 Poster: A snowHead
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philwig, and how, precisely, do you "deal with" an incompetent/drunk/out-of-control (delete as appropriate) skier or boarder who smashes into you from behind, breaks most of your ribs in the process, and then disappears leaving you lying semi-conscious on the ground? That's what happened to my brother-in-law. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I do think there is a flip side to this argument also.... as with driving, people who ski far too slowly can be just as dangerous as those who ski fast. I dont think people who have barely progressed past a snow plow should be allowed on red or black pistes. I find it extremely annoying that when you find yourself crusing at a nice speed down a red run you get held up by a pair of old women who are quite clearly attempting to ski a piste above their ability.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| philwig wrote: |
| You can whine on about people being incompetent and drunk at resorts. Alternatively you can change your own behaviour so you aren't affected by those things. |
There are numpties who ski too fast for their competence. Several  s have been taken out from behind by them. What is your method of avoiding that risk? Simply to ski faster than the numpties do?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| philwig wrote: |
| Personally, I'm responsible for my own safety, so I deal with incompetence and drunkenness at resorts because they are there. |
Complacent much?
I was skiing at a pretty average speed down a red that was entirely within my capabilities when an out of control pillock crashed into me at speed from behind. He did have the decency to stop until I skied away some minutes later, which fortunately I was able to do.
Now explain to me please how I might have avoided that. Hasn't happened to you? Well I've been skiing for 45 years, on and off, and up to that point it hadn't happened to me either.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Only 2 options. Either ski faster than anyone else on the piste or stay in the fun snow away from them 
Actually there is a third, be the last person down.
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While all this delightful debate is going on, it's enlightening to actually go back to the original report from Medecins de Montagne, here, http://www.mdem.org/telecharger-document.php?sid=&idfichier=480&codej=france&page=STATISTIQUE&idapplication=page
The graph on page one shows quite clearly that the occurrence of skiers' accidents requiring a doctor's intervention has remained broadly stable around 2.5/1000 skier days since the start of their series in 1999. Snowboarder stats are rather more volatile. I wouldn't like to speculate why.
Collisions at 12.5% and head injuries have increased slightly over the last 10 years.
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Just back from Val d'Isere - I only skied for 4 days but saw more injured people being ferried around than ever before. They mostly seemed to be children. The thing with statistics is that the conditions vary so much. We have less snow this year, so more people in the higher-up resorts - Val was rammed and the locals said they'd never seen it so full; there's a lot of ice around. I felt there were a lot of inexperienced skiers around hurling themselves down the slopes - the Plan was a nightmare. Best time to ski was early on New Year's Day!
I'm planning never to be there in that week ever again - I only went because I was invited.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
| Resorts, he says, have become more adept at “grooming” the snow, meaning there are fewer broken legs caused by tripping over obstacles. However, this improvement has had unintended consequences. “Now everything is very flat, not very good skiers are still able to ski very fast,” he explains. “They are not able to control their speed, and so we have more collisions. |
The piece seems very France-centric - I would contend that the Swiss resorts with which I am familiar are far less brutal with the grooming, so there are far more bumps and rollers on the pistes. None of the wide flat motorways that are so common in France - and the natural terrain then tends to slow people down.
There are a lot of inconsiderate people around everywhere, but on the slopes, the ones I find the worst are the young racers. Just because they can ski like demigods, they forget that other people are less experienced or skilled.
I seem to have a strange attraction for other skiers and have been hit far more than I think is my fair share 
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eng_ch, good point about Swiss slopes; same for N. America.
I'm surprised by the racers though - because their skill levels are excellent - I've seen young racers react in an instant to avoid dangerous situations.
Teenage holidaymakers who go fast - because it's dead easy - but have no/low skills worry me much more.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
I've seen young racers react in an instant to avoid dangerous situations
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Yes, but to the person they are going past or a third party looking on they appear too close and do scare people. As a parent of a young racer, I have had to remind him of this on occasion.
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skitow, beequin, +1 I agree, they don't always promote the confidence in their safe skiing that their skills would suggest they should have.
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You know it makes sense.
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Personal experience of one, so not very scientific but: I believe the best groomed slopes I've ever skied on are in the Dolomites, and in the five years I've been going there I haven't seen an accident.
I think the next best are Austria, and whilst I have seen accidents there (specifically Sölden), they have been caused by young Dutch or German men who for some unknown reason believe they can ski safely whilst being completely w-nkered - and I mean falling over drunk.
Only ever been to Switzerland twice so can't really comment, but by far the most accidents I have witnessed have been in France, including both my daughter and ex-wife (not that concerned about the latter obviously )being wiped out by boy racers hitting them from behind. It was why I stopped going to France.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Anyone ever seen a race club member in collision with a member of the general public? I really don't think these are the peeps to be scared of.
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Poster: A snowHead
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laundryman, who would know when they're in plain clothes so to speak But certainly not when they're in class - whenever and wherever I've seen them the piste has been sectioned off. However I agree with gist of your point, it's the hooray Henry, Henri, Heinrich and Enrico types that are typically what we should watch out for.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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mozwold, I've seen groups free skiing and competitors warming up on runs adjacent to the track. I'm always impressed (envious, really) by their speed and control.
Bloody Henrys get everywhere! 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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laundryman, skiing down a busy(ish) blue including several ski school crocodiles into Les Gets the other day I was in awe of the LG junior race team, I'm guessing 9 -12 year olds who descended through the melee like a red sea across the full width of the piste. They were carrying considerably more speed than anyone else, flicking left to right, jabbing in split second snow ploughs, bouncing across the bumps and ruts and at no time appeared to present any danger to themselves or others. Whoosh and they were gone!
This was after my 10 year old who for a Brit punter skier is progressing well for his age and experience but isn't quite as good as he perhaps thinks he is had watched them GS training earlier and was really quite gutted about the difference in standard!! 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| laundryman wrote: |
| Anyone ever seen a race club member in collision with a member of the general public? I really don't think these are the peeps to be scared of. |
IIRC Touretteski was taken out (as in blood-wagoned off the mountain) by a young French racer while she (Touretteski) was stationary in a lift queue at the 2011 PSB.
The Swiss champs were being held in Laax at the beginning of December when we were there and the racers were totally inconsiderate and seemed to believe that the public pistes were still their race courses and using everyone else as moving slalom poles. I very nearly had a word with their trainers. The M25 is not an extension of Brands Hatch.
It's not all about whether you are good enough to avoid a collision but if your skiing is such that you scare someone else less experienced or skilled, you could cause them to act unpredictably - and then it's all the more difficult to avoid them.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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