 Poster: A snowHead
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Looking at booking this area for a family holiday, not until Jan 2015 though.
Few questions from me.
Is this area good for families?
Good for beginners and moving on to the next level? Would like wide open slopes?
Price of eating out in resort as we will be going self catering.
Ski schools in the area, looking at booking AM only for 2-3 days
Nightlife but not to mental as the kids are 14 and 12.
Snow in Jan (18th) ish
Basic questions but good to know as we are in the planning stages.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Avoriaz would never be my choice, my family say I am far too biased against it. However I remember crowded, narrow runs with huge drops on each side and a ski school who did not properly supervise the children resulting in accidents and more minor mishaps. The ski school is probably fine these days but the runs I remember are not likely to have suddenly got wider!
In Jan snow is likely to be good lower down and if you are considering the Portes de Soliel area I prefer Morzine or Les Gets. However there are likely to be folks along soon who will give you other opinions.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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been to both and as your kids will be 14 and 12, I would also say Morzine or Les Gets - the main bowl at Les Gets is super for beginers - quite a few wide gentle slopes and for more advantegious - one of my favourite red run (do not remember the name at the moment) but it is trully great - steeper in some places, wide, few wide turns - a sporty pleasure ...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
Price of eating out in resort as we will be going self catering
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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"narrow runs with huge drops on each side"
Nooooooo!! You surely only find that sort of thing in the mountains don't you?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| winter2009 wrote: |
Good for beginners and moving on to the next level? Would like wide open slopes?
Ski schools in the area, looking at booking AM only for 2-3 days
Nightlife but not to mental as the kids are 14 and 12.
Snow in Jan (18th) ish . |
Les gets could be a better option. Plenty of self catering options in the village, slopes are perfect for beginners, and the village is busy enough for evening vibe, and lots of tree runs for snowy or cold windy days. I have previously been recommended BASS ski school in that area.
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I enjoyed Avoriaz. There are enough wide, easy runs. For ski school I'd use Evolution2 and not ESF. I'd say that you have to decide you priorities: ski in/ski out with plenty of snow in the resort (Avoriaz) vs better prices, more shops, restaurants etc but lower chances of snow in the vilage and the need to use a bus and/or a longer cable car ride to get to the skiing. I think that Avoriaz is better for families with smaller children.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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CaravanSkier may be right about picking Les Gets or Morzine in preference to Avoriaz.
Pretty much all runs out of Avoriaz are on the narrow side and can get a bit crowded.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| MrSteve wrote: |
CaravanSkier may be right about picking Les Gets or Morzine in preference to Avoriaz.
Pretty much all runs out of Avoriaz are on the narrow side and can get a bit crowded. |
But don't forget that mid Jan isn't the busiest time.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Narrow?
Wow, okay Proclou, Zore, Tetras are pretty wide, so is Mosettes and Prolays, oh and Blue de Lac and arare are not too bad either. That should keep your average beginner happy for a while.
Also if you nip over to Switzerland as you start to develop there are some really lovely wide reds over there that are great fun, and its harder to access Switzerland from Morzine.
I am obviously biased towards Avoriaz, but just thought I would put in my tuppence worth.
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| Quote: |
I remember crowded, narrow runs with huge drops on each side
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Really? I have memories of some of the nicest blue runs ever in Avoriaz!
I would think Avoriaz would be great for a family as its super easy to get to the slopes (ski in ski out so no carrying your kids skis or ona bus) and Avoriaz gives you easy access to the Swiss side which is a lot harder to reach if you stay in Morzine.
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You know it makes sense.
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kat.ryb, me too. My memories are of taking my nervous 2 weeker TO avoriaz (from chatel) as it was all much more calming over there. And catch the lift DOWN the wall and you have some simply enormous wide pistes on the swiss side. We loved the car free, ski road village too. I'd have said yes, def a good choice, but I've only been once and it was a while ago.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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The runs there aren't particularly narrow and it has a great selection of runs, though quite a few of these are reds or hard blues and it isn't the best begiiners area. I would reccommend Morzine as whilst it isn't as snow sure, the Morzine Le gets ski area has much nicer blues into the village and a beginner will get a lot more variety.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Avoriaz is great for really little ones, as it's traffic-free, and it is genuinely snow sure. It does have some tree-lined runs for snowy days down towards Les Linderets. I remember the piste-side restaurants as being pretty limited and the shopping as being similarly limited, although it does have a Carrefour Montagne. Some of the blues are wearyingly flat and some others do have alarming drop-offs.
