Poster: A snowHead
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mountainaddict, It's kinda weird, isn't it? Town and valley are named after the river Lech, but I don't really get why where Lech (town) sits doesn't count as Lechtal proper.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Quote: |
It's kinda weird, isn't it? Town and valley are named after the river Lech, but I don't really get why where Lech (town) sits doesn't count as Lechtal proper. |
I'm still yet to look at a map - but the geography and the ticket situation outlined above are both seemingly beyond weird!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Erm lots of connected places have cheaper passes for restricted areas. It's up to customers to decide what best meets their needs. I assume Lech imposes quite tight rules in regard to the interconnect because the businesses there have a vested interest in maintaining a certain degree of exclusivity. I can totally see why they don't want day trippers from Bregenz/ Germany using a cheap backdoor in.
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mountainaddict, Go to Warth and get the full area pass, or stay in Stuben and get the full area pass. The Warth/Schrocken-Lech/Zurs ski area is well worth skiing. From Stuben one can ski into St Anton, catch the bus to Zurs and ski that side of the Arlberg. Simples
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Personally I wounldn't ski St Anton from Warth, by time you get there you won't have long before having to get back to ensure you get back on the Auenfeld link before it closes. Long trip round otherwise. On the other hand, skiing Warth from St Anton is much easier as so long as you are back at the Lech side before the last Auenfeld, you can jump on a bus back round to Anton. Stuben seems to be the best compromise, and easier to access Sonnenkopf from there too.
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We have stayed in Stuben for the past 4 Easters. Last year was the first year the Warth link was open. I think in 6 days skiing we did 2 in Warth, one doing the Weiss ring, one in Zurs/Lech, one in St Anton and one in Rendl.
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Sitter wrote: |
Personally I wounldn't ski St Anton from Warth, by time you get there you won't have long before having to get back to ensure you get back on the Auenfeld link before it closes. Stuben seems to be the best compromise, and easier to access Sonnenkopf from there too. |
Fully agree
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Quote: |
Erm lots of connected places have cheaper passes for restricted areas |
They certainly do - but then don't make you buy a minimum 2.5 day pass before you can get beyond the cheaper restricted area. First time I've heard of such a pass after visiting over 150 ski areas.
Anyway, further research reveals that's incorrect about a 2.5 day pass being needed to ski Lech from Warth. Although that is the case for the local Warth ticket (ie it's valid in Lech for tickets of 2.5 days and longer) a SKI ARLBERG pass of any duration can be used for the Lech connection. The Warth websites states as follows:
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The ski pass "Ski Arlberg" is valid in the ski areas Warth-Schröcken, Lech, Oberlech, Zürs, St. Anton, St. Christoph, Stuben and Klösterle/Sonnenkopf.
The pass allows the use of all 94 cableways and lifts and 340 kilometres of slopes.
The Ski Arlberg ski pass is available at all points of sale in Warth und Schröcken |
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I can totally see why they don't want day trippers from Bregenz/ Germany using a cheap backdoor in. |
I can't. And the above shows that they seem happy enough to welcome the plebby daytrippers.
So it looks like we can fly to Friedrichshafen, stay down the valley at Au or Schoppernau, ski Damuls etc plus the odd day at Warth/Lech/Zuers (as originally hoped) after all -ie with a combination of the 3 Valleys and Ski Arlberg passes.
And another thing....I've now ascertained that the 3 Valleys pass that covers 41 areas is a season pass; whereas the same-named 3 Valleys pass covering 29 ski areas is a pass from 2.5 days upwards. That should still give us plenty to go at .
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I've been reading this thread with interest and nobody yet seems to have picked up on why St Anton/ Stuben/ Lech/ Zurs and now Warth ski lift company don't want the Bregenzerwald lift areas on a common lift pass............brand image and economics. The Arlberg lift company have invested hugely over the last 20 years to such a point where St Anton is an internationally recognised quality brand and it attracts skiers from all over the world, they have little to gain by diluting their brand and allowing areas with lower quality (as they perceive them) offerings into the club unless they meet certain criteria regards performance, ie no skiers/ hour uplifts, km piste etc. If they did it would dilute their brand. Warth must have agreed to meet these criteria, and it was then deemed mutually beneficial for them to join the party......we'll undoubtedly see much investment in Warth/ Schrocken in the next few years. Lets face it if you owned and benefitted from the St Anton brand financially you'd want to see a return on your investment rather than a bunch of your punters skiing off for the day in Damuls or Au wouldnt you, and spending their €'s in another area? Also don't underestimate the strength of divide between Arlberg and Vorarlberg, St Anton/ Stuben and Zurs/ Lech/ Warth are unlikely bed-mates, and are in it for the money, St Anton would be more likely to want to bring Petteneu to the party than Damuls/ Au I would suggest. Its a very big business and all sorts of areas/ parties are looking for a slice of the pie, just look at the Kappl/ Ischgl discussions that must be going on behind the scenes, I personally hope this never happens, it will spoil the wilderness areas in Malfontal and Rendl for ever. Just sayin'..........
