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Two Bindings, One Ski

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
You’ll be please to know this is not about a skiing remake of one of the most horrifying viral videos ever…

I am purchasing a Dynastar Cham HM 97 (184cm) for inbounds and touring. It probably won’t get a run out for touring this year, but will see plenty of lift-accessed action. I want to eventually put tech bindings on it, but want alpine bindings for non-touring days. (I have boots with interchangeable tech and alpine soles so no issues with compatibility).

I assume this can be achieved with inserts? If so, are there any two bindings (one alpine, one tech) which have drill patterns that will minimise the ‘overlap’ i.e. put the holes as far away from one another as possible, without needing to dramatically vary the mounting point?

Thanks!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
You can download binding templates from quiverkiller (and probably other sites if you google ski binding templates)

Print them out, line them up and see how close the holes are.

You don't need much distance between holes with quiver killers.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
If he doesn't appear in this thread to answer you drop Spyderjon a private message on here, if anyone knows what will work for this he will!
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Good source of templates here http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/153971-Binding-Mount-Paper-Templates

Always check the printer scaling, and don't rely on the templates being 100% correct all the time (my Plum/Dynafit template was marginally out when checked against the binding itself)
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Thanks guys.

Flaine skier, I downloaded some of those templates from TGR, only problem is (and I'm sure I'm being daft) I can't work out how they work. I don't know how to work out what distance apart the heel and toe sheets should be. Any ideas?
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ScottyGBR, Why? Modern 'tech' bindings are immensely strong and ski as strongly as alpine especially if they have an optional mid-sole support (usually supplied for skiing them in a bellows boot).
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Masque, I appreciate they are better than they used to be. Is there any reason why you wouldn't use a downhill binding if you could though? Realistically these skis will see 10 days touring a year and maybe 25 days alpine, so why ride around on tech bindings with sub-standard elasticity and no rotational toe release when you don't have to?
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
ScottyGBR, A bunch of today's touring bindings have elasticity to equal alpine and I'm pretty sure (stand to be corrected) excellent rotational release. I'm not trying to argue your choice away, just a bit curious about it.
Though I'm hardly one to criticise, my G3 Onyx have a TTS tele conversion on the way Embarassed
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
ScottyGBR, That's why I went for the heavier Tracker/Guardian binding, compromised a bit on the touring side but easily strong enough for alpine. Boot sole compatibility may be an issue if using an AT rockered sole in them though.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Dynaduke plates ?
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
+1

http://bindingfreedom.com/Plates_c2.htm
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
ScottyGBR, The templates have a series of lines for sole length.

If your sole length is 320 then line up the 320 line on the toe piece with the 320 line on the heel piece.

fwiw I have tyrolia peak 12 and Fritschi freeride pro on the same ski.

If you get the Quiver Killers from Jons ski tuning he'll advice about bindings and send the correct templates and screws for you with the inserts (or if you are near Nottingham take the ski's in and he'll do the mounting for you).
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I have Dynafit TLT Speeds and Barons on my EHP's, no problems with overlap.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Avalanche Poodle, DB, altis, these are all relatively heavy options, I have Armada JJs with Dukes for sidecountry/day touring but looking for a lighter option i.e. tech bindings for hut-to-hut touring.

Flaine skier, thanks, that make sense. I'll be sure to give Jon a buzz, I assumed he would have weighed in by now on this thread.

Masque, sorry my post comes off as defensive which isn't what I intended. Given this is my first foray into tech bindings I wouldn't be comfortable on a standard/light touring set for in bounds so would end up with a heavier (and more expensive) tech binding (Beast/Yak etc). With this approach I get the skis I need with a cheap(er) alpine binding and with the ability to add a light touring tech binding (potentially without a brake) for tour only days. I know that people ski light, no brake tech bindings in bounds but I wonder if they had the option (which is only relatively new) if they would take it?
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
ScottyGBR, you're not being defensive, I'm an early adopter too and going down a very odd rabbit hole with my setup. I'm prepared to use a (very) slightly heavier setup as it will contribute to my fitness training and I will not be doing 40K day trips . . . you have to realise that there is a 'certain' level of willy waving in having the lightest setup wink

Just go with what feels right for you. Toofy Grin
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
ScottyGBR wrote:
Avalanche Poodle, DB, altis, these are all relatively heavy options, I have Armada JJs with Dukes for sidecountry/day touring but looking for a lighter option i.e. tech bindings for hut-to-hut touring.


Yes 130g per ski and +7mm stack height isn't ideal but you do end up with less holes in the ski.

Quote:
These plates add about 130grams per ski, and 7mm of stack height to your bindings. They are specifically designed to minimize the effect on the flex pattern of the ski. The wide mounting pattern is designed to maximize torsional stiffness even on the widest of new-school skis.


http://www.bindingfreedom.com/MarkerFit-Swap-Plates-NEW-1005.htm
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
ScottyGBR, Vist Free alpine bindings & Dynafit Radicals work great as a dual mount with inserts. Duke/Baron/F12/F10 (non EPF) also work very well for most people with Radicals as the rearmost holes can usually be shared (although it does need checking with your specific BSL before you commit) with the added benefit of giving you a tour mode from day one.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Thanks all for your advice on this.

After sifting through the templates it looks like the hole patterns for most alpine bindings (particularly for the toe piece) would 'clash' with Dynafits or Plums. For reference clash is defined by the Quiver Killers guys as 15mm or less between the hole centres.

The Duke/Baron/F12/F10 drill pattern appears much more suitable as the fore and aft pairs of holes on both the toe and heel pieces are spaced further apart than on alpine bindings, meaning they are much less likely to clash. I guess a few of you were pointing me in this direction, so thanks for the heads-up!

I decided to save some pennies and share the Dukes I already have on my JJs, so now just need to install Quiver Killers on both sets of skis. spyderjon I would much prefer you to do this than me, however I'm nowhere near Nottingham so this will have to be a DIY job - I'll be in touch shortly to order the parts from you.

I'm thinking about getting the Dukes mounted on the new skis by a shop then just doing the QK install (to minimise risk of cock-up). Does this sound like a plan? Or does anyone know a shop in London that will do the QK install?
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ScottyGBR, Fraser Shand at 47 Degrees will install QK's for you. Don't let your new ski supplier drill your skis for the Dukes just in case the mounting position needs tweaking slightly to accommodate both mounts. And hopefully your existing Dukes are the regular width & NOT the EPF width as the rear Dyna holes match the rear Marker non EPF holes for most BSL's - I specifically stock this width of Markers to best accommodate dual mounts with Dynafits. If you let me know your BSL & whether your existing Dukes are small or large size & I can advise the best solution.

I can do a good deal of the Rads as well wink
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
ScottyGBR, It doesn't take that long London to Nottingham on the train!
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spyderjon, my BSL is 327mm using the large dukes (non EPF); what might need to be altered? Thanks for the heads-up on the QK install; I put an order in on your website last night for the QKs and install kit, and managed to borrow a drill guide so should be good for the DIY install now.

Will be in touch re: Rads but unlikely to need them this season.
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