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Resort ratings/reviews database

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Does anyone know of any good user-based online resort rating/review databases out there? I know places like teletext holidays, ifyouski, igluski etc have their own reviews but their ratings vary wildly. What I'm interested in is what people really thought of the places they went to - maybe even down to accommodation level ultimately.

If anyone doesn't know of such a thing, I am interested in building one myself where people can enter their ratings and reviews - entirely a selfish venture as it will give me a better idea of places to look at. No good this year as it will probably take 6 months or more to put together.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
ken_1969, not sure if you'll find a good one that is user based, because you would be relying on users who maybe have only skiied one resort, or a couple, then telling you that resort is the best in the world. i.e. it would be VERY subjective!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
You could try these two:

http://resorts.outdoorreview.com/

http://www.rsn.com/search/welcome.html?page=resort_info
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To be honest, I agree with WTFH here. I think you're unlikely to be able to create or find a site with anything like the same validity/usefulness as the Where to Ski and Snowboard book. I've skied for a long time and gone to lots of places, but half of the places I've been to were just for a day or a week, and the ratings would only be a snapshot, coloured massively by the snow conditions on the day and who I was skiing with etc. IMO you'd need several years, and several thousand reports of several hundred resorts for the data to be meaningful - why bother when the book's already there?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
The Where to Ski and Snowboard book has it's uses but I must say it is very subjective as well ... some of their reviews on resorts I know well, I have disagreed with substanially on a number of issues or their whole feel of the place.

They even went so far as to recommend people not use a particular ski school when apparently this was based on a dispute with one client .. a mate of mine has used the ski school in question subsequently for his kids and found them perfectly fine. Very dodgy standards of journalism if you ask me.
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It's very subjective, as you can see on this site as well. If you take Val d'Isere, which is pretty generally accepted as not being particularly good for beginners, you'll hear from people who had a fantastic first week there, right through to those who had an absolute nightmare with beginners.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
The ratings I created for my database were initially used by IfYouSki in the late 90s and (If I understood it rightly) were then added to by ratings given by users. However it didn't work terribly well as you ended up with all ratings coming around Average on a scale of 1 to 5 stars. After 100 people had commented it might change from 3 stars to 3.23 stars or 2.87 stars but in most cases the effect of having lots of people commenting was to get a middling stat/rating.

I've been doing these ratings for 20 years now and don't think there's an easy answer. As others have pointed out it would take years of compilation and/or a sudden influx of people wanting to rate resorts for you in the thousand to generate the stats, and my bet is they would average three stars. Some would have great experiences and give five, others crappy and give 1.

Then there's defining exactly WHAT it is you're rating and what are you comparing it to. Don't get me started...

RSN (which is built from www.goski.com, established ten years, worldwide reach - comments from people all over) doesn't rate but is a good source for user comment and a place to find comments on resorts not considered mainstream enough for much coverage in the mainstream guides.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
snowhunter, welcome to snowheads, you're right, user ratings are highly subjective but if you see that 80 out of 100 reviews slate a particular aspect of a resort then that's a pretty strong steer.
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Absolutely. Just that in most cases where things aren't especially good or bad you'll just end up with bland averages. Perhaps it was a bit more sophisticated so that a 3.55 average rating generated 4 stars and a 3.45 = 3 stars it would offer a bit more definition.

A comparison might be made with the DVD mail order rental Screen Select where hundreds of users do rate movies. Most get a middle rating based on a 2 to 4 star rating by viewers averaged out. Controversial films may be given one star by a viewer who "didn't get it" and a rave five star by one who thought it was fantastic - the result is still three stars.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Welcome to snowHeads, snowhunter snowHead

I wonder if it's possible to do an Amazon style "recommendations" thing for ski resorts? Doesn't answer the original question...
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowhunter, Welcome to snowheads. You are right goski.com has really good reviews for all sorts of less well known resorts. I'm going to La Molina in Spain over New Year and they have about 20 comments from different people. I couldn't find any feedback elsewhere. I think the comments give you more of a feel for a place than the 5 point scale rating if not many people have given a rating.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
ken_1969, Try http://www.ifyouski.com find the resort you want and then go to "user ratings", at the end of the star chart there are comments by people who have stayed there. usually all positive though, but if you read between the lines, you can get an idea about the place ie, "buzzing bar in the hotel" means it's noisy! ... "great challenging runs everywhere" means it might be useless for beginners etc etc.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Can't agree with the comments about Where To Ski and Snowboard. I have always found it the most accurate publication available, and have had some cracking holidays based on it's reviews.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I don't think you can beat personal reviews, especially from people who actually live or spend a lot of time in the resorts. A lot of these holiday books and ski guides were written ages ago by people who haven't spent more than a few days in the resort so how would they know all the good and bad bits. We live in La Clusaz and it really pisses me off that it gets sucha low rating for being such a low resort when the snow actually stays better and longer here than other resorts, becuaes of the way the mountains and valleys are faced and situated. Just cos it's lower than the big resorts it doesn't mean it's worse - far from it!
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
graviteski, Well said - there is a lot of rubbish talked around ski resorts. Where one skis and where one has an affinity is important, So long as ski conditions are OK everywhere is OK. One builds up a liking for a resort on other less tangible things, like atmosphere, ambience, being part of the community etc. ad nauseam, We are big fans of Nendaz in Valais, not because it's a great ski-ing area but because we are comfortable with the ambience of the village, and we have got to know some of the shopkeepers and business people who help make the place click.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Well said DAVID , Couldnt agree more. La Rosiere fits that bill for me, and La Clusaz is on my must do list for exactly the same reasons. It is also explains why I am not overly keen on returning to Val D'Isere
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
But how can you rate a resort, if you have nothing, or very little to rate it against?
I mean, if you've only been to three resorts, do you say one is 5 star, one is 3 and one is 1? So you call your top resort 5 star, someone else goes, rates it 1 star, but goes somewhere else, and gives that place a higher rating. Does that mean it is better than your 1 star resort, or just that they have been to other places.
I've no problem reading reviews from people who know one resort very well, but I'd take their rating with an extreme pinch of salt if they haven't been to many other resorts.