Les Gets is far prettier and much nicer on snowy days, with lots of tree lined runs. It has more choice of places to eat and some nightlife. Our group runs from kids through timid intermediates to a confident red run skier and we all found some runs we really loved. The lift system is pretty slow and queues develop but that shouldn't be so much of a problem in late January. It is is not anywhere near as snow sure as Avoriaz so worried watching of webcams is not unlikely.
I've been to both, enjoyed both and both have real merits, but for choice I prefer Les Gets.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Genuinely struggling to think of narrow blues- coming down into lindarets from Chaux Fleurie has one dodgy bit for boarders but skiers are fine.
I would say Avoriaz is ideal and small enough for 12&14yr olds to wander about and have a bit of freedom
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Les Gets is a gamble for snow early season and Avoriaz is ugly as sin, I would widen my search if I was you.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I don't know about those particular ones, but my husband managed to go under one at I *think* LDA years ago. No harm done the 'sheer drop' wasn't that sheer and he just climbed back up.
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Avoriaz does lots of stuff for kids in the evenings too. An area is closed off for sledging, they have a carnival type parade one night and I've also see evening where hundreds of Chinese lanterns are let off. There's now an ice rink and carousel too. Also the Aquariaz spa and pool opened this year.
For food, there's also the two Sherpa supermarkets as well as the carrefour.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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We have done avoriaz the week you'd be going for the last 2 years and thank god we did vs morzine/les gets.
Access to the wider PDS is far easier.
Snow cover is so much better - last year (bumper year) morzine was sheet ice for the lower half. Les Gets was better but still hard pack.
Avoriaz is avoided by closet snobs who describe it as ugly/soulless/lack of après. To these people please keep staying away as the resort even quieter without you and we can go enjoy the powder whilst you're still faffing about with buses or walking to get up the mountains.
Price of eating out - comparable to the uk depending on what you choose to eat. We self cater and normally only have 2 evening meals out from 7.
There's bars/pubs if you want them but the idiots getting leathered seem to go elsewhere.
Ski school - avoriaz alpine ski school. From our experience we can vouch for Jean Marie and Pierre being top notch.
There are SOME narrow runs with steep drop offs but then there are plenty without.
I'm sure Les Gets/Morzine are far better later in the season than we've seen them but even the other half who was staunchly against doing blacks/off piste/too steep remarked how she couldn't do a week in either without getting bored of the skiing.
If you do go Avoriaz try to stay nearer the carrefour as the other little supermarket near the entrance station is rubbish in comparison.
I'll get some popcorn now and await my bashing for daring to talk down Morzine/Les Gets.
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SiPieFace, just how do you think the resort could make the drops 'a little more gentle' and where else do you think they could put the lift pylons?  This is a natural environment, they're working with what they've got!
I don't recall Avoriaz having any more terrifying drop off runs than any other resort and it is a very family friendly resort.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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SiPieFace, I've never seen a chairlift with anything other than a central pylon design as shown in your picture, I don't think there is a lift which has goalpost style supports. Re. the barrier, if they put a more substantial i.e. solid barrier there it would cause more injuries than it would prevent if people hit it. The netting system will 'give' and provide a cushioned landing on impact, also I'd be very surprised if it wasn't tethered along the bottom so very doubtful anyone could slip under it.
