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Hmmm.... this is going to be fun .... xenophobia and driving habits

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
...a few threads have mentioned people who are unable to drive in the snow, and who tend towards the middle of the road when conditons deteriorate.

Over the last few weeks I have had some 'interesting' moments on mountain roads as I make my way carefully around the hills in CH - on Nokian WRD3s BTW - very very good, much better than the Pirelli Snow Controls we have used for the past decade. These moments consist of having to take rapid evasive action as others try to use ALL the road for making their way.

One was Swiss (but there is a bit of a CH tendency towards crossing onto the other lane on hairpins), and all the others Belgian. Odd, I thought. Then I found this....

WIK
Other countries in Europe also introduced driving tests during the twentieth century, the last of them being Belgium where, until 1977, it was possible to purchase and hold a license without having to undergo a driving test.

Yikes.
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I find Italians most frustrating. For a nation that genuinely loves motor cars, and has, and continues to produce some of the most beautiful, the average driver can't drive.
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Quote:

Other countries in Europe also introduced driving tests during the twentieth century, the last of them being Belgium where, until 1977, it was possible to purchase and hold a license without having to undergo a driving test.

Yikes.


I lived there for a couple of months and yes even though they are miles from the Med most of them drive like their Latin cousins.
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Belgians. Terrible drivers

Italians- no respect for lanes

France 74 - must travel along mountain roads no slower than 70mph at all times. Will drive so close behind you that you feel you should have been bought dinner
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I think every nation has it's fair share of tw@ts on the the road, including those in the UK who believe the Laws of Physics don't apply to them when driving on ice
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Brits - cruise in overtaking lanes on motorways and head up mountains in expensive looking SUVs with summer tyres wink
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Quote:

I find Italians most frustrating. For a nation that genuinely loves motor cars, and has, and continues to produce some of the most beautiful, the average driver can't drive.

Can't agree. I spent two months driving about Italy last summer and found the whole thing a joy. Proper lane discipline, indicators, no mincing about the middle fo the road at zero miles an hour. Pleasant surprise. They do have an alarming habit of zipping in and out at top speed, but that kind of suits me anyway.
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Best place I have ever driven is Iceland; empty roads, courteous drivers, excellent signposting, roads surfaced with lava which seems very grippy. Worst place by far is Turkey; very busy roads, some very poor excuses for vehicles, terrible standard of driving, people wandering about trying to prise your windows open to sell you some tat, potholes the size of moon craters...
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Encountered too many speeding (but cr@p) Belgians for it not to be true Toofy Grin
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I find people with no lane discipline or who don't indicate the worst. Lane 2 or 3 hoggers need a kick. That and people who don't drive according to conditions or those that do 45mph in a 60 and then 45 in a 30 restricted zone.

Haven't as yet found a particular nationality that is the worst but do find French driving particularly good in general on the RM and autoroutes.
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When we drive in France I find the French to be very good. Belgians are by far the worst (some bordering on downright dangerous) and as @bleudegex, points out above it is usually the Brits doggedly remaining in the overtaking lanes.
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@Lizzard, which bit of Italy? There are immense regional differences, with a general deterioration as you head south.
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@ansta1, I agree about French driving - though lorries sometimes trawl two a breast up hills on two lane autoroute which causes tail backs and you get the feeling they enjoy it Toofy Grin In general there is a tendency to nip into tight spots when overtaking but once you know that its ok.
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OK I'll bite - In Cham, Genevois have no respect for the speedlimit or anyone else, Belgians are just bloody dangerous, but at least they are generaly slow. Smaller, gerneraly older 74 plated vehicles are always in a hurry but that is to be expected. Vistiing brits are either completly incomptent, big Soft roader summer tyres and generaly stuck, or super nerdy over prepared. Once saw a Discoevery on Snow tires and Chains driving in low range with the center diff locked in 2 inches of slush.....he was terified Wink

The realy scary ones are the non alpine truck drivers comming down from the Tunnel, I meet them at the last les houches exit, heading down valley, just were it gets twisity. The limit goes form 90kph to 70kph for cars and 50kph for trucks, they don't drop any speed until they see the viaduct towers comming at them and then they brake hard and change into the fast lane to avoid going splat, but squashing or scaring the poo-poo out whoever in in the inside lane. Seen eveidence of plenty of acidents at this particular place, but never once seen the Gendarms out with their portable camera Sad
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I have to agree the Belgians are scarily bad at driving in general in any conditions.

It is definitely a Brit disease where lane hogging is concerned. It's a shame vehicles don't have shock collars fitted for all those too retarded to manage good lane discipline. Cruise control has made it noticeably worse as those who used to pay attention to maintaining speed now vacantly cruise whilst lane hogging.
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@Gmd, imesho, if you can't safely have cruise control on and be in the inside lane, you shouldn't have cc on.

@Idris, we've seen a couple of artics smear themselves around the concrete hairpin.

Talking TIR, just because you drive a big truck for a living doesn't make you smart enough to talk on your mobile at the same time, nor immune from falling asleep.
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Belgians - - that explains a lot! When will they introduce driving tests for Belgian truck drivers as well Puzzled
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Lizzard wrote:
Quote:

I find Italians most frustrating. For a nation that genuinely loves motor cars, and has, and continues to produce some of the most beautiful, the average driver can't drive.

Can't agree. I spent two months driving about Italy last summer and found the whole thing a joy. Proper lane discipline, indicators, no mincing about the middle fo the road at zero miles an hour. Pleasant surprise. They do have an alarming habit of zipping in and out at top speed, but that kind of suits me anyway.