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Re above, Pettneu is "in the party", or at least it was for the short time it was open last season.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Sitter, You can ski in Pettneu with an Arlberg pass? You sure? If i'm there for a day this winter.........IF its open.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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mountainaddict wrote: |
Quote: |
I can totally see why they don't want day trippers from Bregenz/ Germany using a cheap backdoor in. |
I can't. And the above shows that they seem happy enough to welcome the plebby daytrippers. |
As above it's about maintenance of the brand - it wouldn't be much good for Lech's premium positioning if the slopes were mobbed by the German equivalent of Jets jacket 'n Jeans every Sunday (although arguably adidas shellsuits would be more tasteful than some of the Bogner creations sold in Strolz).
You want to ski the Arlberg - you buy the Arlberg pass rather than the presumably cheaper Warth pass. The fact you get an extra perk on a multi day Warth pass (Lech extension) is no different to the French resorts that let you have 1 day out of 6 elsewhere.
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@ mountainaddict : i am really sorry.
English is not my mother-language and sometimes i want to say something, but the other people understand something else. My fault.
Except that i am learning Germans the last couple of years so sometimes i wright a mix from English - Germans.
So:
1. if you want to ski Warh, Lech , St.Anton etc., then you have to buy the Arlberg Skipass. There is not any other option. The Arlberg skipass give you the opportunity to visit Lech (when you start from Warth) from the first day. Or even for a half day (if its possible i dont know)
2. the other matter with over 2.5 days is for 3täller pass. But this is not an option. If you DONT want to ski in Arlberg (lech etc) then : if you buy a 1day ticket for Warth or 2 days then its only for Warth. But if you buy a tickert for OVER 2.5 days, then this skipass is for the whole Warth-Schröcken and 28 other resorts (but NOT Lech etc). I am not 100% sure, but if you buy a 3täller pass, you could buy a Arlberg ski pass for one day at the price of 32 (you have a discount). But i am not sure.
I think the best is to take the Arlberg skipass and enjoy the Warh - Lech & Zurs - St. Anton...
This concept with over 1,5 or 2,5 days like this with warth and the 3täller pas you will find it in many ski areas in Austria. e.g. In Zillertal, a 1 day ticket is only for one resort (e.g. Mayrhofen). But if you buy for 2 or more days is for the whole Zillertal.
@ Markymark29 : you have 100% right. Lech & Zürs were against the connections even with Warth. Sometimes i bother why the have the same pass with St. Anton. The want to offer such an "exclusive" service to their clients, and some times they over react. I dont remember exactly, but a couple of years ago , during Christmas holidays, the closed the road heading to Lech for two days. It was i think, before New Years Day and after Christmas. There were many one day visitors from the other areas, and they decided that the one - day visitors disturb their clients.
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Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much on Fri 15-08-14 16:37; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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Markymark29 wrote: |
Sitter, You can ski in Pettneu with an Arlberg pass? You sure? If i'm there for a day this winter.........IF its open. |
Yes, you could last season, and I believe it is the same again this coming season (the ski Arlberg website seems to imply this as it mentions Pettneu). Not that there is much there mind, just the gondola and a few drags.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Sitter wrote: |
. Not that there is much there mind, just the gondola and a few drags. |
Precisely
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Poster: A snowHead
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turms wrote: |
@ mountainaddict : i am really sorry.
I dont remember exactly, but a couple of years ago , during Christmas holidays, the closed the road heading to Lech for two days. It was i think, before New Years Day and after Christmas. There were many one day visitors from the other areas, and they decided that the one - day visitors disturb their clients.
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they just closed road due to the extreme snow conditions.
i waste one day in Pettneu for same reason (the road between Pettneu and St.Anton was closed)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think that times have got tougher, even for Lech and Zurs. When I started skiing there, 13 years ago, you would not see many, if any, tour buses. I got the feeling they were not encouraged. Different story now. The Robinson's end of the Zurs carpark is usually full of them. No longer so fussy?
From what was written on the Auenfeldjet Warth station, the only pass option to ski Lech, etc, is to buy an Arlberg ski pass.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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mountainaddict : i am really sorry. English is not my mother-language and sometimes i want to say something, but the other people understand something else. |
No apology needed Turms! No problem at all - I was just trying to clarify things. And your English is excellent by the way .
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There is a much wider picture than some folk might not realise.
