 Poster: A snowHead
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It seems now that annual insurance policies seem to be a moving feast with T&C & opaque pricing e.g. loading in cancellation cover and baggage cover after the base price so I thought I'd start one to see if there is any benefit from mutual research. Maybe I just need to call MPI?
My needs:
Worldwide multi trip
To cover "resort" off-piste without a guide - by my definition this would be accessible from lifts with max of moderate (1 hr) hike or skin, not a full day tour.
Trips up to 21 days in total (17 day cap on ski days in a single trip may be acceptable
No restriction on annual skiing days or at least a generous balance.
Not bothered about piste closure payouts or even equipment cover. Primarily my focus is medical and repatriation bens.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Look at the membership benefits you get with the AAC (Austrian Alpine club) as that provides you with insurance. Covers medical and repatriation, can't remember the length of stay allowance, I just know it's not enough for a full season, and covers off piste.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Also consider the BMC or Snowcard
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
loading in cancellation cover and baggage cover after the base price
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but that's exactly what you're looking for, isn't it - you need the essentials, keep the price down, not bother with piste close and equipment cover? I really like the policies where you can just buy what you want.
I've found Snowcard good - though to get unlimited days skiing you need to go up to their "Extreme Adventure" category; not exactly how I'd describe my genteel pottering around. 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Got mine with this lot yesterday:
http://www.fogginsure.co.uk
£126 yearly/multitrip for 17 days' skiing (inc. off-piste without guide, worldwide) for Mrs L and me - versus £176 for 21 days with SCGB.
They've got longer options too (up to 42 days, I think).
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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laundryman, does that mean only 17 days skiing, or trips of up to 17 days?
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Sitter, Was that relating to trips outside of Austria though? If you are based there for the season it may be a different matter.
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pam w, 17 days skiing (which can be in one or more trips).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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fatbob, another shout for Austrian Alpine Club
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Sitter, Avalanche Poodle,
I'm currently waiting for them to get back to me on length of stay, looks to me like 8 weeks max. Might have to wait till I get to Austria and join the Austrian local club.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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laundryman, I thought you were planning 3 ski trips?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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pam w, one of the three is 2 or 3 days' skiing tacked onto a business trip.
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You know it makes sense.
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Sitter, Avalanche Poodle, I have just received a reply fromm AAC uk, telling me I need to contact the insurer for durations in excess of 8 weeks. Looks like I need to start looking at insurance all over again or fly back to the UK for an hour to reset the clock on the policy!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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laundryman, Just a heads up when tagging days onto a trip.... with Snowcard the insurance has to start on the day you leave the UK and end the day you get back. e.g. if driving to the resort over 2 days (Fri/Sat) and start skiing on Sunday you have to have cover from the Friday - adds to the cost of a single trip policy, a weeks skiing is suddenlyu 9 or 10 days. So pleased I read the small print before taking out the policy for my March trip - if I hadn't added the driving days I would not have been covered for my injury (€5000)
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Poster: A snowHead
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holidayloverxx, thanks for the heads-up. I'll check that. For me it's rather complicated, as for my incidental (but hopefully incident-free) skiing, inbound/outbound travel and business days will be covered by my firm's business policy.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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You are still covered for rescue though, it is the paragraph 2 benefits which are under the 8 week limit. A difficult choice whether they are worth paying an excess for.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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holidayloverxx, Yes, yours was quite a complex one 
Did your costs come from a private or a contracted hospital? The info I have is below.
Hospital treatment
Outpatient treatment is free of charge if you are treated in a hospital that has a contract with the 'Gebietskrankenkasse'. If you are admitted as an inpatient, there will be a daily charge for the first 28 days in hospital. You will need a doctor’s referral.
If you are treated by a private hospital will be charged. You can claim back some of the treatment costs (maximum 80%) from the 'Gebietskrankenkasse'. The 20% is non-refundable in Austria but you may be able to seek reimbursement when you are back in the UK.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| laundryman wrote: |
| holidayloverxx, thanks for the heads-up. I'll check that. For me it's rather complicated, as for my incidental (but hopefully incident-free) skiing, inbound/outbound travel and business days will be covered by my firm's business policy. |
The point I was perhaps not making clear was that if I didn't cover the travel days with Snowcard I would not have been covered for the skiing days - as far as they are concerned the winter sports cover has to start on the day you travel from the UK. Like you I have other insurance that would have covered the travelling days - I did contact Snowcard to double check.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Avalanche Poodle, sorry - I don't understand the question (and the point about rescue) - are you quoting from a Snowcard policy doc? are you asking me?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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fatbob, SCGB offer options which all include off-piste. Should you happen to be a member of the RYA, their annual policy covers winter sports up to 17 days a year and has no off-piste exclusions (it also covers offshore sailing, unlike virtually every other annual travel insurance).