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| sarah wrote: |
| SiPieFace, I've never seen a chairlift with anything other than a central pylon design as shown in your picture, I don't think there is a lift which has goalpost style supports. Re. the barrier, if they put a more substantial i.e. solid barrier there it would cause more injuries than it would prevent if people hit it. The netting system will 'give' and provide a cushioned landing on impact, also I'd be very surprised if it wasn't tethered along the bottom so very doubtful anyone could slip under it. |
Wow, this is getting way more technical than I expected it to when the original question was about Avoriaz. But OK, putting my Architects hat on....a goal post arrangement it eminently feasible and very simple to design and construct. It would have left the transition clear of obstruction and therefore, I'd argue, would have been a better solution than the obvious and lazy placing of the supports directly in the centre of a busy (admittedly not in that picture) and narrow transition with a huge drop to one side. Simply because you've not seen one before doesn't mean it doesn't exist or it can't be constructed. If we took the line "we haven't seen one so it can't be done" we'd all still be living caves.
As for the fencing I'd suggest that a more solid and robust continuous structure would be the final (catch all/last chance) layer of a multi-layered arrangement, the first of which could well be a layer of netting so as to cushion the impact. But the current netting-only fence is such a "if you go off here you're a gonner" type of arrangement that I feel there needs to be something more robust as a backup to ensure you don't go off. Ultimately, I'd rather break a bone or two than try and do a 'Superman' off the edge. But maybe it's just me though.
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You know it makes sense.
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It's probably not as steep off the edge as you might think, and if it IS then those fences tend to be sturdier than they look. The one my hubbie went under was really just there to corral lift queue and although it looked like a drop it was just a steep slope on the other side. The one I hit in a whiteout was more than capable of holding me. Think about the fences that corral racers in the downhill/GS races, they get hit at 100kmh+ and are fine, correctly cushioning and bouncing back the racer.
That said I get it, I do remember being a nervous intermediate and I'm sure it won't matter what we say. When you go back in a few years you'll wonder why those runs seemed worrying at all, evidently kat.ryb and I swished through them without even noticing! (My nervy beginner at the time was all about steepness, edges/people didn't bother him)
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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If the engineers say build this, put it there, I'm inclined to go with that.
What are the stats on people dying after plunging through barriers? Very, very few I'd imagine, they are a lot stronger than they look.
If drops scare the poo-poo out of you maybe take up cross country skiing?
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Poster: A snowHead
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SiPieFace, I'm not saying it can't be done but I am saying I'm pretty sure the design you describe doesn't currently exist. The netting arrangement must work or they would do something else, it's the same stuff they use on race slopes so it must be pretty tough, and also as I mentioned it must be tethered along the bottom too so you couldn't go under.
My main point was that I couldn't remember Avoriaz being any worse than any other resort really in terms of these steep drop offs.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
What are the stats on people dying after plunging through barriers?
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good question. A resort which allowed too many people to plunge off the piste to a grisly death wouldn't do too well, I'd say.
Nadenoodlee, don't be sarky about XC skiing - it's harder than it looks, you know. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Avoriaz isn't gonna win any prizes for the prettiest resort but its skiing is really good. There are a few narrow path like runs but they aren't that steep. There are two ways through the middle of avoriaz and you don't have to use the run photographed above, which I admit can be scary if cut up but is otherwise easy. It seems absurd to worry about a giant pylon; you should be able to ski around it! The runs above the village are really good and wide as are ones down to Lindarets.
The Morzine/Le Gets side does get hit badly if the snow is poor but in good conditions it is amazing and the long, steep red runs from the top of the mountains are epic.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I find Avoriaz rather attractive imyself.
Goal post style lifts do exist, many drag lifts (lower weight to carry clearly) were of that style and I have seen one enormous cable car like that, which would clearly disprove any idea that the design can't tolerate high loads.
But I suspect the designers just felt it wasn't such a big deal. If shep is lurking around, isn't this one a relatively recent replacement for one that ran rather more to the side of the piste?
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FAQ
The only real downside to mountains 
rather be somewhere that had less terrifying drops. The drops were way bigger than I'd been led to believe. As far as the support columns are concerned they could easily have created a goal post arrangement spanning from either side of the transition. An easy and simple solution giving a wholly clear transition, one side could even have provided support for an improved barrier system.... 