The Towns/Villages have there own Agendas then You have the Lift Company's. in this case it is the Arlberger Bergbahnen which is an Operating & Maintenance Company who run the lifts on behalf of the Owners. Many of the lifts for example in St Anton are owned by a an investment company in Vienna & some are owned by a wealthy Jewish Family. It is pretty much the same for Lech & Zurs.
Obviously if your sitting in Vienna or Monaco & have invested (Ex. €28M for Galzigbahn) in a lift you do not want it to become redundant you would want your lift to be maxed out.
I think when Rendl/Kappl is linked up, all the Kappl area lifts will come under the Arlberger Bergbahnen.
My point here is that when the Rendl/Kappl link is opened Kappl is going to find its slopes & lifts empty most of the day why folk head over to St Anton & beyond.
At the moment I dont think there is any interest from Arlberger to take on/over Pettneu because those lifts are basically owned by the Doppelmayer & the Banks.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I havent read all of the thread .. but if you rent a car you would have to stay in the Bregenzertal .. which is not bad.
If your going just for a week you could visit the small resorts down the valley
Try Shoppernau for half a day and then move on to Bizau if you get bored.
There is Millau ... (I don't like that one)
My favourite is Damuuls which is certainly worth a sunny day.
You'll find it a completely different experience from the Arlberg which is great ... but dont try and go too far.
I'd spend a day going into Lech then around to Zurs and then down to Zug and then back up the Rote Wand and back to Lech and Warth again.
I haven't been there for a few years ... but don't try and do the whole of Austria in a week ... it takes a long season!
If you really want to do the Arlberg justice ... then have your holiday in the Arlberg.
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Cheers DrLawn. Friedrichshafen flights just booked and planning ongoing. I've sussed out that there is certainly plenty to go at and yes, the plan is to hire a car and stay in Bregenzertal. Places like Schoppernau and Bezau are loads cheaper than Warth for accommodation so I'm looking at apartments there. Really looking forward to it as we love trying out new places - especially ones that are virtually unknown in the UK.
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mountainaddict, nice one, you'll enjoy it, I agree there's some brilliant places to explore well away from the major resorts that UK tour operators advertise. Get polishing up your German language, you'll need it!
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This winter i am also thinking of buying the 3täller pass.
The pass includes a few good ski resorts nicht so well known.
Damüls
Warth-Schröcken
Diedamskopf
Golm und Gargellen (from Montafon area...a little bit further)
Brandnertal
Sonnenkopf (which is also in Arlberg ski pass include)
So there are 7 resorts which are pretty good and many other smaller (Laterns, Hochhäderich etc)
For 400 euro is a good deal. And also you have a discount in Ski Arlberg Pass (32 Euro a day pass)
So mountainaddict maybe we will meet each other....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Quote: |
there's some brilliant places to explore well away from the major resorts that UK tour operators advertise. Get polishing up your German language, you'll need it! |
Great! I'll look forward to that - I can get by at conversational level and find that a week (or even a few days) in non-English speaking resorts improves my Deutsch no end.
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Damüls;Warth-Schröcken; Diedamskopf; Golm und Gargellen (from Montafon area...a little bit further); Brandnertal; Sonnenkopf (which is also in Arlberg ski pass include). So there are 7 resorts which are pretty good and many other smaller (Laterns, Hochhäderich etc) |
Cheers! We've previously skied at Sonnenkopf + the Montafon area but are really looking forward to trying out some new ski resorts.
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mountainaddict, We're staying in St Anton at the moment and today was a bad weather day so we took the car out and drove down from Warth through the Bregenzerwald to Bludenz and then a large loop up through Montafon and over Silvretta to Ischgl and back to Arlberg.......epic views and the Bregenzerwald villages are so great, and the countryside up around Warth/ Schroeken down to Mellau, Damuls and Faschina is particularly stunning, refreshed my thoughts to visit in winter. Damuls and Oberdamuls is where I'd choose to base myself, Au is too low IMO and travelling would be a pain I reckon. There's loads of hotels construction going on in Damuls and it looks like investment is increasing to grow in pace, couldn't see much going on re new lifts infrastructure..........looks great though.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Cheers Markymark29! The updated position is that we've booked a very nice-looking, self-catering apartment in Bezau for a week. We'll have a hire car and are aiming to spend some time at Damuls/Mellau; Diedamskopf; and Warth/Schroeken. All being well, we should get a half day in on arrival day (possibly at one of the smaller areas, en route from Friedrichshafen). If there is anywhere to ski within about 45 mins. of the airport, we're also toying with the idea of skiing for an hour or so on our departure day on the way back to Friedrichshafen - so hopefully skiing on 8 days.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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mountainaddict, Au, if there's the snow. If there's no snow, have a great lunch.
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mountainaddict, don't forget to stock up with Kaese at the cheese place in Au, great! You'll love Bregenzerwald.
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