced tools every day)
A good shop will let you do this no problem.
That way if you do buy a pair you will know what suits you and the size that you feels good. |
So that's 2 out of 3 saying this is something I should expect a ski hire shop to be ok with. I hope they won't be too cross when I don't buy from them.
| DrLawn wrote: |
Also I dont think its a good idea buying your skis in this country. Buy in the resort, if things go wrong .. such as a dodgy binding etc.
You just take them back and get another set.
Saying that .. I'm looking forward to getting my new pair of Black Stars from Swiss Tim, but I have tested them so many times now I feel like I already own them. |
Heh - you really don't believe in practising what you preach eh? 
I like the idea of buying in the resort, not certain I like the idea of paying resort price.
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@Pynch I will look up those skis and see if I accidently buy them too!
@springbok45 Perfect - thank you - I will look them up 
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You know it makes sense.
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@sugarmoma666 Thank you so much for the affirmation 
@dr_windsurfer D'accord, merci, I think there's a lot to take in here and I will revisit your post.
In particular I think I misunderstood something about buying separate bindings - I thought one of the benefits was that you could simply attach them to compatible skis and vwa la you are fit for the conditions du jour, however you imply that is not a bon mot.
| dr_windsurfer wrote: |
| So a "flat" ski means one without any bindings or integrated binding track to which your bindings are then drilled into. Unless you have 2 sets of skis with the same track system, this is not an option as you really don't want to be unscrewing bindings out of your skis. If you have to put them back in the same hole there is a lot less strength in the system. |
But there's an exception and I need to do some googling:
| dr_windsurfer wrote: |
| The only way this could work is if you got the CAST system (Again look at the review of it on blister gear) |
I take it by this you mean just consider buying two completely independent sets of skis with no shared components:
| dr_windsurfer wrote: |
| Another suggestion is to go ahead and buy 2 pairs of skis, one for those lovely powder days, and one of those nasty ice hard pack days and then work out which ones you like for everything else in-between. |
Oui?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Layne Love that post - you've actually allayed some of my concerns before I even voiced them. About to bed down so I will revisit when I next get chance.
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Poster: A snowHead
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FAQ
