 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Yoda wrote: |
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What I can't sort out is why you say don't traverse
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because it serves no useful purpose and just causes congestion for other users and maybe an emotional factor for you as you "wait" to make your next turn. control speed by "finishing" one turn properly - ie even going back uphill a bit if you wish - and then immediately link into the next by turning downhill again. The rhythm and "rebound" energy you get from one turn will then actually help with the next. |
As a recently graduated nervous person and now nervous person escort I have to disagree - when you are having a nerve racking time the traverse gives you a vital break and chance to relax for 5 seconds. Turning uphill is not always an option - seriously how often do you do it on your standard congested blue run in popular european resorts?
I can't see that there is any massive problem with people doing some speed scrubbing skidded traverses when they feel the need. I still do it if I'm feeling lazy/need to wait for someone to move out of my way/want to shed speed for a ridge or similar...I admit it is probably better for your technique to only ski on slopes where you don't feel the need to do this on every turn when you are practicing but I think newskier is at the point where that slope is, erm, flat (sorry newskier - no offence meant!)
aj xx
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I don't think this is an issue of technique at all. One part of skiing is technique but the other is attitude, what's in your head. I realised early in my learning that I was too worried about speed and falling, so I had been trying not to ski rather than trying to ski. As Ssh and Frosty said above, you need more speed, the whole point is to go down the slope. I'm not saying this is easy but you need to push the speed that you're comfortable with. The advice above about finding a short steeper pitch with a safe runoutto get used to moving faster was very good advice, in my opinion. It's a bit like learning to drive a car. 10 mph is scary at first but you get used to it
Anyway, enjoying it is the important bit.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| NewSkier wrote: |
| What I can't sort out is why you say don't traverse - in Serbia I was told to use as much of the width of the slope as I could, bending knees/ankles while turning in the softer snow towards the sides and then to travel standing up, with skis parallel, in a straight line across, or slightly descending, depending on whether I wanted to decrease or increase speed. My trouble is that when the slope's a bit steeper, I don't seem able to get the turn round far enough to travel anything but diagonally down & that means increasing speed, and so the whole journey across becomes a continued effort to keep turning, and becomes a snowploughed skid. |
The real issue with traversing while making ski turns is that you bleed off all of the energy from one turn when you stop your turn in a traverse. Then, to start the next turn, you have to make muscle effort to move your body and skis to get the next turn started.
When you instead link the turns, the forces from the previous turn become the energy necessary to start the following turn, dramatically reducing the effort needed while simultaneously linking your turns smoothly and allowing more control of your path down the slope.
So, don't traverse.
Except when you're traversing, as Yoda points out from easiski's pet traversing subject.
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And was the question (and answer) about traversing perhaps a slight diversion from Newskier's main issue, which seems to be that he/she is unable to actually turn out of the fall line, and ends up doing a sort of diagonal sideslip across and down the hill. Have I understood that bit correctly?
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Yoda, interesting question...
Further, I think many mid-level skiers struggle with having their skis point straight down the hill in the belly of the turn. This is one key to advancing in skill level; getting comfortable with the speed-up in the fall line and the slow down coming out of it. Once a skier gets comfortable allowing the skis to stay in the fall line a moment, they can much more easily learn to round their turns and not simply pivot them as quickly as they can so as to stay out of the fall line completely. Ull, you're right on! Getting comfortable with the natural state of skis (sliding forward along their length) is very important, and finding a way to do it that isn't threatening is the quickest way to comfort about that.
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| Quote: |
Once a skier gets comfortable allowing the skis to stay in the fall line a moment, they can much more easily learn to round their turns
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or is it the other way round? only when you learn to trust your and your skis' ability to hold an edge and bring you round in a nice controlled arc are you willing to take the fall line?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ssh, ssh, You make it sound so easy. 15 weeks and I think I am perhaps just about understanding this.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Frosty the Snowman wrote: |
| ssh, ssh, You make it sound so easy. 15 weeks and I think I am perhaps just about understanding this. |
Simple, yes. Easy, no. Like most sports, it's at least 90% mental. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
it's at least 90% mental
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ssh, Well I should be good at in then 
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You know it makes sense.
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I dont really understand all the technicalities of skiing but I am with a.j., on this.
New Skier describes the piste as being icy and the instructor going across to the edges of the piste to turn. Now maybe advanced skiers can keep a continously turning on icy pistes but many of us find a traverse useful to find the best patches of snow to turn. It might not be optimal technique but its what a lot of us have to resort to.
I think if NewSkier wants to pracitxe continous turning she may find less icy slopes easier.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I agree - as folks here know I had one day where the ice was diabolical and the ski's just didn't cut in at all. I know that more than usual I kept traversing until I found the odd patch of less frozen snow and then consciously turned exactly on it (they weren't very big patches and few and far between that day) - it did have the advantage that I had to look where I was going more and this did mean that I stopped looking at my feet. I don't know if I'm doing it in the video very much, but it was identified by my instructor as something I should work on not doing (i.e. looking at my feet)
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Poster: A snowHead
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There may be a teeny semantic problem here. As far as I am concerned "traversing" is a specifically defined skill and involves travelling across a slope essentially on your edges. Moving across/down diagonally by means of "slip sliding" in some form is NOT traversing but is a perfectly acceptable way of seeking out a nice bit of soft snow to turn on if you are on an icy slope and not sure of your (or your skis') ability to "cut it" on the hard stuff.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Megamum and T Bar, looking for snow to turn on is, as Yoda notes, different from stopping one turn, traversing across the hill on your edges, and then starting a new turn. If you're skiing, move in the direction that you want to go and keep your energy moving downhill.