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I've been extremely happy with Snowcard for last few seasons (as posted elsewhere on this forum) they are not only very competitive but the cover really suited my needs oh and did I mention it, they paid out with absolutely no issues when I had my accident on a sH bash a while ago.
I normally top up with an annual Carre Neige although this year I am going with Austrian Alpine Club as it includes discounts for food/accom in Austrian huts.
I do need to double check level of cover as I'm planning quite a few weeks this year but hopefully Snowcard will work out 
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holidayloverxx, Sorry, my quote was from the Austrian health service information. As an EU citizen you would entitled to free care at a Gebietskrankenkasse hospital which appears to be a hospital contracted specifically to state care, but you would be charged a fee for each days stay. If you go to a private hospital you have to claim 80% of the costs back from the state after treatment and possibly the remainder paid for by the UK state. If you have insurance then they may just pay everything, I'm not sure if they then reclaim some costs.
I was just wondering what the breakdown of your costs were and for what part of treatment. I'm still trying to get my head round the complexity, but after being insured for most of my life and never claiming, the current fees for doing a season become astronomical and for an out of work ski bum too expensive. I do have rescue insurance for the mountains through the AAC though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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This might be a daft question but how do the insurance companies know how many days skiing you've done during the term of your cover prior to any claim you make?
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Avalanche Poodle, OK, I've got you. When I called the on-call doctor I had no idea what would happen next. He called an ambulance so I thought I'd better ring Snowcard. They told me to show the EHIC card to everyone and to call again when I got to hospital. The (private) ambulance took the EHIC details en route and took me to a private clinic in Radstadt for triage. When I got there I showed the EHIC again but was told as it was private everything would be chargeable. The next thing I knew I was in X-ray and the Doctor and I were discussing options. She wanted me to stay at the clinic (obviously) but thought that I might not get permission from the insurance - her previous experience of British insurance had not been good and they normally insisted on the patient transferring to the public hospital in Schladming. Her experience also that she could wait half a day for the insurance to make a decision. Anyway, she called Snowcard and explained the situation - I needed an operation if not immediately then certainly the next day; she didn't want me to be moved and I might have to wait for an op at Schladming. Snowcard called back 5 minutes later to agree that I could have the op at the clinic and stay for 5 nights until repatriation.
I never saw a bill, but the Doctor said the clinic bill would be about €5000. That would be made up of:
X-Ray x 3
CT Scan
pre-op blood tests etc
Surgeon (x 2) fees (I think the whole theatre staff (3?) would be covered in his fee, but it may have been on top)
Anaesthetists fee
Theatre supplies - metalwork & stuff
5 nights in-patient care in a private room
Lousy food
The clinic billed the insurance directly; I have no idea whether Snowcard made any claim against the Austrian healthcare system or the NHS. I don't know who paid for the ambulance - the EHIC may have covered it.
On top of that I had the repatriation costs - 3 seats on an EJ flight (£700+) and a private ambulance to the airport and then onwards to home, again no idea how much but Snowcard must have paid directly, or perhaps the clinic charged for the one to the airport because they arranged it.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Thanks very much for that info. makes sense with what I have researched. I am hoping that the worst scenario I would have to deal with would be a ski injury broken leg. As full insurance for the season would end up being almost £400, I am prepared to risk my credit card to pay for anything if a private hospital is the best option. I could always remain out there to recover if necessary. Wouldn't want to abandon my car.
As long as I have rescue insurance and car insurance I'm be happy (the bugs charged me £96 to extend car cover from 90 days to 112) 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Avalanche Poodle wrote: |
Thanks very much for that info. makes sense with what I have researched. I am hoping that the worst scenario I would have to deal with would be a ski injury broken leg. As full insurance for the season would end up being almost £400, I am prepared to risk my credit card to pay for anything if a private hospital is the best option. I could always remain out there to recover if necessary. Wouldn't want to abandon my car.
As long as I have rescue insurance and car insurance I'm be happy (the bugs charged me £96 to extend car cover from 90 days to 112) |
Seriously, if you were to be injured (e.g. broken leg) staying out there might not be the best option, unless you have people around you to look after you for a bit (weeks), do shopping, laundry (depending on where you have access to a washing machine), cooking etc. I couldn't believe how incapable I was while I was on crutches, non weight bearing. I had car repatriation on my vehicle breakdown cover - if you broke a leg toward the end of the season you'd have to stay on for weeks at extra cost till you could drive, or pay someone to come over and put them on your insurance temporarily to drive back.
on the cost front could break a leg and be plastered up and out in a day so hospital costs would be much less. It's only because I needed surgery an in-patient care that the cost was so high.
..but of course none of it is going to happen!!!
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
I couldn't believe how incapable I was while I was on crutches, non weight bearing.