"This is the best car I've ever driven, I give it 10/10"
"It's the ONLY car you've ever driven"
"Yes, so it is the best"

It doesn't quite work in terms of providing a good global rating.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Wear The Fox Hat, Couldnt agree more in that those who have visited many resorts are better placed to give comparative ratings, However you would probably rate a resort differently to me as what is important to you in a resort will most probably be different. e.g The opportunity for off piste powder will be high on your list but none existant on mine. Vice-versa for piste grooming.

DAVID SNELL wrote, stuff that relates to my feelings on ski resorts, wheras these may not be important to you.
e.g most on here that did a top 5 resort poll included Chamonix &/or Val D'Isere. I would not "choose" to visit either again. Whatever floats your boat is good.
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 You need to Login to know who's really who.
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It is a fairly daunting prospect but I think there is definitely a benefit to a very customised resort review database.

Here is what i had in mind.

Firstly you need to establish a profile of the person submitting the review - sex, age, experience - first timer, second timer, experienced, how many resorts have they been to etc. Then find out what they used to get around the mountain (ski, board, blade), what they believe their level of competence to be - blue runs, red runs, blacks, off-piste etc. Then they enter the date of their trip and submit their review for the relevant location including all the relevant questions - the resort itself, apres, snow conditions, lifts / queues, number/quality/difficulty of pistes, were pistes correctly graded etc etc. Also can cover price/value for money questions on accommodation, food, ski/boot/board hire etc.

This will provide a very customised profile of the resort at the time of year they went.

The more detail you can capture the more useful the reviews and ratings will be. For example, when recording reviews from beginners it would be very useful to find out their fitness level. From my experience, fitness plays a very big part in how much you enjoy and get out of your first year of skiing. When someone is then looking at reviews you can positively weight the reviews of people at the same sort of fitness level as themselves.

When someone wants to look up a resort, they enter their own details, their fitness/experience level, and when they are planning to go. The initial ratings they see will be primarily based on the comments and ratings of people who were in the same scenario travelling at the same point in the season, ignoring other ratings. This removes some of the issues of subjectivity that are of course based on experience and time of year, and would give a much more accurate idea of the resort at any given point in the season.

You can also give more weight to ratings of people who have travelled to more resorts.

If you want to see ratings based on people at different experience levels (for example if they are travelling with more/less experienced skiers) you would be able to do so. Also if, like me, you often travel with a mixed group and want to find the ideal resort for that time of year you could compile a group rating taking into account all the reviews from across each of the matching experience level profiles.

From a database level that is all simple enough to do. I think the biggest problem is getting people to fill out enough questions that you can correctly profile them and the resorts. And of course finding a way to capture enough skiers reviews to make the ratings useful and relevant.

Certainly something worth considering - I think a more comprehensive review database like this would overcome the limitations of other more subjective review systems. As has been said, there is no substitute for personal experience.

If something like this hasn't been done then it would definitely be an interesting little project (little? yeah right! Laughing). Thanks to everyone for their comments so far. I will do some research by looking at the other reviews/sites mentioned to see if I can identify any more gaps in the reviews available.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I still think the best interactive DB is this forum..!!
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 You'll need to Register first of course.
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Totally agree that user ratings are so subjective as to be meaningless unless you know how a person skis and what's important to them - Taking US as an example I'd rate Mt Baker as a 10 and Breckenridge say as a 5, someone for whom nightlife , on slope appartments and grooming are priorities would definitely rate the other way round.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
All ratings - reviews, as well as user ratings - are subjective by definition aren't they? That doesn't mean they are useless or meaningless. You just need to profile people making the reviews and you've suggested a couple of other points that are useful in a profile - what an individual's priorities are. Again by weighting reviews so you give prominence to people with similar priorities you can give a more useful review.

Not going to criticise this forum but surely it will be be just as subjective as a database, and what it can't give you is a very quick summary of hundreds of resorts based on specific requirements/criteria. I'm not sure how many users are on here at any given time but unless a person with similar ski priorities as you and similar experience is around when you ask a question you are going to get answers that could be equally useless as an online review.
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