BTW, I usually find that the best snow is on the sides of the trails where most people don't ski. Linking shorter turns down the edge can be a great way to keep skiing and finding better snow.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ssh, how true! but don't tell anyone.. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Yoda wrote: |
| There may be a teeny semantic problem here. As far as I am concerned "traversing" is a specifically defined skill and involves travelling across a slope essentially on your edges. |
Sorry - my sloppy terminology I guess - I just mean to travel in a straight line without attempting to turn, be it holding your edge or not. My point holds for both though - true traversing as you define it is a lovely breather at times (although yes it does mean the next turn takes more effort) and the slip sliding version where you are just waiting out for a spot that looks 'right' or for the fear of death to wane offers many of the same benefits.
I have no idea what it does to your long term skiing but I can more than understand peoples desire to do it and I don't think they should think it an awful and terminal fault - it's a stage many people go through, right? Or is it just me and my friends 
aj xx
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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This has maybe already been mentioned, but 1.25, did you know someone tried to hit you with the button lift?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| ssh wrote: |
it's an indication to me that they are in terrain and/or conditions above their ability. ...... Better to develop proper skills by spending a high enough percentage of ski time on terrain that is helping you improve rather than on terrain that overwhelms your senses. |
I couldn't agree more. I went a couple of times on my own to the indoor slope at Cas & stayed on the lower, less steep half to try to get the technique sorted out without fear getting in the way, as I am just surviving the trip down the upper part, not skiing it - but why does this make me feel like I am failing? Because I know if I told friends they'd tell me to get back up to starting from the top! The only trouble is that although the confidence is definitely growing on the lower part and I think the technique is improving too, I still have the notion that skiing down the top part will be no better, so am fearful of trying.
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| ssh wrote: |
| Might I suggest that it's OK as a defensive and survival technique, but one that should indicate that it's time to back down a bit on the slope difficulty and play with some of your technique and skills in order to increase them to make that terrain and those conditions more to your comfort? |
As a former (and sometimes occasionally still) traverser I slightly disagree here - it may not indicate a lack of technique and skill, but a mental problem. In which case backing off the difficulty won't necessarily help. I would suggest that people for whom skiing is mostly a mental game can't progress to more difficult terrain and conditions without some degree of trepidation and that might be expressed in traversing until the head catches up with the physical skills already learned. Moreover, whilst you have some degree of choice over terrain, you don't necessarily have any choice about conditions, you just have to deal one way or another.
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You know it makes sense.
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I agree in principal ssh about backing off the difficult but for some people early in their ski career there are are almost no slopes that don't have a single scary bit on them - even the nursery slopes (thats what I tried to say in my first post). Also as eng_ch says sometimes you just have a mental block - then you might do 10 fine turns, then have to have a 'rest' and do a bit of traversing. If those people stayed were they were totally comfortable you'd never leave the hotel!
I agree that it's not ideal, can form bad habits etc etc, just trying to say it's also normal and not some big no no to do it when you first start/when overfaced - the early posts seemed to be imply people weren't 'skiing' unless they were making wonderful linked turns, which is, to be frank, elitist tosh.
aj xx
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Perhaps not elitist, just not wanting peeps to fall into "comfort zones" or "bad habits" which they later have to unlearn.
Even at higher levels we have to work hard to not having a "dead spot" in any point in the turn, I find that folk who cling onto a traverse have a far harder time eliminating it when they are trying to venture into new terrain (eg: steeps, bumps etc.).
I have taught countless lessons where someone would traverse to the very edges of the bumps, and then turn because they had run out of room. Which would indicate it was more of a mental thing, plus, they put themselves in so much danger as other slope users come by.
Try and live by this mantra: Good skiing should be about never being static at any point in the turn, flow down the fall line.
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Poster: A snowHead
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a.j. and eng_ch, I think that backing down helps with the mental part, because you gain confidence ("I think I can... I know I can!"). Also, if you get concerned or frightened, stop. Don't keep skiing across the hill. Instead, stop, gather yourself, plan a few turns, and start again. A traverse is effectively a stop in terms of your skiing, but you keep moving in a way that's unlikely to grant you a mental reprieve.
| veeeight wrote: |
| Try and live by this mantra: Good skiing should be about never being static at any point in the turn, flow down the fall line. |
Awesome! That's it![/quote]
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Yoda, good to know you understand - hope the bruises have healed!
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I think we had best agree to disagree I see skiing as a fun holiday activity and have no real concern for how well one does it or how fast they progress, just that people don't feel too much pressure and have a good time - if I viewed it as a sport I'd probably see your points more easily.
aj xx
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yes, a fun holiday. The thing is that I think I would have more fun if I could confidently get down all the slopes that I wish to do using reasonable (Oooo..must stop myself nearly said 'style')...err re-phrase........get down all slopes using that wonderful swish, swish side to side technique that many folks seem to use. The trouble is that requires some affinity with the fall line and at the moment that, for me, is still rather off-putting. As I've said many times before I can see me in my minds eye doing it and can see the technique that has to be deployed to achieve it, but the minds eye doesn't seem able to convince my brain and feet that it is a good idea to put it all into practice.
Maybe I ought to go back to doing just a little bit of the hill at the bottom and see if I can go with the fall line for a short distance and then gradually work up the hill.
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a.j., if I didn't view skiing as a fun holiday activity I wouldn't be doing it But for me a huge part of the "fun" is trying to do it to the best of my ability - and reaping the emotional rewards on those occasions when it does all come together. If I can't inspire you with my mumblings doesn't this type of thing do anything for you?
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ah see that might be the problem, I'm _reaaalllly_ lazy, best of my ability sounds far too much like hard work 
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ah but when you get to 900 you realise that life is too short to not do things that way....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
Mumblings they are not.
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It's the Genepi (sp)
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FAQ
(old joke 
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