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Wrist protectors. Yay or nay

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Richard_Sideways wrote:
dennisp wrote:
Recommendations for instructors in Morzine or Avoriaz please!


Not used them myself, but know people who've used Mint Snowboarding before and rated them. Maybe worth taking a private lesson, and make sure that whoever you use that they know exactly what your good lady wants from the lesson, i.e. confidence building and technique. Avoid ESF as always.

Cat-track riding comes from being able to transition the board from edge to edge effectively, keeping the knees soft and controlling speed.


Thanks Richard, I will check them out


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Sun 2-02-14 13:12; edited 1 time in total
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
dennisp,I've always said that snowboarding is just as much about confidence as technique. If you don't think you can make the techniques you've learned stick when you want them, then you won't be able to used them reliably. I think your good lady would benefit hugely from some competant tution and it'd bring her riding on leaps and bounds.

Which kinda brings us back around to the armor issue. If you have confidence in your riding ability, you don't tend to use as much armor. Your skills and confidence are your primary safety, your armor is secondary safety. The former keeps you out of trouble, the latter helps you if you get into trouble. Prevention is better than cure, right?
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Quote:

that's a commonly touted urban myth that is wrong on both counts.

1. The wrist is made up of lots of bones. Some of them are very nasty to break because they have a precarious blood supply (scaphoid) and a fracture can easily lead to disablement.
2. The bones in the wrist are small and puny and more likely to fracure than the relatively big bones in your arm.

So assuming wrist protectors do work in the way alleged i.e. that they transfer forces up the arm, then they are certainly worthwhile. You could have a more interesting debate about whether or not they do just that. FWIW I think they do.

To the OP - get all the armour you can. Wrists, knees, backside and helmet. It is all worthwhile.


+1, all of this.
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polo99 wrote:
Richard_Sideways wrote:
Avoid ESF as always.

Why Puzzled


Because the ESF attitude to snowboarding tuition is rooted so far in the past it's practically a caricature. You're much better off finding a dedicated local school who specialise in snowboarding rather than being treated like second class citizens. I've witnessed first hand the fall-out of ESFs tuition and seen them turn a perfectly good beginner who had a grasp of the basics into a shambling wreck who couldn't turn and was ready to quit in just three morning lessons. And I've seen that same wreck transformed back again and progress to confident blue and easy red riding in just two lessons from a competant specialist instructor.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
polo99 wrote:
Richard_Sideways wrote:


Avoid ESF as always.
.


Why Puzzled


Noooooooo! Shocked
Don't ask!!! just search ESF on the forum if you really must..

When I learnt I wore wrist guards, on a friends advice, a tour rep who saw many broken wrists every seasons. Started with the short Dakine, metal strip in palm ones. Now have flexible ones integrated in the back of my Burton Impact gloves. However I have learnt to fall now, and it's been a while since I've felt the wrist guards have been useful. I don't do park or anything too fancy anyway. So I'll probably not bother next season and use my more lightweight gloves.

Impact shorts: would have been nice in the early days! I remember a few very painful falls. But I never bothered and now probably won't. I do ctahc the occasional heel edge but not often enough to have me worried.

Knee pads: That I wear and always will I think. Catching a toe edge on hard pack/ice, is so painful I just don't want to experience that again when it's so easily avoided. I have bought some low profile / high density foam volleyball pads from Decathlon. They're cheap and very comfortable. And keep your knees warm when you stop by the side of the piste. Smile
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Kruisler wrote:
...
..Knee pads: That I wear and always will I think. Catching a toe edge on hard pack/ice, is so painful I just don't want to experience that again when it's so easily avoided....


That sounds like a simple technique problem which could be overcome by a little tuition or practice.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
foxtrotzulu wrote:
Definitely. If they don't use them, then Lemsip will be the only remaining option.


Laughing

unless youre a woman wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I know 3 people who have broken their wrists, 2 snowboarding and one slipping in a nightclub... all three have had the movement of their wrists permanently restricted (not by much, but still) eve thopugh the injury is fully healed. to do with the complex nature of the joint... played rugby for 20 years, seen a lot of broken arms and collarbones... none resulting in permanent restriction of movement.
I know that is just anecdotal, but i would personally rather break my arm than my wrist.
For beginners, first 3-4 weeks crash pants, wristguards and helmets will just make your trip much more pleasurable... the more you can lesson the knocks and bruises the more you'll enjoy it Smile
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I think I have concluded that I will get wrist protectors for all 3 (hubby and boys). I think I will get knee pads and a bum pad for my youngest as he tends to feel pain and cold more. I think if I told hubby and oldest to wear knee pads I would probably get the usual roll of eyes and accusation of wrapping them in cotton wool. What I love though is 9/10 I always get to say I told you so. So I might just take them for them when they are moaning on day 2 of their pains and I have the solution!