I am with Lizzard, Northern Italians and Germans (unable to comment on South) the best I have come across. I lived in Belgium for four years and they could be very dangerous and had a very high road toll per capita to go with it.

Australia possibly the most retarded. Ridiculously low speed limit have resulted in a population of drivers with sloth like anticipation and thought process.
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Belgians... seem to love fondling my ass

Italy varies a lot. Turin, Brenner and Rome totally different.

Prius drivers (at least round here) have a speedo calibrated to have numbers 2x as high as other cars. Especially the one at work that actually drives so slowly, I can't follow him round the car park in 1st without dipping the clutch, or waiting for him to creep halfway along one side of the multistorey.
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@Juddernaut, nah. We drive Geneva-Champoluc ~ 8 times a year and the stretch from the tunnel to Verres is like wacky races. Plus the Italian habit of screaming past, then getting a phone call, diving in front of you, wobbling alarmingly and suddenly slowing from 150 tp 80. Interrupting my carefully set cruise of 145.

Once you're on the mountain road it just gets more fun.

And as for the autostrada from Alexandria to Genoa, it would turn you grey.
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And don't get me started on Naples.

Or Rome.
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the Rome GRA in rush hour is an experience
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I have driven across northern Italy a fair number of times, I doubt every bad driver was up from the south, why can't they stay between the white lines ?

On mountain roads, having them overtake you when you slow down in a town then hold you up for the rest of the journey is fun too.

I have friends from Rome and Naples, they are just as bad.
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@rjs, my wife is half -Italian (Aosta valley) and agrees with me. She's a good driver however snowHead
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And I thought this thread was going to be about the Russians and their 'sex disorders'!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30735673
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Quote:

Belgians... seem to love fondling my ass

You should not have you donkey on the motorway. It reminds me of driving around the motorways of Lahore and find an ass pulling a cart in the outside lane.
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Anyone else have expereince of Moscow traffic/drivers?

It's another level. In fact another couple of levels Skullie
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It is definitely the older Belgies who are the worst; I thought it was 1983 that they started tests there. Top of the range Audis (no surprise there) Beemers , and Mercs are their weapons of choice, normally found one or two meters from your rear bumper at any speed from 70 upwards. I blame the eu for giving them the money to buy such cars in the first place !!
.... And I wasn't hogging the outside lane whenever they have done this to me !
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

Anyone else have expereince of Moscow traffic/drivers?

err yes

the traffic light junctions were "interesting"...

creep forwards when light is red, creep a bit more, creep right thru people crossing, creep a bit more in to the traffic going across, sod it, nearly hafl way, so may as well carry right on

have a photo somewhere with about 8 lanes worth of cars all trying to get as close as possible to the red light... in what would be marked as about 3-4 lanes in EU.

and when you see a Moscow ambulance... you drive really carefully, because you really don't want to need their services.

and the main road in/out of town, where the police park in the middle to stop cars overtaking on the wrong side... the cars just go round the police cars even more on the wrong side

safest place by far is a school bus. by a long way. nobody messes with school buses, since school kids are the future of the nation.

(that's my experience anyway)
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@andy, bonkers innit? How can a nation who put the first man in space not even have the wit to use box junctions or lane markings? Stupid and inexplicable

3 hours last time for the 25 miles from Paveletskaya to Sheremetyevo airport in the middle of the afternoon and that was with a cab driver who would just drive round any queue and then cut in at the last moment and if anyone argued he was straight out of the cab to 'discuss the matter' with them.
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 Poster: A snowHead
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got pulled for doing 130 in a Lada, in the middle of frickin nowhere too, because it was a patch of road officially part of a village (but that was like 2 km away from the road, but because there was the village name sign, the unrestricted road becomes 50 km/h limit).

$10... oh that'll do nicely sir, drive safely (roffle. in Russia!)
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in-car-entertainment Moscow style. Keeps the driver occupied during those loooong gridlock sessions

[/img]
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Maybe the state of Belgium roads accountant for their irractic driving.the number of potholes and craters means you are always using the whole road.
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red 27 wrote:
Anyone else have expereince of Moscow traffic/drivers?

It's another level. In fact another couple of levels Skullie


It's mental, the official taxi drivers are mental and I thought I was going to die!

Felt safer with the unofficial taxis, they did actually want to go home.
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Belgians are lovely people. Unfortunately, they turn into maniacs when they are behind the wheel of a car. It's nothing to do with the roads, they are just undisciplined, mental idiots as drivers. Italians/Greeks are at least predictable some of the time and have a good concept of the size of their car and their capabilities. Interestingly, it takes up to 2 years to get a driving licence here and it's a tough test. I've given up wondering why every time I go out, I come across insane behaviour and just expect everyone to do the silliest thing possible, whilst always on the phone of course.
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@cstreat, There aren't a lot of high value cars on the road in Belgium. Road tax is staggeringly high for expensive vehicles and insurance is silly money. Tax is relative to value, emissions and BHP. Most Belgians also pay 55% tax and social security on their income.
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As a rule of thumb the quality of driving is usually inversely proportional to how religious and area is. 'If today's my day to go' philosophy. I believe this is particularly true in the Himalayas say a prayer at the bottom of the mountain pass and then a prayer at the top and assume they can drive how the want but will be protected.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Quote:

find an ass pulling a cart in the outside lane.

I've overtaken gypsies on the motorway in Romania Shocked

I've driven through Belgium more times than I care to remember without incident, also found the French to be surprisingly courteous.

The scariest place I have ever driven by far is Barcelona, I've not tried Italy yet.
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This could be the Snowheads theme tune


http://youtube.com/v/kL1zs4OKYAU
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@musher, Barcelona is calm and courteous compared with Istanbul!
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