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same here. I had a simple injury (pelvis fractured in two places, but not displaced) and treatment costs were very low (X ray, crutches and pain killers!) but I could do nothing for myself. It took 2 ambulancemen to get me back to my apartment and with paths covered with ice and snow, plus a set of difficult stairs, I couldn't get out under my own steam. I could cope OK indoors (small place, all on one level, including washing machine) but couldn't get out, e.g. to do any shopping. I stayed there for 3 weeks, because I had friends around, and when they had to go home the insurance paid for my sister and brother in law to fly out so they could drive me back. By then I could cope with walking icy paths to the car but didn't enjoy it. And that was a simple injury which just needed time to heal.
A ski injury broken leg is definitely not the worst you could have to cope with. Snowboarding friend broke a bone in her back in St Anton and was in a full body cast for three months. And there's worse than that, too. e.g. traumatic brain injury 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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A slight aside, my old house insurance only "allowed" the house to be unoccupied for 45 days. I changed to LV which allows 60 days, something to watch.
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Poster: A snowHead
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jbob, Good point, I wouldn't have thought of that. Thanks
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Avalanche Poodle, the more I think about it and pam ws experience, if I really didn't have the cash for insurance I would sell something. The aftermath of an injury can be more costly than the treatment
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Hi,
Wondering if I can jump on this. My employer provides insurance, but that policy doens't provide any coverage for off-piste this year. As a result, I'm well covered medically if something happens on the pistes, but not at all if off the pistes.
Last year I got around this with a Caree Neige, but this year I'm in Austria and that doesn't apply. I've had a look at the Austrian Alpine Club, and it looks idea, but only €10,000 of medical expenses are covered. This seems really low - I can see a broken bone going close to that, let alone something really nasty. For comparison, the medical cover for just about every other policy I've seen starts at £1,000,000.
Could anyone using the AAC insurnace please comment on this?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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The €10K limit would be for treatment in paying clinics; if you have a serious injury you will be taken to a regular hospital where your EHIC shold cover you in Austria. If you were outside Europe I'd say this cover was inadequate, within the area covered by EHIC it seems sensible.
From the AAC FAQ:
What is the procedure if I need hospital treatment abroad?
If you are normally resident within the European Economic Area (comprising the EU plus Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein and overseas French Dependencies) or Switzerland, it is essential to produce your European Health Insurance Card (EHIC) whenever being treated at a public hospital within another of these countries. This ensures that the cost is paid directly by intergovernmental agencies. Please note that the validity of an EHIC expires after 5 years, so check the expiry date of yours in good time before you depart.
AWS insurance covers other hospitalization costs up to a maximum stated in the AWS Leaflet, which might be incurred at private hospitals within the above countries or at all hospitals elsewhere. In such cases, UNIQA deals with invoices directly with the hospital finance department. Be advised that this maximum limit might not be sufficient in countries with expensive hospitals or where prolonged expensive treatment might be required.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| swiftoid wrote: |
| This might be a daft question but how do the insurance companies know how many days skiing you've done during the term of your cover prior to any claim you make? |
They ask you, you tell them. If you lie it's fraud, you're not covered and they may prosecute you... if they are suspicious they hire investigators, look at bank records, credit card transactions etc. If they think they could save tens of thousands of pounds they may well be happy to shell out a few thousand on an investigator and legal fees. Will they find out? No idea, but I don't plan to take that chance. My guess is that they would find out sooner or later.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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BASI are now doing competitive insurance for non-members - but they are very confused in their phone numbers and definitions !
When I asked for some clarification, they said we would have to be with a guide off piste - but that is not mentioned anywhere in their policy ..........
I suspect their on/off piste 'non-definition' springs from where BASI instructors are allowed to lead their charges under Members' policies as one is apparentlyrequired to end at the next ski lift. This is totally different from the wide definition in the FAQs !
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Scrumpy, that sounds rather like the kind of muddle I got from Dogtag.
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holidayloverxx, I'm staying at Ben and Ange's (Flangesax's Austrian Adventures) so I'm sure that they would wait on me hand and foot  I could always abseil from the balcony to avoid the stairs.
My usual vehicle breakdown cover wanted to load an additional £260ish on top of my normal premium if I stayed out longer. Balls to that, I'll just keep a local tow number handy, plus there is a Subaru garage only just down the road.
Actually, skiing is the least of my worries, I'll be ice climbing out there, much more potential for serious injury with that lol
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Quite pleased with my MPI Brokers quote £161. Annual Single Europe inc trips up to 60 days inc 60 days skiing per trip. Good cover inc off piste without guide, etc. Couldn't get this online, had to call, 60 days skiing added 25% loading. As I've 9 weeks skiing planned in 2 big trips that works out very reasonable per week. I'll probably take a European summer bike trip too.
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Claude B, MPI looks like the best all round deal from my recent research... I actually went with something a bit cheaper because I have AAC to cover touring and off piste, but having read the small print I think I'll switch to MPI when its time to renew. Was not aware it was possible to haggle over the phone, must try that!
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FAQ