Yes I am smug Laughing
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Oh also- impact shorts- could these be cyclist shorts type? Or is it something different?
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polo99 wrote:
Oh also- impact shorts- could these be cyclist shorts type? Or is it something different?


no they would be snowboard specific ones like these;

linky
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Can you hire such pants?
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
polo99, never seen them for rental, but ebay sells versions of them for £10-£15 per pair. Search "Snowboard impact shorts"
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

Because the ESF attitude to snowboarding tuition is rooted so far in the past it's practically a caricature.

+1. Having seen the standard of tuition (and instructors' actual boarding skills) in Canada, I wouldn't go anywhere near the ESF for anything snowboard-related. They're a joke.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I ordered the Dakine ones off Amazon. My 12 year old had her first boarding lesson on Sunday; they were shown and told and made to practice the safe way to fall but instinct took over and I did see her fall onto her hands a couple of times; thankfully at very slow speed so not much of an impact.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Good move Shimmy. Did your lass enjoy herself?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
rogg, she did, thanks; going back tonight Toofy Grin

We had a load of stuff going on last year and we actually decided to have some Winter sun in the Canaries rather than a ski hol as we just didnt have the energy to ski; I'm soooooooooooooooo looking forward to our trip!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Richard_Sideways, thanks Richard ill have a look
Lizzard, I think it will probably be with newgen. Is this esf everywhere or just 3v?
Shimmy Alcott, my kids did an hour and half group less on then one hour private and you are right they do tend to put their hands out without thinking. After the first lesson my son had went forward a couple times and was complaining they were sore. He is they type who would have a full arm cast on a paper cut if he could Laughing so he will deco be getting them regardless now lol Very Happy
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polo99, answering for Lizzard here, but there are good indepedent snowboard instruction specialists at every resort - NewGen is a good example, ask here if you need advice and you'll probably get a recommendation.

ESF probably have some competant snowboard instructors somewhere, but with the chance you'll hit some oaf whos 'drawn the short straw that day to take the beginner snowboarders out' why risk it. Go with someone dedicated to the sport and a bit of passion for teaching it.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
polo99, so far my daughter has been in two group lessons, made up of two kids Laughing and theres only two in the class because I take her friend aswell Laughing otherwise it would be one on one! Always best to get in early...before most normal people start thinking about snow.
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Quote:

Can you hire such pants?



Rental pants? Boke.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Im a pretty good boarder now but still choose to wear them. I can fall properly but im taking no chances and feel a lot more confident when wearing them. For the sake of a bit of cash - you can get pretty comfy ones that fit nicely in your gloves, or even buy them built into gloves. Dont listen to all the "ohh dont worry about them, they do more harm than good" - thats garbage. Any protection is better than none - theres enough studies and articles proving that they do work.

Ive had a few uncontrolable falls where ive got up thinking "good job i was wearing them" - plus whats cooler a boarder with wrist guards or a too cool boarder in a sling sat at the hotel watching foreign TV
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Boardfluff wrote:
.....- thats garbage. Any protection is better than none - theres enough studies and articles proving that they do work.
(sic)

If something did not reduce rider risk it would not be "protection", so your argument is circular.

On the question of if these specific accessories are effective protection, the evidence as summarized here: http://www.ski-injury.com/faq/snowboard_faq
is as already suggested. I'd love to see contradictory evidence if you have it.
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polo99, everywhere. We watched them doing the boardercross in 2Alpes during theannual national instructor championship thing. It was risible.
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Pretty full on lesson at the slope tonight...will be searching for knee pads tomorrow...not heavy falls, just lots of them!! Good to see her out in the fresh air on a dark Autumn evening, working hard while I observed with a beer Toofy Grin
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Had a bit of a dilemma yesterday, first snow session back on a board since my first forays boarding back in the spring, got to Tamworth only to find I'd only packed one of my new flexmeters rolling eyes now do you wear what you have with you or not bother!? Puzzled
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Boardfluff wrote:


Ive had a few uncontrolable falls where ive got up thinking "good job i was wearing them" - plus whats cooler a boarder with wrist guards or a too cool boarder in a sling sat at the hotel watching foreign TV


Yes that's very true. I'm not going to give them the option, especially when it's me paying for the holiday. It will be the same as helmets. You either wear them or don't bother coming!
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
philwig, I've seen those pages before - really useful
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:
one in every 100 boarders on the slopes on any one day will sustain a wrist fracture.


They must be using Lemsip Max Toofy Grin
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Never used wrist guards, broken the same wrist on two separate occasions boarding. You would think I would start wearing them, but I don't plan too. Although for kids, I would say the more safety equipment the better. At lease when I broke my wrist, my mates just all left me to get drunk in the day, but if one of your kids do it, it's not just going to their holiday, it's going to ruin yours too, plus no-one wants to be waiting around at the doctors, where you don't really know what they're saying! The kids will have plenty of time (if they truly want to carry on with snowboarding) to learn to fall properly (unlike me apparently) and also they will learn their own limits in terms of speed and technique. Until they have a real grasp on that, I'd have them wearing wrist guards for sure. Just my opinion though...
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I think yes. I've never worn them, and for all but the first week of my snowboarding career I don't think I've needed them, but in that first week my wrists and forearms got absolutely pummelled. I was probably lucky not to break any bones but even though I didn't it took a long time before they felt right again.

I have heard that while they definitely protect the wrists, they can transfer stress further up the forearm and increase the risk of a break there, but I don't know whether that's true or not.

Very few snowboarders use or recommend knee protectors but I say they're worth considering. In my second week conditions were very icy and I took a few hard falls (all at low speed on near flats) straight on the knees and it was absolute agony - I still had pain and numb areas in them months later. Many snowboarders never hit their knees at all but if you're minded to be cautious then it's probably a good idea to get some. Knees are a bit special - they damage easily and unlike elbows and wrists you need them for walking on. Most people's knees deteriorate with age anyway so it's wise to look after them.

Beginners will do a lot of kneeling on the piste in any case and knee guards will make that less cold/uncomfortable. I don't think hard ones are necessary - soft ones are easier to put on, more comfortable to wear and won't impair movement at all.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'm a week into the sport now, and I'm sure looking at the date of the majority of the thread responses you'd have bought the wrist guards for the kids and worn them out by now, but just wanted to say that this was interesting to read as a newbie as I was wondering the same thing, but a bit worried that protection is ridiculed as it is in other extreme sports, although that being said I was going to buy some stuff anyway as none would tell that I'm wearing it under the baggy pants and jacket anyway. But good to know all the same. Cheers
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
lukeallington wrote:
...that protection is ridiculed as it is in other extreme sports ...

That's not true for this sport, or extreme sports (snowboarding as practiced by the vast majority of people is not in the least "extreme").

If you want to ride roped up on the bunny hill then you may receive a little ridicule, but that is for the failure to deal appropriately with the risk of crevasses on a bunny hill, not the "protection" afforded by a rope when used in the right place, which is undeniable.

By analogy you'd be safer wearing all that body armour when walking to the supermarket, but you'd probably receive some ridicule from your fellow pedestrians. You should not of course let that affect your attitude to your own safety: it's your personal choice.
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As philwig says (basically) 'Each to their own'. My safety kit extends to wrist guards, which I rarely wear these days, and a pair of impact shorts, which I only wear if I know i'm going in the park, not that not having them stops me if the mood takes me.
I personally believe that the best 'armor' is the kind that stops you needing the physical protection - an accurate understanding and confidence in your own ability. Not saying don't push your riding, but do it in a way so you know that you can come back from that edge in control whenever you want to.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Been boarding for 10 years I always wear and would never not wear:
Wrist guards - in extreme fall its hard to not instictivly put your arms out - its inbuilt protection to your face
Knee pads - if nothing else, while waiting for the wife to catch up, its way more comfotable kneeling than standing holding an edge Happy
Padded shorts - slip on ice and bruise your coxix then you'll be swearing everythime you get on a lift for the rest of the week
Helmet - its where my brain is kept and I need that!
Artciluate spine armour - always thoguht this may be overkill untill this year, untill I got 'bounced' by a lump in the powder straihgt into a piste marker and did 270 degree summersault off the 3 ft snow bank landing flat on my back onto ice hard piste. Barely fealt anything and popped up and rode away much to the astonishment of the two portly german gentleman skiers I landed in front off Toofy Grin

Its not going to protect me from eveything or make me inviciable but it all helps, I realised I am too old to bounce like I used too. Sometimes I do get hot, but the only pain I have from throwing myself about all over the mountain at the end of the week is in my muscles and thats good pain.... Twisted Evil

I'd say waer it all, as its all remarkkably cheap these days
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Quote:

Experienced riders prefer the rigidity that a hard boot provides.


Dude just lost all credibility.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
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monkey, totally agree. Suggestion wrist guards might transfer injury to another bit of the arm dealt with in philwig's link to Ski-Injury.com.
Definitely not proven, and probably wrong.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
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nay.


On the orther hand... yay.
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+1 for Flexmeters
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